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Thread: No no build Tuning question?

  1. #1
    Mitsu booster
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    No no build Tuning question?

    Due to "reasons" dropped a 782 head T1 intake Garret combo on a stock 2.2 88 Tbi shortblock.


    Going to run 86 T1 electronics (might use a glhs lm)

    I know compression will be too high but it's just a fast way to set it up and get it running. In leu of letting it sit in pieces for months like most projects that get out of hand.

    What timing should I run?
    Is 5-6 psi safe?
    Anyone ever do this before?

  2. #2
    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    Vigo has done this before in a minivan. tuning will probably be needed to keep this alive. that and good gas.

    if running a stock ECU, you may need to back down the base timing from 12deg to something lower if it knocks.

    i suggest making something like this: https://uprev.com/documentation/Knoc...n%20Device.pdf or this: https://www.k20a.org/threads/how-to-...e-knock.27258/ to listen to knock to see if you have any.

    Brian

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    This one is easy, I have myself to blame, I rush things, don't pay attention to gauges when I should, change to much stuff at once then expect miracles, the list is endless.

  3. #3
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aries_Turbo View Post
    Vigo has done this before in a minivan. tuning will probably be needed to keep this alive. that and good gas.

    if running a stock ECU, you may need to back down the base timing from 12deg to something lower if it knocks.

    i suggest making something like this: https://uprev.com/documentation/Knoc...n%20Device.pdf or this: https://www.k20a.org/threads/how-to-...e-knock.27258/ to listen to knock to see if you have any.

    Brian
    I got it running set it to 8゚ timing for now. I'm going to look into the knock sense reading.


    If anyone cares it looks like a 86 LM PM set up will actually work on a 88 K car just plug it into the bullhead and it starts right up no codes with every sensor connected. Most plug and play setup I've seen yet.

    https://youtu.be/UHkMxjHh9iw
    Last edited by reliantkcar; 11-20-2022 at 08:37 PM.

  4. #4
    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    86 electronics from what vehicle?

    87 daytona/4 door lebaron (and probably 85-87) definitely have a aries/reliant compatible bulkhead connector. 89 and older minivan harnesses work too but they need 2 pins moved in the connector for windshield wiper stuff.

    Brian

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    This one is easy, I have myself to blame, I rush things, don't pay attention to gauges when I should, change to much stuff at once then expect miracles, the list is endless.

  5. #5
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aries_Turbo View Post
    86 electronics from what vehicle?

    87 daytona/4 door lebaron (and probably 85-87) definitely have a aries/reliant compatible bulkhead connector. 89 and older minivan harnesses work too but they need 2 pins moved in the connector for windshield wiper stuff.

    Brian
    86 Lebaron Convertible T1 was the donor harness


    This car is a
    88 Reliant 2.2 Tbi

    I have the pm where the smec was and the lm by the ac crap. Check the pic and video.

    Everything works even the lights horn and wipers with extra plugs for 2nd set of headlights K cars don't have and the extra stuff from the lebaron.

    Most plug and play setup I've ever done. Just plugged it in hooked up every sensor and it fired right up still using the Tbi pump somehow. (Have the pump from the 86 Lebaron T1 and a 255 might use)

    Still have to wire up the tps right now the log one is plugged in wont bolt up to the newer manifold. And the IAT is just laying on the manifold likewise the log IAC but I'll just manually adjust the Tb for now leave it underhood so no codes.

    Biggest issue is the hole for the LM to go through is not there so might make a box to protect it under the hood.

    I have a 92 Daytona Sbec T1 harness,89 ShelbyZ 2.2 T2 harness, and a junkyard cut the smec plug off a 88 Shelby Z Harness all have different bulkhead plugs. Going to try to graft one of those into the Tbi smec harness I removed.

    I tried to find a 88 Dodge 600,NewYorker,Caravelle,Town and country TURBO harness but no go so had to go back in time with the 86 setup. Bulkhead pinouts were same and this is the first I've heard of a 86 harness working on a 88-89 Smec car no cutting anything.

