Is anyone using a dual port wastegate actuator (internal w.g.) with a MBC?

[wheming]

Interested in seeing if anyone is using a dual port wastegate actuator on their internal wastegate turbo while using a manual boost controller. I'd like to know how you've got your lines set up and any comments you may have about it.

I'm considering a new wastegate actuator, and would like to know if a dual port would be a benefit.
I find my boost drops off a bit more than i would like following my gear change to 2nd.
If i ever get to race again this year, i am going to see about a bit more preload tension on the actuator.

[wheming]

I guess that would be a "no"?

[tryingbe]

After of years of trying to use manual boost controller, I finally upgraded to electronic boost controller last March. Setting the correct boost is as easy as pushing a button or turning a knob. I don't think I'd even want to go back to manual boost controller.

This is what I have and below is my boost level during my dyno runs.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-TURBO-HD...hUKNeX&vxp=mtr

[csxtra]

Wayne,

I put a dual-port wastegate actuator on the CSX earlier this year to control the internal wastegate on my GT3082, but with the transmission issues at SDAC and after (re-making it a 520/555 hybrid and replacing all the bearings/seals) I haven't had time to really test it out, so the "other" port is not hooked up yet, hence I don't have any real data for you.

The idea is to get a lightly-springed actuator to get a lower minimum attainable boost level, then use the second port to hold the wastegate shut to attain higher boost levels than the spring alone could hold.

I went with the Turbosmart TS-0620-1143 IWG75 wastegate actuator because aside from having dual ports, it has replaceable springs so you can fine-tune the minimum boost level:


I plan on using it with my three-stage grainger-based boost controller, with the first two stages connected to the main port for low and medium boost (within the range of the spring), and the third stage solely used to hold the wastegate shut by providing pressure (through a regulator) to the auxiliary port.

This is the configuration that Reeves used to raise his boost level on his external wastegate last fall, and it worked well for him, so I want to duplicate it with an internal wastegate.

I hope this helps meow,
Warren

P.S. If you do get this actuator, the threads on it are M6 x 1.0, so make sure you get a clevis with the correct threads.

[wheming]

After of years of trying to use manual boost controller, I finally upgraded to electronic boost controller last March. Setting the correct boost is as easy as pushing a button or turning a knob. I don't think I'd even want to go back to manual boost controller.

This is what I have and below is my boost level during my dyno runs.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-TURBO-HD...hUKNeX&vxp=mtr

Thanks Harry. That is a pretty smooth boost line after the initial control and correction. I'm not sure i want to go with EBC, but i would consider it.

[wheming]

Wayne,

I put a dual-port wastegate actuator on the CSX earlier this year to control the internal wastegate on my GT3082, but with the transmission issues at SDAC and after (re-making it a 520/555 hybrid and replacing all the bearings/seals) I haven't had time to really test it out, so the "other" port is not hooked up yet, hence I don't have any real data for you.

The idea is to get a lightly-springed actuator to get a lower minimum attainable boost level, then use the second port to hold the wastegate shut to attain higher boost levels than the spring alone could hold.

I went with the Turbosmart TS-0620-1143 IWG75 wastegate actuator because aside from having dual ports, it has replaceable springs so you can fine-tune the minimum boost level:


I plan on using it with my three-stage grainger-based boost controller, with the first two stages connected to the main port for low and medium boost (within the range of the spring), and the third stage solely used to hold the wastegate shut by providing pressure (through a regulator) to the auxiliary port.

This is the configuration that Reeves used to raise his boost level on his external wastegate last fall, and it worked well for him, so I want to duplicate it with an internal wastegate.

I hope this helps meow,
Warren

P.S. If you do get this actuator, the threads on it are M6 x 1.0, so make sure you get a clevis with the correct threads.

Thanks Warren! Helpful as always. I appreciate it, meow.

I did look at that turbosmart actuator recently, previously i was considering this Kinugawa. I was looking again tonight and found you could actually custom piece together a Kinugawa for about $85, +8.99 if you want their nipple for the spring side port. I do want to contact them to see if you can make their billet adjustable actuator a dual port by simply threading in another nipple. (It appears so, but there was no mention of it on their product page i could find.)
Here is a universal kit with extra range springs and rod lengths:

Item Number:-309-02057-054




This page shows the custom actuators where you can piece parts:
http://shopping.kinugawaturbo.com/ad...eactuator.aspx

I have had zero time to work on Mini, and have only started her once since SDAC! I have been churning some ideas and i believe one reason i was having some boost issues at Memphis were the preload on the actuator. I think i may have been bleeding some boost by the actuator in that the actuator could not close enough once it opened. Like trying to close a door in a heavy wind.
But, i don't want to have to raise my minimum boost much. I need a low, low boost for the street, since Mini will roast tires at 9psi.

It's also possible i need to upgrade from the 1g talon bov, but i would need to do more testing first before i decide. I do eventually need a setup capable of surviving +30psi.

[tryingbe]

Thanks Harry. That is a pretty smooth boost line after the initial control and correction. I'm not sure i want to go with EBC, but i would consider it.

