Any 50 Trim TIII's Out there?

[Directconnection]

Originally Posted by bansheenut420

I dont want to clutter up his thread with my stuff, so you can read about it here.
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=30546
The holset just flows so much that we have to tighen our arp studs to "jackson racing" standards. 100 ft/lbs. lmfao

ahh.. I read your thread here, too.

What's it like vs the 50trim? What rpm does full boost come on at?

[bansheenut420]

Are you asking me? I have never had a 50trim. Just the crappy s70 and the stocker. The holset is no more laggy than the s70 was.

[Pat]

I'm not knocking the holsets...I'm interested in learning more about them and possibly trying one, but I have yet to see any real results to compare to what a "typical" t3/t4 has done on a T-III. I'm very interested in see what the power curve looks like, not just the peak number.

The only holset powered T-III I remember seeing results from was when Wallace tried one on his Spirit, which slowed him down. I don't remember what turbo it was or what the problem ended up being, but I seem to recall him suck in the mid 12's after making the switch.

[rx2mazda]

You can drive mine at Cecil Pat

Honestly, I loved my 50trim! But, I destroyed it and I wanted to try something different and Holset looked(for the price)to be a good option. I also was debating the gt3076 and Precision SC but it would have cost me a lot more and one was still JB turbos. The HE351CW has a comparable turbine(9cm=.65a/r)and a compressor that flows 60lbs/min. "Shadow" put down 480whp with the same turbo on a 8valve and KClarry put down 435whp in a hybrid motor same turbo. IIRC Wallace used the HX-40 in a Bullseye .55a/r housing, Spooled like crazy but choked the turbo big time on the top. I think I am going to still rebuild my 50trim and make it a super50 just incase I need it in the future.

[bansheenut420]

Originally Posted by Pat

I'm not knocking the holsets...I'm interested in learning more about them and possibly trying one, but I have yet to see any real results to compare to what a "typical" t3/t4 has done on a T-III. I'm very interested in see what the power curve looks like, not just the peak number.

The only holset powered T-III I remember seeing results from was when Wallace tried one on his Spirit, which slowed him down. I don't remember what turbo it was or what the problem ended up being, but I seem to recall him suck in the mid 12's after making the switch.

Wallace was running 12.2@118 with the holset. The housing was a BEP.55 a/r. But, from what he told me he also had a blown HG plus a few other issues. Lots of dsm guys have made 500whp on the BEP .55 housing. One has even made 602 awhp on the same setup I am using, with a ported turbine housing and mine is WAY ported. I lost a bit of spool, but gained it back and more up top. And I also, in no way hope anything I have said about the hybrids were taken in offence. They are good, proven turbos. I just didnt want to go that route. I was about to, and just decided I wanted somthing different. Wallace has gone faster on a hybrid then he got out of his holset.

Originally Posted by rx2mazda

You can drive mine at Cecil Pat

Honestly, I loved my 50trim! But, I destroyed it and I wanted to try something different and Holset looked(for the price)to be a good option. I also was debating the gt3076 and Precision SC but it would have cost me a lot more and one was still JB turbos. The HE351CW has a comparable turbine(9cm=.65a/r)and a compressor that flows 60lbs/min. "Shadow" put down 480whp with the same turbo on a 8valve and KClarry put down 435whp in a hybrid motor same turbo. IIRC Wallace used the HX-40 in a Bullseye .55a/r housing, Spooled like crazy but choked the turbo big time on the top. I think I am going to still rebuild my 50trim and make it a super50 just incase I need it in the future.

Both Wallace and I have ported our housings. He estimates his is now much much closer to .70 a/r. Mine is also huge as well, or atlest in comparason. I am not sure what a/r its close to. But, its not the same housing it was when I gave it to Ondonti to port. I am really happy with how it turned out. Its never choked off on me. And my HG can prove that. lmfao. It didnt choke even when the boost wasnt supposed to go to 35psi. lol
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/a...ift_190795.htm

[Pat]

Originally Posted by bansheenut420

And I also, in no way hope anything I have said about the hybrids were taken in offence.

Don't be silly...not at all. I've been curious about the holsets for a while, but my current hybrid has been holding together fine so I haven't made any switches. Once someone dyno's one on a T-III, I'd really like to see it. I want to see what the area under the curve looks like compared to a hybrid.

Peak numbers are great, but I've beaten quite a few cars that made a lot more peak HP than me. Wide powerbands rock.

