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Thread: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

  1. #21
    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by zin View Post
    I haven't seen it mentioned at which point one of these is advised... I know the cases can be an issue, it seems like folks have problems there before the input shaft, so I'm wondering if there's a "breaking point" where one would want/need one of these and would case mods be desirable ahead of this upgrade?...

    Mike
    I mentioned my experience a couple times here.
    "Somewhere in the upper 300hp range you are probably leaning your input splines. And at that level you would want a custom converter anyway."
    On my trans rebuild this past fall my stock input shaft was replaced due to splines getting leaned. Catching them like that was fortunate, before prolonged condition caused a failure. So I knew I wanted to prevent needing a pallet full of input shafts between Mini and Slug, and I want a complete ready to go spare trans.
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
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  2. #22
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor rdnoel86's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    This is the go to guy for 31th/a413 info and upgrades...though he should be working on his car to get ready for Sunday....

    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    A-1 performance make full race converters, these are not recommended for street use. There around $1300-$1400 for there converter.

  3. #23
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor rdnoel86's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    You might want to advertise on the Facebook groups....turbo Dodge groups, Neon groups...etc...

  4. #24
    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Anyone is welcome to pass the word around and direct them here.
    In all honesty i barely have time to do what I am doing.
    But the more the better. Maybe we can get a discount.
    Since we are already at at least 11, John is going to price quote us for 15. I'll post as soon as I hear more.

    If anyone is interested John says he has some billet 4.2 ratio kickdown levers for the A413 still in inventory.
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
    MeanMini dragracing videos: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...URZLB1RxGYF6vw
    and other cars, trucks and motorcycles
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  5. #25

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    I would like to post this tip for you that purchase the 300m/904 shaft, so that you don't find out the hard way. The shaft I sourced was a Donato piece, and it did not have the 5/8 nose extension at the front of the splines that fit into the converter turbine. It is made like a late 904 shaft with a blunt nose.
    The consequence of not having that extension is that the 300m shaft will want to walk forward right out of the rear clutch drum.
    the stock snap ring will not hold it in place. I initially used one spirolock in place of the stock snap ring (on advise of David Rose), but on inspection even the spirolock was pulling off the snap ring groove.
    The final fix was to source two tightly fitting spirolocks and stack them together in the groove, and press the shaft into the rear drum with Loctite 680.....no more problems.
    the following photo shows the part number for the proper spirolocks. I sourced them straight from Rotor Clip. Hope this saves you some unneeded aggravation. The Donato input shaft is a nice part, I don't think it can be broken. I have had good luck with his high ratio kick-down lever also.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Warren Stramer; 04-18-2018 at 07:39 PM.
    Worlds fastest 8 Valve 6.3sec., 119.70 1/8, Best MPH 145.5, Best 1/4 ET 9.78 sec.,144.26mph. 8 valve NO NITROUS!!

  6. #26
    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Thank you very much for sharing your experience with these Warren.
    Maybe in light of that we can get them machined with that nose.

    I will ask John about it.
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
    MeanMini dragracing videos: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...URZLB1RxGYF6vw
    and other cars, trucks and motorcycles
    https://www.youtube.com/user/SlugmobileMeanMini

  7. #27

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    I forgot to add, about torque converters, A-1 did my race converter and after first making it too tight (my fault), they redid it for free and hit it out of the park! stalls real high and easy, and has a quick tighten up curve; better stall and more MPH then the old unit I had.
    You must ask for Adam,(Adam Bowdish) he does the design and building, He also welded in my 904 27 spline turbine hub. http://www.a-1perf.com/
    Last edited by Warren Stramer; 04-18-2018 at 07:40 PM.
    Worlds fastest 8 Valve 6.3sec., 119.70 1/8, Best MPH 145.5, Best 1/4 ET 9.78 sec.,144.26mph. 8 valve NO NITROUS!!

  8. #28
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor rdnoel86's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by wheming View Post
    Anyone is welcome to pass the word around and direct them here.
    In all honesty i barely have time to do what I am doing.
    But the more the better. Maybe we can get a discount.
    Since we are already at at least 11, John is going to price quote us for 15. I'll post as soon as I hear more.

    If anyone is interested John says he has some billet 4.2 ratio kickdown levers for the A413 still in inventory.
    Sweet....been looking for one or two of those,

  9. #29
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor zin's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Stramer View Post
    The shaft I sourced was a Donato piece, and it did not have the 5/8 nose extension at the front of the splines that fit into the converter turbine.
    So it would seem the "proper" solution would be to either have the shaft built to engage the turbine hub, or does the later style address an issue that would be more beneficial than dealing with adding the locks?

    Alternately, would matching the converter to the style of shaft be a better option?...

    Quote Originally Posted by Warren Stramer View Post
    I have had good luck with his high ratio kick-down lever also.
    I'm guessing that the lever serves the same purpose as the old "Hemi" kick-down lever (for the 727/904 trans), in that it speeds up the band application?...

    Mike
    "The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government - lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." - Patrick Henry

    Bad laws are the worst sort of tyranny.
    - Edmund Burke

  10. #30

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by zin View Post
    I'm guessing that the lever serves the same purpose as the old "Hemi" kick-down lever (for the 727/904 trans), in that it speeds up the band application?...

