Open cage CTS durability issues?

[4 l-bodies]

I wanted to get some feedback some people that have been running the GM style (Standard motor products) open cage CTS sensors in their turbo engines. I just had a friends stout 2.2 GLHT here at the house for some tuning and maintenance. It is running a custom 3 bar calibration using 87 electronics. It was throwing a code 23 IAT or CTS issue. Hooking up a DRB it showed a constant default of 70°. When I removed the sensor I immediately saw what the problem was. The entire wires and sensor bulb was torn off! Cage was still there, but engine ingested the small sensor along with about 3/4" inch of wires with it. This powertrain along with sensor has less than 5k miles on it. So my question is, was this a freak one time thing, or is there too much velocity in a forced induction intake manifold to use these open cage sensors? Thinking it might live longer if I can make the probe more rigid by epoxying the wires (not the probe) to the cage to give it some more stability. Also thought about moving sensor to intercooler tubing to eliminate valve pulses and get it out of heat soak conditions of intake manifold. Thoughts?
Todd

[contraption22]

I've never seen this happen before.

[GLHNSLHT2]

I'll start the possible can of worms. The velocity is the same as an N/A engine

[4 l-bodies]

In doing a bit of research on the subject, I have found that this is a somewhat common issue. Found several threads talking about it on various forums. One fix is to stabilize the wires (not the probe) to the cage with some o2 safe RTV. In looking more closely at the failed part, the wires ripped right off the terminals about .750" down the sensor. OEM, aftermarket, plastic or metal open cage, they all seem to be susceptible to this type of failure.
Todd

[cordes]

Yep. I added a tiny zip tie to mine back when with no ill effects.

[contraption22]

Are you able to post some pics of the failed sensor?

[4 l-bodies]

Are you able to post some pics of the failed sensor?

Yeah Mike
I'll post a couple up later today. Wouldn't be able to see the terminals though without cutting the sensor in half.
Todd

[Fox]

i had the same problem, my sensor isnt in the stock location its in the neck of the intake instead where theres more airflow, sensor wires broke in the first 500 miles i thought it was just a defective part...

[jonnymopar]

This particular subject has always been of interest to me. I didn't have a stock sensor since mine was an 89 turbo I car, so I bought an aftermarket one, which is fully-enclosed in brass like a coolant sensor. I can't see how these would work well for air temp, no matter how thin-walled the brass is, but that's all I have unfortunately.

[Aries_Turbo]

i use one.... i wrapped some electrical tape around one of the legs and zip tied the thermistor to that.

Brian

[4 l-bodies]

This particular subject has always been of interest to me. I didn't have a stock sensor since mine was an 89 turbo I car, so I bought an aftermarket one, which is fully-enclosed in brass like a coolant sensor. I can't see how these would work well for air temp, no matter how thin-walled the brass is, but that's all I have unfortunately.

Well Jon opportunity knocks. Rock auto has them on close out for like $9.20 before discount, plus $1.99 for shipping a couple to my place. If you buy one, I would stabilize the thermistor by some means, whether RTV or itty bitty zip ties. Yes they are WAY more fast acting than an all brass or plastic version. Same electrical connector as the earlier CTS, so they are plug-n-play.
Todd

[DOHCRT]

Hey Todd, Got a P/N for that sensor. I need to replace the one in my R/T which is currently reading -53 degrees when outside temp is 115F!

[4 l-bodies]

Hey Todd, Got a P/N for that sensor. I need to replace the one in my R/T which is currently reading -53 degrees when outside temp is 115F!

Sure Vic,
Standard Motor products # AX-7. Not 100% sure the electrical connector is the same for the R/T though. It is the same pigtail as the coolant temp sensor. Mopar changed sensor terminals at some point. This sensor fits the earlier models. Easy enough to change the pigtail.
Todd

[jonnymopar]

Thanks for the info Todd!

Hey Todd, Got a P/N for that sensor. I need to replace the one in my R/T which is currently reading -53 degrees when outside temp is 115F!

Heh, well at least theoretically it should run a little rich with that happening. Better than going lean I guess.

[contraption22]

This thread got me thinking about my Jeep. It idles poorly in cold weather. Actually you can feel a change in idle with the cycling of the 02 sensor reading, like it's too lean. Never thought to check the charge temp sensor. hmmm

[Aries_Turbo]

This thread got me thinking about my Jeep. It idles poorly in cold weather. Actually you can feel a change in idle with the cycling of the 02 sensor reading, like it's too lean. Never thought to check the charge temp sensor. hmmm

my 97 neon used to do that. it idled like a TM with a not so dialed in cal.... like my current cal in my reliant lol.

todd, i remember Ken (5digits) telling me that there was a later part number temp sensor for something like a hemi ram that was caged but free flowing for fast response that would work on our cars..... i cant remember the details though.

Brian

[cordes]

my 97 neon used to do that. it idled like a TM with a not so dialed in cal.... like my current cal in my reliant lol.

todd, i remember Ken (5digits) telling me that there was a later part number temp sensor for something like a hemi ram that was caged but free flowing for fast response that would work on our cars..... i cant remember the details though.

Brian

I think it was for one of the Dakotas.

[DOHCRT]

Sure Vic,
Standard Motor products # AX-7. Not 100% sure the electrical connector is the same for the R/T though. It is the same pigtail as the coolant temp sensor. Mopar changed sensor terminals at some point. This sensor fits the earlier models. Easy enough to change the pigtail.
Todd

Thanks Todd, I found out the connectors are different the other night. I have plenty of 8v sensors, but 16v not so much; nothing about 5 min can't cure. I'm chasing a low vacuum, crappy fuel mileage issue and when I saw this, I figured I should start here.

Gonna be in the Golden Valley area the 12th-20th of July, any get togethers planned?

[4 l-bodies]

Thanks Todd, I found out the connectors are different the other night. I have plenty of 8v sensors, but 16v not so much; nothing about 5 min can't cure. I'm chasing a low vacuum, crappy fuel mileage issue and when I saw this, I figured I should start here.

Gonna be in the Golden Valley area the 12th-20th of July, any get togethers planned?

Hi Vic,
Picked a good time to be in MN. Street Machine Nationals are being held July 15-17 at St. Paul fairgrounds. 4-5K street machines will be there. Several of us from MNSDAC bring cars to the event. Must make event if you've never been to one. MN Street Rod Association was just last weekend at same location. 14K street rods and lots of vendors. PM me and I'll give you my phone # and email addy.
Todd

[going4speed]

just ordered two air temp sensors and got the wrong one apparently, smaller thread, so what is the right part number for these sensors?