  6. #6
    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    I wouldnt keep the LM in the engine bay. the boards arent really waterproofed and the connectors definitely arent. I have an 88 reliant as well (have had 2 of them... 1 3.0L swapped and my current turbo one) and for the turbo car, I took a hole saw and cut the hole in the firewall, deburred it, and brushed some paint on the bare metal and stuffed the connectors through the hole. i believe there might have been a dimple in the correct place to center the drill bit from the hole saw.

    the easiest upgrade for an 86 car is to move the pins and add the wires for the 87 ecu as the 87 ecu is much more tunable. I ran that setup for a long time. a few years ago i, wire by wire, cut the LM and PM wires off and soldered them to the SMEC connectors for the added features of the custom SMEC software. I have the SMEC logic board in the kick panel and the Power board in the engine bay. works mint.

    you can also add a handful of wires to the TBI smec harness and cut off the 60 way keys so it fits in the turbo ecu (i think you have to cut them but im not 100%) to make a 88 turbo k harness.

    Brian

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    This one is easy, I have myself to blame, I rush things, don't pay attention to gauges when I should, change to much stuff at once then expect miracles, the list is endless.

  7. #7
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aries_Turbo View Post
    I wouldnt keep the LM in the engine bay. the boards arent really waterproofed and the connectors definitely arent. I have an 88 reliant as well (have had 2 of them... 1 3.0L swapped and my current turbo one) and for the turbo car, I took a hole saw and cut the hole in the firewall, deburred it, and brushed some paint on the bare metal and stuffed the connectors through the hole. i believe there might have been a dimple in the correct place to center the drill bit from the hole saw.

    the easiest upgrade for an 86 car is to move the pins and add the wires for the 87 ecu as the 87 ecu is much more tunable. I ran that setup for a long time. a few years ago i, wire by wire, cut the LM and PM wires off and soldered them to the SMEC connectors for the added features of the custom SMEC software. I have the SMEC logic board in the kick panel and the Power board in the engine bay. works mint.

    you can also add a handful of wires to the TBI smec harness and cut off the 60 way keys so it fits in the turbo ecu (i think you have to cut them but im not 100%) to make a 88 turbo k harness.

    Brian
    Last year I scoured craigslist and the local junkyards for any TD stuff remaining.

    Should I go 87 Lm,SMEC or SBEC using the Tbi harness bulkhead plug?

    I have a complete 89 T2 harness,92 2.5 T1 Sbec harness and a 88 T2 harness complete besides Smec plug was cutoff.

    I have a pile of LM's,Smecs,and a few Sbec's

    I know nothing about tuning though.

  8. #8
    Rhymes with tortoise. Turbo Mopar Staff cordes's Avatar
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    These days I would gowith a SMEC.

  9. #9
    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    anything smec for sure. if you dont have a full TBI harness to convert to a turbo harness, splice the TBI bulkhead fitting onto one of the other SMEC harnesses. youll need the bulkhead wiring diagram for the reliant and the donor vehicle that provided the harness.

    the tuning isnt that hard. there is a decent amount of documentation on here on the subject. the rest of the details I can fill in.

    most of the details are in this video I made not too long ago. https://youtu.be/45UQaphMpdE

    Brian
    Last edited by Aries_Turbo; 11-26-2022 at 11:10 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    This one is easy, I have myself to blame, I rush things, don't pay attention to gauges when I should, change to much stuff at once then expect miracles, the list is endless.

  10. #10
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: No no build Tuning question?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aries_Turbo View Post
    anything smec for sure. if you dont have a full TBI harness to convert to a turbo harness, splice the TBI bulkhead fitting onto one of the other SMEC harnesses. youll need the bulkhead wiring diagram for the reliant and the donor vehicle that provided the harness.

    the tuning isnt that hard. there is a decent amount of documentation on here on the subject. the rest of the details I can fill in.

    most of the details are in this video I made not too long ago. https://youtu.be/45UQaphMpdE

    Brian
    I was thinking SBEC would be better for the sequential injection but if the SMEC is better for tuning I'll splice it into the TBI harness over the winter.

    Once I clean up this mess (no hole for LM plug,4 wire O2,IAC,IAT,Tps etc) I can get it driving.
    https://youtu.be/GZiRr7qOTS0

    Future plans are 2.5 shortblock (already assembled) Ported 782 head (gonna try myself) 2 piece Ported for a 52mm Tb a ebay T3/T4 with a "built" A413 2.60 or 2.78 FD A404 steels extra clutches (gotta figure that one out)

    So most likely stock programming won't work too good so gonna have to setup a way to tune it.

    Maybe something like this 😆
    https://youtu.be/lTRftZx2tAo

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