By the way, that boost result was done on a 25 year old + actuator from a TIII car that I had laying around.

[wheming]

By the way, that boost result was done on a 25 year old + actuator from a TIII car that I had laying around.

Harry, does that boost controller support a dual port actuator?
I think for it to work with it, it would need a 3-way solenoid to send boost to either port to control boost.

[tryingbe]

Harry, does that boost controller support a dual port actuator?
I think for it to work with it, it would need a 3-way solenoid to send boost to either port to control boost.

No idea. The stock actuator works just so close to perfect for me with the HDi boost controller at 21psi, no reason for me to look further. If you need a TIII actuator, I have a few here for $20 shipped to your door.

[wheming]

The turbo on the van was installed with a new garrett actuator. I think i need to set the preload a bit more is all. But if i did change actuators it would most likely be in favor of a dual port, and something i could change springs to fine tune my goals.
Now that the wastegate puck is larger on my turbo, i think the exhaust pressure is probably hindering the wastegate from fully closing. Hopefully i can test it in a few weeks when things settle down.

[tryingbe]

I don't have a picture, but the wastegate hole on my turbine housing is bigger than stock. The puck on the ATP ultimate wastegate is also huge.

[wheming]

I don't have a picture, but the wastegate hole on my turbine housing is bigger than stock. The puck on the ATP ultimate wastegate is also huge.

Using the same ATP.... the puck was about 35mm, but Brian had installed TU's 38mm replacement puck, and the wastegate port was opened up to 34.5mm iirc.
This was what it looked like opened up:

[wheming]

Placed an order for a new Kinugawa adjustable wastegate actuator. PN: 309-02051-003
Ordered with the 0.8 bar spring (11.7psi) along with a 0.5 bar spring and additional nipple to try using as a dual port.
Funny though they said they never tried that when i asked.

Looking forward to seeing if that does the trick for maintaining my boost through the run.

[wheming]

It came in, but still not installed yet. Was comparing with the two different springs. I think i need something in between the two. The 0.8 bar barely cracks off seat at 12psi, and then isn't open fully until about 20psi. The softer spring is off its seat at like 4psi and fully open by like 15.
I guess i'll try the stiffer of the two and just run the boost signal directly with no bleed. Then will have to see what i end up with.
I need to try and get that little clip off the wastegate arm. I had tried previously with no luck.

[tryingbe]

Go with the softer one. Unless you like your minimal boost be like 16psi.

[wheming]

Go with the softer one. Unless you like your minimal boost be like 16psi.

For the street, i would totally agree. Right now since i still have the electric water pump installed, i've only been driving the van at the dragstrip. So, for the purposes of trying to get a new personal best with the van, i'll be trying out the stiffer of the two.
Around town, this would be pointless since she roasts tires with 10psi.

I have modified this actuator to add a nipple to the spring side port, and have tested it on the bench to hold pressure. Later i will go to the softer spring and see if i can set things up for a low minimum boost, and a stable high boost setting. Once i can do that, i may try a boost controller like you have.

This actuator was cheaper than the TurboSmart one Warren is using, so i wanted to try it first. I may end up having to try that one, if the current plans don't work the way i'd like.

[contraption22]

I was just thinking. You could use a G-valve, setup in "cutout raiser" configuration, on spring side of the actuator. As boost rises, the gvalve would limit pressure in the spring side of the actuator as it continued to rise on the valve side.

[wheming]

I was just thinking. You could use a G-valve, setup in "cutout raiser" configuration, on spring side of the actuator. As boost rises, the gvalve would limit pressure in the spring side of the actuator as it continued to rise on the valve side.

That's a good thought. I was considering that or a small regulator. I do already have a MAP cutout raiser set for about 13psi, which would be perfect to add some holding force to keep the wastegate closed.
When i went to install my new actuator it would not line up properly with the existing actuator bracket the garrett is using.
I don't really have alot of space to work, when i'm laying under the van and trying to see with my fingers either.
I might break down and try using that TurboSmart actuator Warren is using. I might try to hold out for any big changes, since i think i should be capable of a new PB without any drastic changes. But i would like to be certain the wastegate is stsying closed. If i am bleeding across the wastegate it isn't quite as bad as bleeding out of my BOV though!

I like the idea of a dual port, because when i get back to daily driving the van, i don't want to be stuck with a heavy acutator spring.

[contraption22]

I like the idea of a dual port, because when i get back to daily driving the van, i don't want to be stuck with a heavy acutator spring.

Agreed. Part of the appeal of the CO2 system. I'd like to be able to keep the required spring pressure to a minimum. Some that use CO2 use no spring at all. I am researching to see if I can use cheap paintball/homebrewing stuff at about 1/3 the money vs. automotive stuff.

[wheming]

Agreed. Part of the appeal of the CO2 system. I'd like to be able to keep the required spring pressure to a minimum. Some that use CO2 use no spring at all. I am researching to see if I can use cheap paintball/homebrewing stuff at about 1/3 the money vs. automotive stuff.

Although it goes without saying, i'll say this anyway: keep us in the loop for what you cook up. Would like to see what you design.

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