Help with wheels/tires please!

[Mudman]

Hey all,

I'm looking at purchasing a new set of wheels/tires for my '89 LS. I really would like some help from the TM'ers who have updated their rim styles, gone with larger sizes, figured out offsets necessary, etc.

Here's the size I'm really hoping to make work. *215/45R17*
All of the rims I've looked at so far are 7.5" wide with an offset of 45.

Has anyone run this size before? This is where I'm truly lost as I have no accurate way to test/measure if these dimensions will work with steering lock-to-lock and with suspension travel thrown into the mix. Below I'll link to the rim styles I'm interested in and tires. Granted, I'm not rich, so some budgeting needed to be done, though after much research I am happy with my options. I'll try to post a couple picks of the Lancer tonight or tomorrow for visual reference (for your viewing pleasure, my fellow boost abusers)

Wheel options 1&2 are the same design, different color option.

1: http://www.discounttiredirect.com/di...7.5&vid=007476

2: http://www.discounttiredirect.com/di...7.5&vid=007476

3: http://www.discounttiredirect.com/di...7.5&vid=007476

Tire options:

1: http://www.discounttiredirect.com/di...=007476&cs=215

2: http://www.discounttiredirect.com/di...=007476&cs=215
(I was very concerned at quality of the Sentury's, but after some research and consumer reviews, it appears these are actually a great value for the price)

Best regards,

Zach

[GLHNSLHT2]

I've seen the stock 6.5" Shelby Lancer rims listed at 35mm offset and that would explain why they sit so flush. Stock LS rims at 6" wide should be 40mm offset. 6.5" crabs are 40mm offset. Going to a 45mm off set moves the wheel in 5mm. Not going to allow you to run the right negative camber so going wider with that setup won't help. You'll want at least a 35mm offset.

Honestly, if you kept the same width and offset wheel with a good tire and the alignment set properly you'll get a much larger handling increase than just shoving on a wider wheel/tire package. I've made these cars with 175/75 R14 snow tires corner much harder than one with 205/50 15's could even dream of with the right alignment.

Read this:

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/kn...Specifications

As far as tires for a summer tire look at the BFG G-force Sports. Sticky, cheap (relatively), lasts a decent amount of time. DO NOT USE ON SNOW!

[Mudman]

Thank you for the information on the offset! I'm very new to detailed wheel dimensions and whatnot. Definitely needing the help of the more experienced. And I'll look to see what kind of prices I can find on those tires! Thanks for the tip.

There are two parts as to why I want to go wider on the tires and larger on the rims.

The rims...well, let's be honest, it's for vanity. I really like the look of the H-body with a little more metal in the fender well. I've had this car for almost exactly 10 years now...and I want to drop the dough and get that "stance".

And the tires? Well, I have 205 width on there now, and although it grips decently enough in the corners, I have almost zero traction if I spool past 5-7psi in first gear - among other acceleration traction issues. I would like more rubber on the ground for those low-gear pulls. In no way am I disregarding your experience and expertise, I just don't see how any narrower than what I have now will be beneficial for me.

Whadda-ya-say, GLHNSLHT2? (thanks again for your input).

[contraption22]

Here is a great tool for comparing wheel dimensions and tire sizes.

Put your current specs on the left, your new specs on the right, and it will spit out a good estimate of your clearances.

https://www.rimsntires.com/specspro.jsp

[GLHNSLHT2]

Wider tires will make a small improvement but not as much as getting a good compound. Also having the alignment set right helps a bunch for straight line speed too. As the car lifts the camber goes positive. So if you have some negative camber in the front the tires will sit at zero camber (FLAT ON THE GROUND) when you accelerate. I'd also get the Energy Suspension A-arm bushings for the front end as they keep the toe from changing which helps with traction as well.

[Mudman]

I have installed all new PolyBushings for my front and rear suspension linkage later last year, so I should have plenty of rigidity there ha. I will be getting my alignment according to that post you linked me to when I have the front end put back together. Currently getting new hub assemblies put on my steering knuckles.

I've recently installed new shocks and struts as well so my suspension should hold it together at this point. I currently have Falken Ziex (205/55R16) tires on there right now, can't remember the exact line I got, but they were really nice when new. Still 'okay' but they've hardened up a bit and don't have a lot of tread left.

Once I get her back together and aligned properly I should be able to tell if I still feel wider tires will be beneficial to me.

Those BFG tires look nice, but they are a bit outside of my price range. I was hoping to get some budget "UHP" tires to start with and upgrade later down the road with really nice rubber. I don't know much about the two tires that I linked to in my original post, other than I've had a good experience with Hankook Ventus tires in the past, but they both seemed to score well in performance reviews in acceleration, braking, wet performance, and decent lateral G's.

Are 215 tires really that ridiculous for our cars? I've had an older Ventus line and those Falkens on the Lancer, and have always felt that a smidge wider would help performance characteristics all around. We'll see how she feels once I get an alignment that isn't the "stock recommended" crap. I always felt that the stock specs were poor, but I never knew exactly how to improve upon it so just accepted it as par for the course.

Thanks again guys,
Zach

[contraption22]

Tires really make all the difference in the world. I know some people will spend much money and and many hours on the greatest parts for their suspension and then compromise on tires. It's like training for a a marathon and showing up to race in bedroom slippers.

[Mudman]

I totally agree, they are the direct connection between your car and the road. That, in itself, should be taken very seriously. My bank cannot take things that seriously at the moment haha. With the expense of upgrading my rims, I just can NOT afford top-line rubber at this time. I can, however, get my wheels and tires of the appropriate size, and then save to get the best rubber available. If I had it in my ability, I would not skimp on any parts that ever saw my Lancer. Sadly, the world is expensive.