[Pat]

Originally Posted by rx2mazda

You can drive mine at Cecil Pat

Honestly, I loved my 50trim! But, I destroyed it and I wanted to try something different and Holset looked(for the price)to be a good option. I also was debating the gt3076 and Precision SC but it would have cost me a lot more and one was still JB turbos. The HE351CW has a comparable turbine(9cm=.65a/r)and a compressor that flows 60lbs/min. "Shadow" put down 480whp with the same turbo on a 8valve and KClarry put down 435whp in a hybrid motor same turbo. IIRC Wallace used the HX-40 in a Bullseye .55a/r housing, Spooled like crazy but choked the turbo big time on the top. I think I am going to still rebuild my 50trim and make it a super50 just incase I need it in the future.

All good info...thanks.

Drive you car at Cecil? Don't tempt me!!!

[turbovanman]

Originally Posted by rx2mazda

I think I am going to still rebuild my 50trim and make it a super50 just incase I need it in the future.

I have a spare S50 wheel in case you want one, I don't think Turbonetics has any left,

[bansheenut420]

Originally Posted by Pat

Don't be silly...not at all. I've been curious about the holsets for a while, but my current hybrid has been holding together fine so I haven't made any switches. Once someone dyno's one on a T-III, I'd really like to see it. I want to see what the area under the curve looks like compared to a hybrid.

Peak numbers are great, but I've beaten quite a few cars that made a lot more peak HP than me. Wide powerbands rock.

I totally agree. about the powerband. I feel like mine is pretty good, and will be better once I get Cindy to work on the soft limiter at 7200. It needs to be higher. My powerband is better than it was with s70, so I am happy. lol

[Ondonti]

Originally Posted by bansheenut420

Just to clairfy, you need a 4" vband and a welder is all for a Holset if you keep the stock housing. And a hx35 will outflow a GT35 and its a fraction of the price, and the hx40 strait up kills it.

HX35 63 lb/min
HX40 74 lb/min
H1E 72 lb/min

Some Garrett GT40 ratings for comparison:
GT4082R 50T 58 lb/min
GT4088R 52T 68 lb/min
GT4088R 54T 72 lb/min

Sorry not a hijack, just wanted to clear up the mis info....

lol you keep posting that.

Holset numbers are all wrong, 66lb/min on a 60mm hx40 6 blade.
Basically take 8ish lb/min off each holset and you will be close to the real numbers.


Doesn't Tyler have a 50 trim? I wont say anything about it beyond that.

Wallace used to run a 50 trim. He went faster on that because the stpcl turbine side was friendlier when it comes to backpressure.
With a 50 trim you can choose between stage I, II, III, V and .48, .63, .82 a/r housings (t3 style since this is a TIII not a dodge flange).
So you have a lot of control over the exhaust side flow/spool which is great depending on how you want your car to behave.
You can even do a T4 P trim wheel in any of the T3 housings. My friend with an sr20 has a sc6182 which uses the P trim t4 wheel, same one that I use in my turbo.
He just ran an 11.8 with his girlfriend in the passenger seat and only 17psi boost.
sc6182 is pretty much a gt35 with not quite as "awesome" wheels, but I think the difference is negligible in the real world.

[Ondonti]

Originally Posted by glht_omni

tom, did you ever get it to the track, before you tore it down?

mario, are you running a 50 trim or thinking about putting one on?

the new bandwagon for T3's are holsets, just ask lotashelbys and bansheenut420. you need a custom downpipe though, so a gt35bb and a TU 3" is a bolt on deal.

Try buying a 3" swingvalve and watch what happens.

Those are a thing of the past now, TU is trying to hook up the last few people who want them but hell, they sell ATP stuff and probably will replace that with something they produce. Would be a lot easier for small unreliable orders (thats what 3" swingvalves are for TU).


Tyler is running a 50 trim and the ATP setup. Thats something you can buy and bolt on.

Since 3" swingvalves are likely a thing of the past, and because TIII's dont use a dodge inlet flange, they have no use for custom turbine housings.

TIII's can use the real gt35 turbine housing. All the options are very boost creepy with everyone "stuck" on running internal wastegates. Real gt35 housing has a 3.5" exit so you either need to run a 3.5" downpipe or drop it down to 3" right away (i would keep it 3.5" until it gets into the exhaust tunnel).
One bonus of putting a poor flowing downpipe on, it wont creep as bad cause your turbo wont want to spool as well (Lesson people should learn from stock mitsu turbos and 3" swingvalves + exhaust).

[Turbo3Iroc]

My "real" GT35 has a 3" outlet.

