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Thread: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

  1. #1
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor jeff1234's Avatar
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    advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Hello All, I have had a detonation problem for a very long time. Through MPScan I discovered it happens between 4100 and 5100 rpm. MPscan shows 53 degrees @4100 and produces a sharp det spike. The timing begins to drop off at that point and detonation spikes show on the graph for various cylinders, pulling out as much as 8 degree's on individuals. My advance from rpm max shows about 53 degrees at a little over 4000 rpm it seems like this should be lowered, what do you think should I change that, reduce the total advance in map full or both?

    p.s. I have varified that my fuel air is 11.2 in that rpm range.
    Last edited by jeff1234; 11-17-2017 at 11:07 AM.
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    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    The smart guys who can answer will probably need to know a little about your combo.
    ECU, engine size, head casting, compression ratio, auto/manual
    And is this detonation in boost? What boost do you run?
    Wayne H.

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    Moderator Turbo Mopar Staff Force Fed Mopar's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    That is just the max under any condition, but the timing will not be that high under boost, or even close to it. You need to be looking at the total timing chart in that rpm range.

    I would try taking 2-4 degrees out above 4k in the AdvanceFromRPM table and see if that makes a difference.

    Rob M.
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  4. #4
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor jeff1234's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    I will give that a try, thank you.
    The only substitute for cubic inches is cubic dollars, how fast can you afford to go?

  5. #5
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor jeff1234's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Wayne, thanks, ecu, LM 2.5. 782 head pro ported, manual detonation is in boost, 13 psi 7.9 to 1
    Last edited by jeff1234; 11-18-2017 at 07:10 AM.
    The only substitute for cubic inches is cubic dollars, how fast can you afford to go?

  6. #6
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor minigts's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Quote Originally Posted by Force Fed Mopar View Post
    That is just the max under any condition, but the timing will not be that high under boost, or even close to it. You need to be looking at the total timing chart in that rpm range.

    I would try taking 2-4 degrees out above 4k in the AdvanceFromRPM table and see if that makes a difference.
    Agreed. Or start lower and work your way up.


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    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Quote Originally Posted by Force Fed Mopar View Post

    I would try taking 2-4 degrees out above 4k in the AdvanceFromRPM table and see if that makes a difference.
    i second the notion. knock that is only in a small RPM window should be taken care of in AdvanceFromRPM. knock that occurs as the boost rises should be taken care of in advancefrommapwarmfull.

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    This one is easy, I have myself to blame, I rush things, don't pay attention to gauges when I should, change to much stuff at once then expect miracles, the list is endless.

  8. #8
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor jeff1234's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Those are some great insights. Thank you so much.
    Jeff
    The only substitute for cubic inches is cubic dollars, how fast can you afford to go?

  9. #9
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor jeff1234's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    I have been trying to send my mpscan log but haven't had any luck. can someone tell me how to do this. I have turned the log into both csv and mpl file but the system wont take them.
    The only substitute for cubic inches is cubic dollars, how fast can you afford to go?

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    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Quote Originally Posted by jeff1234 View Post
    I have been trying to send my mpscan log but haven't had any luck. can someone tell me how to do this. I have turned the log into both csv and mpl file but the system wont take them.
    The easiest ways to post them here is to put them in a folder and then compress to a zip file, or you could put them in google drive and just share the link.
    This site only allows certain file extensions. But if on a PC you will have to "Go Advanced" with your reply and use "Manage Attachments" to attach.
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
    MeanMini dragracing videos: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...URZLB1RxGYF6vw
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  11. #11
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor jeff1234's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    I give up, there is no simple compress command that I can see, only compress and email. I dont use google drive and use goodle email so email not set up on my pc. this is frustrating.....
    The only substitute for cubic inches is cubic dollars, how fast can you afford to go?

  12. #12
    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Quote Originally Posted by jeff1234 View Post
    I give up, there is no simple compress command that I can see, only compress and email. I dont use google drive and use goodle email so email not set up on my pc. this is frustrating.....
    If you are on a pc, simply right click and there should be a selection "Send to", "Compressed (zipped) folder".
    That will compress the file and put in in a file folder the same name with a .zip extension.
    Then attach file to your post using the go advanced, manage attachments. You have to upload to the t-m server and then attach to your post.
    You can attach your files to a normal email though, right? I'll pm you my email if you want to just send to me, if you can't get it to work.
    Last edited by wheming; 11-20-2017 at 01:46 AM.
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
    MeanMini dragracing videos: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...URZLB1RxGYF6vw
    and other cars, trucks and motorcycles
    https://www.youtube.com/user/SlugmobileMeanMini

  13. #13
    Slugmobile & MeanMini Caretaker Turbo Mopar Contributor wheming's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    Here are Jeff's logs.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Wayne H.

    '91 Dodge Spirit ES 2.5L turbo 5spd
    '05 PT GT 2.4T HO autostick
    '89 Plymouth Acclaim 2.5L turbo auto, "Slugmobile" yes, THE Slugmobile!
    '89 Dodge Caravan SE 2.5L turbo auto, "Mean Mini" yes, Gus' Mean Mini! (Current best 11.7786@113.04 mph! - Jan 15th, 2017 Fayetteville Dragway, NC)
    MeanMini dragracing videos: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...URZLB1RxGYF6vw
    and other cars, trucks and motorcycles
    https://www.youtube.com/user/SlugmobileMeanMini

  14. #14
    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: advance from rpm max vs advance from map warm full

    can you send me your cal files?

    at least the tpl and the asm that you are using?

    Brian

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    This one is easy, I have myself to blame, I rush things, don't pay attention to gauges when I should, change to much stuff at once then expect miracles, the list is endless.

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