[Mudman]

Here is a great tool for comparing wheel dimensions and tire sizes.

Put your current specs on the left, your new specs on the right, and it will spit out a good estimate of your clearances.

https://www.rimsntires.com/specspro.jsp

By the way, thank you for this link. It is incredibly helpful and I've already gained a better understanding of wheel geometry just by playing with it. It's been bookmarked =]

[GLHNSLHT2]

No, 215's aren't rediculous. 225's aren't out of the question either as they came stock on the CS and ShelbyZ daytona. Some have shoved 245's under the car but I never hear how much negative camber they can run which probably isn't much and the 245's are then doing nothing.

[Mudman]

Okayyy. I would love for you guys to take a look at what I have come up with. Below is a link of wheel sizing compared between OEM and my target wheel setup.

http://www.rimsntires.com/specspro.j...&text1=&text2=

I don't plan on really ever going larger or wider on the tires, so if this setup actually will work as it says, I will be a happy camper.

The chart comparison says that this will fit on my car just dandy, assuming I have about a half inch of room for my wheel to stick out the fender, and I'm pretty sure that I do. I wanted to get some experienced members to take a look and see what they think. Thanks for your help guys!
(This is for an '89 LS)

-Zach

[GLHNSLHT2]

Go up to a 225/50 17"x7.5 and go with a 35mm offset. I say this because the high performance daytona's came with a 225/50 15 with a 40mm offset. And they'll clear all the suspension components with all the street camber you want to run just fine. So if you go with a 225/50 17" and a 35mm offset, your suspension clearance stays the same as the 225/50 15's as well as your overall height to the stock 205/60's

[Mudman]

Hey GLH,

Just to disarm any possible reactions, these questions are not arguments. I just want to gain a better understanding of where you're coming from =] When I compare a 205/60R15 with a 225/50R17, I end up with a wheel that is 1.2" taller than OEM. Seeing as the wheel is then taller, wouldn't this make a larger difference of travel distance at the top of the wheel when setting neg camber? Since the top of the wheel is above the pivoting point of the suspension adjustment, the top of a taller wheel would theoretically travel further for the same amount of camber adjustment, coming in contact with the front strut earlier.

My current wheels didn't have a lot of clearance at the strut already, and I'd be concerned with stuffing a larger wheel in there. Did those Daytona's have the later style hub assemblies? I've heard they produce better suspension geometry and I'm wondering if this was part of the reason they ran those sizes? (That last bit is completely uneducated and I admit it, just a thought.)

With the +35 offset, the calculator shows that I would be 5mm (.2") closer to the suspension, which is honestly enough to negate my ability to set good camber I think.

The problem I'm having with all of this, is that my current wheels are 15" unidentified Mopar rims. I believe they came off of a mini-van and have a double spoke design with center caps that completely cover the lugs. They're 6" wide but I do not know the offset.

It's going to be about a month before I can drop the cash for my wheels/tires, so I'm trying to learn as much as possible in order to make an educated decision. Thank you again for all your help and input.

-Zach

[Mudman]

I believe I have decided which tires I will be getting at this point. After much, MUCH research, I believe that BFGoodrich g-Force COMP-2 A/S will be a great match up for my needs. This is my daily driver, and although I also want performance, I am more than willing to sacrifice a little dry-weather 'stick' for all-year safety. Plus, these are high quality tires with great performance all around. The price is a bit higher than I was shooting for originally, but a little extra saving time (and some more babying my current rubber) should remedy that.

http://www.discounttiredirect.com/di...0&rd=17&cs=215

-Zach

[contraption22]

I believe I have decided which tires I will be getting at this point. After much, MUCH research, I believe that BFGoodrich g-Force COMP-2 A/S will be a great match up for my needs. This is my daily driver, and although I also want performance, I am more than willing to sacrifice a little dry-weather 'stick' for all-year safety. Plus, these are high quality tires with great performance all around. The price is a bit higher than I was shooting for originally, but a little extra saving time (and some more babying my current rubber) should remedy that.

http://www.discounttiredirect.com/di...0&rd=17&cs=215

-Zach

I can say that that is a very good choice if you must stick with an all-season tire. I did ride & drive with BFG on the Comp 2 A/S launch and back to back in the dry and wet with the segment-leading tire (the Conti DWS 06), the BFG did everything just a bit better.

[Mudman]

So the rim design I'd like to get only comes in +45 offset that I can see. To make this work, I'll need at least a 10mm wheel spacer. I have never looked into wheel spacers before.

Could somebody please point me in the right direction? Do any of our vendors have quality wheel spacers? Is there any chance this could cause problems/issues with the vehicle? Any help is appreciated.

-Zach

[DevoBuzz]

http://rbryant.freeshell.org/misc_products.htm

Fellow turbo mopar member rich Bryant sells 9.5mm spacers.

[contraption22]

10mm isn't too bad, but you'll want to make sure you have good thread engagement on your lug nuts.

[Rrider]

I was able to run 10's with some small diameter steel lug nuts that seat further inward and got full engagement. Regular lug nuts would not fully engage as the threads did not begin right at the ends of the nut and they didnt seat far enough in the wheel. IIRC they were the inexpensive autozone zinc plated shorties that ended up working for mine.

[Mudman]

Thanks for your input guys! This is very promising, and I'm one final piece of information away from being able to accurately calculate all my clearances, etc. etc.

One last question, and please ignore my complete ignorance (as stated I've never dealt with spacers before). However, I wanted to push my rear wheels out by the same amount I do my front. What options do I have to mount a spacer up to my rear drums?

If it makes entirely zero difference in handling characteristics, and I don't imagine it making a large difference really, then I might not even worry about it.

-Zach