[1qk4dr]

I run a 46 trim with a .48 ar exhaust side. The boost comes on pretty strong in the 3000-3500 range(this from memory since my car hasn't ran in two years). BTW It was a bit more laggy than the stock turbo.

[turbovanman]

I'll be putting a 50 trim, Stage II on my R/T when I get it running. It will be mostly stock except for a large IC, 2.5 inch exhaust, stock cal with no limiters.

Interesting to see how it will run.

[glht_omni]

Originally Posted by Ondonti

Try buying a 3" swingvalve and watch what happens.

Those are a thing of the past now, TU is trying to hook up the last few people who want them but hell, they sell ATP stuff and probably will replace that with something they produce. Would be a lot easier for small unreliable orders (thats what 3" swingvalves are for TU).


Tyler is running a 50 trim and the ATP setup. Thats something you can buy and bolt on.

Since 3" swingvalves are likely a thing of the past, and because TIII's dont use a dodge inlet flange, they have no use for custom turbine housings.

TIII's can use the real gt35 turbine housing. All the options are very boost creepy with everyone "stuck" on running internal wastegates. Real gt35 housing has a 3.5" exit so you either need to run a 3.5" downpipe or drop it down to 3" right away (i would keep it 3.5" until it gets into the exhaust tunnel).
One bonus of putting a poor flowing downpipe on, it wont creep as bad cause your turbo wont want to spool as well (Lesson people should learn from stock mitsu turbos and 3" swingvalves + exhaust).

i am not sure what you mean? if you want to buy a 3" swingvalve you have to wait another month or so. the gt35 is available with like 7 different exhaust housings including a T3 that fits a TU 3" sv.

mitsu + 3" sv never heard of a 3" swing valve for the mitsu?

i have put 3" exhaust to a stock mitsu with a 2.5" swing valve and the thing spools too quick and wants to blow past 15psi with a stock ecu and wastegate solenoid.

not trying to start any arguments, but i must have missed your point.

to each their own, i am not downplaying the holset at all. everybody sounds happy with it, but numbers on the dyno and 1/4 is where the proof is and nobody has posted any info like that.

run a hybrid that was meant for high flowing 4 cyls, run a holset that was meant for a big v8 tow vehicle or run an expensive gtbb that was meant to stand up to 24hr. lemans races. thats the good thing about owning your own car, you can make the decisions.

after talking to cory about the costs of going his route and its not any cheaper than a gt with a 3" swingvalve, unless you can fab up your own $500 downpipe and get a buddy to hook you up with some bullseye porting

i dont weld or port and it would cost me $1500+ to copy corys turbo/wastegate/downpipe setup.

[turbovanman]

He was saying that uncorking the exhaust helps the turbo spool and can cause overboost, ala the Mitsu with a big exhaust or if you don't port the wastegate hole on a Holset, same problem, massive boost creep.

[bansheenut420]

No numbers? Jacksons "not rod" went 115 in the 1/4. Thats real numbers. Not bad for just putting the turbo on and nothign else. I would have had numbers, but found out I lifted the head. I would have been disapointed with the numbers with that going on. Plus, I have talked to tons of dsm guys that are making 500+whp on the hx35. There was a guy that made 602 on his hx40 and ported bep housing. Another, with a 2.3l stroker dsm made 658 on a hx40. So, no there are no real numbers out there. They are new to TD's so it not really a suprise no one has numbers on them for our cars.

[bansheenut420]

Originally Posted by glht_omni

i dont weld or port and it would cost me $1500+ to copy corys turbo/wastegate/downpipe setup.

Or, you can pay just that much for a GT turbo..... Then have to worry about a decent downpipe, be stuck with an internal gate, or have to fab somthing.

[glht_omni]

whats a new or rebuilt hx35 or hx40 cost? i have seen new gt35's as low as $1100 add a 3" sv and a ss line kit and thats $1500.
i figured $250-300 for a used holset, $300 to rebuild, $250-300 external wastegate, ss line kit $100, porting the housing $200? flange, pipe and a good welders pay for the fabbng time to fit it for my specific car $300+ ($500 if you want jackson type craftsmanship). thats right about the same price, you just have to spend the time finding the right people to do the work and wait.

like i said, one is a bolt on affair and the other is custom.

i would prefer the holset/external wastegate setup, but try getting jackson to whip up a pipe for you.....you'll be waiting a lot longer as jackson is a super busy guy. if i am going to pay for it, i want it to look good like yours, not just some guy down the street bubble gumming up a pipe and calling it $300-500 and having to leave my car with him.

[Lotashelbys]

I keep hearing this Jackson name.....