Sure you would have to but that would be simple enough.. just make a bracket that comes off the valve cover bolts or off the block somewhere. Likely not worthwhile unless you are having trouble lighting off your mixture.
Sure you would have to but that would be simple enough.. just make a bracket that comes off the valve cover bolts or off the block somewhere. Likely not worthwhile unless you are having trouble lighting off your mixture.
I find that strange, and stranger yet, that no one has come on and posted differing results.
I've never had an issue timing at 12, 13,14,15 or anywhere else I wanted to with the stock distributor and HEP. Any time I see timing jumping all over usually means distributor and/or HEP is shot..........
Robert Mclellan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wambNdfnu5M
10.04 @ 143.28mph (144.82 highest mph)
Worlds fastest 8v MTX Shelby Charger
Manitoba's Fastest 4cyl!
8 valve, No Nitrous!
New clutch combo is the SH!T!
I've had them both ways. HEPs which bounce 4-5*s either way, and HEPs that are rock solid.
ETA: I probably shouldn't state it like that. It could have been slop from anywhere in the system. I guess you're actually seeing the total amount of lash in the system when you set the timing.
AJ makes a good point. No . . . . he PROVES it. Between belt slap, gear lash, and loose rotor rivets, the ignition system is way too imprecise.
Could set belt tension with a strobe light to minimize slap, select timing gears for minimal lash, and, of course re-melt those rotor rivets. Timing shaft bushing/journal clearances can be tightened too. Maybe hard chrome the two shafts - gear sets and journals.
John Laing
"The sole condition which is required in order to succeed in centralizing the supreme power in a democratic community, is to love equality, or to get men to believe you love it. Thus the science of despotism, which was once so complex is simplified, and reduced . . . . to a single principle."
-- Alexis de Tocqueville
"One of the methods used by statists to destroy capitalism consists in establishing controls that tie a given industry hand and foot, making it unable to solve its problems, then declaring that freedom has failed and stronger controls are necessary."
--Ayn Rand
"To evolve, you don't need a Constitution. All you need is a legislature and a ballot box . . . . things will evolve as much as you want. All of these changes can come about democratically; you don't need a Constitution to do that and it's not the function of a Constitution to do that."
-- Justice Antonin Scalia
I'm glad you gained power on your set up Harry but with changing turbos and trim on the compressor wheels, I think your 'test' is invalid. You can't really make a case for a before and after power level on ignition systems when you've changed turbos IMO
AJ (no More Alan) 84 Rampage RT TIII/568 Quaife 87 GLHS dealer optioned Red 16V Masi/568/Quaife
90 Masi 16V White/Ginger/Black
89 TC Masi 16V Red/Ginger/Black
86 GLHS #110 RoadRace Built 89 CSX-VNT Recaro Car
89 Turbo Mini 'Woody' 85 GLHT 'RedBox'
2014 Explorer DD'r 3.5Twin Turbo Ecoboost AWD and 500HP
My profile page has over 20,000 views, I'm somebody LOL
I’ve been proposing this issue for YEARS now.
I still don’t possess the ability to make it happen, but surely could have become the direct-fire GURU by now!
The issue we ran into again and again was with getting the SMEC to “understand” the crank/cam sensor signals.
This is a dream of mine, and I’ve seen many people with MS systems that have incredible COP setups. It makes the 8V engine look so different! It’s awesome!!!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This has been my experience as well;
Since I've had Rock solid system operation, any time I saw one "not behaving" I had to know why. Usually was the plastic rivets in that style of dissy. Next was A/M HEP's and HEP condition/ wiring, which I Only used Mopar and was always aware of condition, so never had that issue myself. Then worn out distributors and I-shafts as well as improperly tensioned belts ect.
Bottom line, Something else was at fault and the system itself, when everything is working Properly was fine.
Robert Mclellan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wambNdfnu5M
10.04 @ 143.28mph (144.82 highest mph)
Worlds fastest 8v MTX Shelby Charger
Manitoba's Fastest 4cyl!
8 valve, No Nitrous!
New clutch combo is the SH!T!
Agreed, although it's been stated that the previous turbo was a T04e and Should have been more efficient, that turbo obviously had issues as it eventually seized IMS.
I think what is Really proving here is Exactly what some of us have known and said from the beginning;
Most of the problems people run into building these cars, are from Lack of attention to detail, and never getting the Basics sorted out. So the reason one build makes X amount of power and another that seems very similar make X amount Less will usually come down to the one have more of the set-up working Properly vs 10 other things wrong that Never get sorted out because a bunch of people on the net said they weren't important.
Robert Mclellan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wambNdfnu5M
10.04 @ 143.28mph (144.82 highest mph)
Worlds fastest 8v MTX Shelby Charger
Manitoba's Fastest 4cyl!