    Mike
    No, the 4.7 ratio lever applies more pressure to the band. servo has to travel further to apply band, so I would think it takes longer. It has more leverage. My trans. with the 4.7:1 lever has no 2-3 shift overlap, and ZERO 2-3 flare.
    I have my kick-down bands made with extra welds to the band struts BEFORE they line them with carbon so that they can take the extra force of the longer 4.7 lever; and I run the band adjustment quite tight; just enough clearance so that it does not drag, and no more. Or maybe I'm doing this all wrong

    If I'm hijacking this thread, I'm sorry
    Last edited by Warren Stramer; 04-18-2018 at 07:17 PM.
    Worlds fastest 8 Valve 6.3sec., 119.70 1/8, Best MPH 145.5, Best 1/4 ET 9.78 sec.,144.26mph. 8 valve NO NITROUS!!

  11. #31
    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Warren, as the thread owner, I approve and encourage any comments, suggestions, opinions, and descriptions of your experiences you add to this thread or any other I make!

    And it is appreciated!

    Question though, someone has a typo. John said it was a 4.2 ratio lever. Maybe I said the wrong ration earlier? Are we talking sbout the same one, or were there other custom ratios?
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
    MeanMini dragracing videos: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...URZLB1RxGYF6vw
    and other cars, trucks and motorcycles
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  12. #32
    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Along the lines of what Mike said...
    If you had the option to do it over, what would be the best resolution?
    904 spline with the extended nose?
    Or the correct matching 904 spline hub? Either 904 spline style hub should be available on a custom converter, correct?
    If you are doing both and not reusing a converter hub, it shouldn't matter as long as they are the same. (Unless one is more readily available )?
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
    MeanMini dragracing videos: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...URZLB1RxGYF6vw
    and other cars, trucks and motorcycles
    https://www.youtube.com/user/SlugmobileMeanMini

  13. #33

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by wheming View Post
    Warren, as the thread owner, I approve and encourage any comments, suggestions, opinions, and descriptions of your experiences you add to this thread or any other I make!

    And it is appreciated!

    Question though, someone has a typo. John said it was a 4.2 ratio lever. Maybe I said the wrong ration earlier? Are we talking sbout the same one, or were there other custom ratios?
    The high ratio lever is in my trans. or I would take a look. I remember it as having 4.7 stamped into it. I am quite sure of that, although I could be wrong.
    Worlds fastest 8 Valve 6.3sec., 119.70 1/8, Best MPH 145.5, Best 1/4 ET 9.78 sec.,144.26mph. 8 valve NO NITROUS!!

  14. #34

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by wheming View Post
    Along the lines of what Mike said...
    If you had the option to do it over, what would be the best resolution?
    904 spline with the extended nose?
    Or the correct matching 904 spline hub? Either 904 spline style hub should be available on a custom converter, correct?
    If you are doing both and not reusing a converter hub, it shouldn't matter as long as they are the same. (Unless one is more readily available )?
    I'm not a torque converter expert, but I think the 904 shaft without the nose extension gives the converter builder more options.
    I would have John remake them exactly like the last batch and use the spirolcks and Loctite, and call it good. Or, ask Boots how they configure theirs.
    Worlds fastest 8 Valve 6.3sec., 119.70 1/8, Best MPH 145.5, Best 1/4 ET 9.78 sec.,144.26mph. 8 valve NO NITROUS!!

  15. #35
    Garrett booster
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Johns arm is a 4.7 ratio. I found it too aggressive for my set up. We run 200 psi line pressure and would snap output shaft with his arm. I ended up having 4.0 arm is made.

  16. #36

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    Johns arm is a 4.7 ratio. I found it too aggressive for my set up. We run 200 psi line pressure and would snap output shaft with his arm. I ended up having 4.0 arm is made.
    I guess I've been lucky so far with the 4.7 lever, trans never worked so good. I'm not making the power you are, and I think I run smaller slicks, so less hook. Also, I modified the trans. case so that I can remove the lever pin without the need to disassemble the trans. Now I can change levers in the car, if need be.
    What does your car weigh? If I may ask.
    Worlds fastest 8 Valve 6.3sec., 119.70 1/8, Best MPH 145.5, Best 1/4 ET 9.78 sec.,144.26mph. 8 valve NO NITROUS!!

  17. #37
    Garrett booster
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    My Core was 2450 with me in it with 24.5 tire on 13x10 wheel. How much line pressure are you running? I had billet output shaft made maybe it would hold it now. But I'm not having a band issue so I don't see a reason to change. I'm having billet drums made that will use 904 clutches in high gear. Also designing a wider band.

  18. #38

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    My car is 2300 with driver. 26x8" tire on 15x7 wheels. I only run 140psi line pressure; no band problems; 6 disc Alto power pack front drum. set at .030 clearance, No clutch slippage so far. (knocks on wood)
    Did you get to try you 11 roller aluminum sprag set-up?
    Worlds fastest 8 Valve 6.3sec., 119.70 1/8, Best MPH 145.5, Best 1/4 ET 9.78 sec.,144.26mph. 8 valve NO NITROUS!!

  19. #39
    Garrett booster
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    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Ic, seems 72mm setup We run, i see 3rd gear failure. My band looks good though. I run the aluminum drum, with stock sprag.

  20. #40

    Re: Possible A413/31TH Billet Input Shaft Group Buy

    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    I had billet output shaft made maybe it would hold it now. But I'm not having a band issue so I don't see a reason to change. I'm having billet drums made that will use 904 clutches in high gear. Also designing a wider band.
    Are any of these parts available to purchase/group buy?

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