8 valve, No Nitrous!
New clutch combo is the SH!T!
Agreed.
One reason I went to doing calibrations one on one in person was due to long sessions of phone troubleshooting and then finding out the individual whom I sold a cal too did not check distributor timing, cam timing, fuel pressure, had beat plugs, dead cylinders etc.
Wasn't worth the hassle.
Gary
Working on clearing the decks.
I'd also like to add that sometimes the placement of the timing marks on the torque converter or flywheel can be off a few degrees as well.
Mike Marra
1986 Plymouth Horizon GLMF "The Contraption" < entertaining sponsorship offers
Project Log:
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?69708-The-Contraption-2013-14&highlight=
Very similar experience with customers vehicles I worked on. I use to look forward to solving any problem I could, and with these cars it was so simple most of the time because most problems were either owner caused, or other mechanics that had worked on the vehicle.
#1 issue that I saw (other than oil condition/ running regular fuel), mechanic installed timing belts wrong. Worse yet, not willing to accept that they could have made a mistake and unwilling to dble check their work!
The problem was After I had straightened out all of the current problems and sent the owner off with a verbal or written list of things to watch for/ proper maintenance ect. I would see the vehicle come back years later completely neglected, 20,000kms on oil it had left with. Running regular fuel and bleed in line for more boost. Ect Ect
I dealt with it fine for a lot of years, but it slowly wore at me. What good is anything I'm doing when 90% of this is self inflicted and I Can't seem to be able to Help the person Help themselves!??
This eventually made me more selective of which vehicles I would work on and which ones would have to fend for themselves..........
Robert Mclellan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wambNdfnu5M
10.04 @ 143.28mph (144.82 highest mph)
Worlds fastest 8v MTX Shelby Charger
Manitoba's Fastest 4cyl!
8 valve, No Nitrous!
New clutch combo is the SH!T!
Basics are invaluable, and must be checked quite regularly IMHO.
The number of reported issues varies so dramatically when simple settings are not right; when inferior components or fuels OR oils(viscosity and/or quality) as well.
Quite frequently I’ve really helped people with advice on going to the quality fuel stations, rather than wherever the price is lowest. lol
On another note; I’ll be in touch Shadow. Got the 83lb/hr injectors. So the setup should be easier to dial in.
But first I still have to get it into roller, and get the cage in.
Good times.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sounds good Donnie, and just to be clear;
Not saying that what tryingbe has shown here isn't worth doing, just saying that the factory components aren't what's going to hold you back from making great power IF you have them working properly.
Having said that, for those that have not had good success running with the factory set-up, Eliminating as many of the components that are known to have issues may just be the way to go
Robert Mclellan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wambNdfnu5M
10.04 @ 143.28mph (144.82 highest mph)
Worlds fastest 8v MTX Shelby Charger
Manitoba's Fastest 4cyl!
8 valve, No Nitrous!
New clutch combo is the SH!T!
So much good stuff said here... This forum needs a like button for posts!
But, the problem of slop in the distributor relates to the timing of the HEP signal. Not the ignition timing itself. The distributor contacts are together for a relatively long crank angle - they have to be or you wouldn't be able to vary the timing at all!
- - - Updated - - -
Yes, this.
- - - Updated - - -
I did on my car originally - the shutter wheel was loose, so I drilled it and screwed it on with nylon screws. No problems after that. I think most of the slop is in the shutter, usually.
when you guys go to coil on plug what coils do you use?
I'm wondering about the coil to plug connection - is it anything like a ford mod motor's set up ?
- that uses a coiled "spring" as the conductor in the coil boot
and I've learned from my own experience with my 5.4 truck that's not the best arrangement
as I'd gone through enough ford coils (16) to never want to buy another from ford I went to the msd coils
these used the same spring conductor as the stock coils
BUT , there's an upgrade for the ford coils - from Granatelli racing)
they supply a spiral section of 3/8's inch stainless steel cable , YES 3/8 steel cable
- with regular style plug wire terminals at each end and a R-F suppressor on the cable
they also include a set of silicone boots instead of rubber ones
(you can get these for all mod motor apps - if that's in any way applicable at 140 to 200 bucks for 8)
once installed I noted a definitely crisper throttle response - I could actually "crack" the throttle with some authority over it
AND most notably I noted a distinct "bounc-ie" feeling had gone away
I think it was the "springs" reacting to the current going through them
- if you've ever seen a cable move when high voltage goes through it you might understand what I seemed to be feeling
2.5 years ago we talked about this.
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/sh...65#post1091165
Mike Marra
1986 Plymouth Horizon GLMF "The Contraption" < entertaining sponsorship offers
Project Log:
http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?69708-The-Contraption-2013-14&highlight=