What Causes Nonsense Fault Codes?

[2.216VTurbo]

89 CSX 51K miles, all stock save for upgraded exhaust. Drove it to our local club meet last night about 40 miles, ran great-until I pull in the Applebee's parking lot It pops a CEL and starts running just a bit rougher and a hundred or so RPM's high at idle. So I quick right it into the AutoStoned parking spot in case I need some kinda part they won't have anyway, and check the codes. I get:

12

61

72

Then a series of flashes without delays or breaks, that's not really a discernable number Check them again, same thing. My first thought was bad ground somewhere and all I really checked with a flashlight are the 5 major ones which are all clean and intact. After we ate and drank the fine faire at the 'Bee's, I reset the SMEC started the car and it was right back to the CEL. Checked again and it's pretty much the same nonsense codes again? Car made it home no problem, WOT is just fine, good power, no hiccups. Anything else to check?

[jonnymopar]

That's pretty odd. Is there anyone near you that can check it with an old-school DRB or a Snap-on scanner? Checking mine, I always end up counting the blinks wrong and coming up with a code that doesn't make sense. I swear, my turbo computer blinks faster than my old TBI cars did. Either that or I'm gettin' old.

Not saying that's what's happening for you, but at least if you were able to check it with a real scan tool, you'd know for sure.

[cordes]

I'm pretty sure I've gotten a code 61 before too. I don't recall which car though.

[5DIGITS]

89 CSX 51K miles, all stock save for upgraded exhaust. Drove it to our local club meet last night about 40 miles, ran great-until I pull in the Applebee's parking lot It pops a CEL and starts running just a bit rougher and a hundred or so RPM's high at idle. So I quick right it into the AutoStoned parking spot in case I need some kinda part they won't have anyway, and check the codes. I get:

12

61

72

Then a series of flashes without delays or breaks, that's not really a discernable number Check them again, same thing. My first thought was bad ground somewhere and all I really checked with a flashlight are the 5 major ones which are all clean and intact. After we ate and drank the fine faire at the 'Bee's, I reset the SMEC started the car and it was right back to the CEL. Checked again and it's pretty much the same nonsense codes again? Car made it home no problem, WOT is just fine, good power, no hiccups. Anything else to check?

Two thoughts comes to mind.
A module going bad or an eprom losing its marbles.
The surface mount components and their connections to the board can become compromised over time, as ~30yr old boards have seen measurable thermal cycles.
Remember, the 89 CSX (much like many Shelby products) were simply Chrysler "pull-aheads", as Chrysler offered upcoming technology.
Even though an 89, the VNT makes use of early run 1990 SBEC electronics.
FYI - 89/90 VNT controllers also have an EE chip issue that causes them to arm the SAM (Security Alarm Module) bit in the software that stops the car from starting.
What's unique about this issue is that it occurs on cars that do not have a security alarm module.


The second can be a corrupted area of code.
In this case the diagnostic logic is not directly tied to engine function and means the error would be isolated to diagnostic reporting.
Eproms to go bad as those who program them realize when they come across one that can not be fully erased or verified after programming them.
When this occurs in the vehicle you can get what your experiencing.

No guarantees but the above may be something to consider.

[2.216VTurbo]

Thanks for the detailed explanation DIGITS, I'm pretty sure I'm picking up what you're laying down Ideally, I'd like to run that 14PSI VNT cal you mentioned in another thread that netted you 13.60's with just a cat delete. But I'd also like to leave the stock SBEC unmodded and use another and if I've undedrstood you right, I need a VNT specific module to make that happen? A socketed one no less. I don't have the socketing equipment and though I could just purchase that stuff, I don't like tinkering with electrical and never will. I'd rather pull a trans

[88C/S]

Try this link http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/...happening.html and go to post #8. I would get a 66 with my CSX.

[2.216VTurbo]

Try this link http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/...happening.html and go to post #8. I would get a 66 with my CSX.

I appreciate the link however, I haven't clicked on TD in many years, not gonna start now.

[88C/S]

Here you go:

Part 1: Chrysler Domestic vehicles

CODES/Meaning

88 display used for start or test(will only be seen using a DRB2 scanner)
11 camshaft signal or ignition signal, no reference signal during cranking
12 memory to controller has been cleared within 50-100 engine starts
13 map sensor vacuum, no change from start to run or output voltage does not equal throttle position
14 map voltage too high or too low
15 vehicle speed sensor, no signal detected
16 knock sensor circuit. open or short detected
17 low engine temperature, possible thermostat fault
21 oxygen sensor signal, neither rich or lean detected
22 coolant sensor voltage low/high
23 air charge voltage high/low detected
24 throttle position sensor voltage high/low
25 automatic idle speed motor driver circuit, short or open detected
26 injectors 1,2,3 peak current not reached, problem in injector control circuits cylinder 1 and/or 2.
27 injector control circuit does not respond to control signal, problem in injector control circuits 3 and/or 4
31 purge solenoid circuit, open or short detected
32 egr solenoid circuit, open or short detected
33 a/c clutch relay circuit, open or short detected
34 speed control servo solenoid, open or short detected
35 radiator fan control relay circuit, open or short detected
36 wastegate solenoid, open or short detected
37 part throttle unlock(PTU) circuit, open or short detected
41 charging system circuit not responding to control signal, alternator field circuit not switching properly
42 fuel pump or auto shutdown (ASD) relay voltage sensed at controller
42 Z1 voltage sense
43 ignition control circuit not responding
44 battery temperature voltage circuit problem
45 turbo boost limit exceeded-map sensor detects overboost
46 battery voltage too high..overcharging
47 battery voltage too low...battery voltage low or charging output low
51 air/fuel at limit
51 lean exhaust indication, O2 voltage latched below .450 volts
52 logic module fault
52 rich exhaust indication, O2 voltage latched above .450 volts
53 internal controller failure (normal code on a re-calibrated controller)
54 fuel sync signal not detected during cranking
55 end of message
61 baro read solenoid, open or short detected
62 emr mileage not stored
63 eeprom write denied
64 flex fuel sensor signal out of range
64 VNT solenoid #1 circuit
65 manifold tuning valve, open or short detected
65 VNT solenoid #2 circuit
66 no ccd messages
67 VNT "A" side failure
76 ballast bypass relay, open or short detected
77 speed control relay, open or short detected

[5DIGITS]

Thanks for the detailed explanation DIGITS, I'm pretty sure I'm picking up what you're laying down Ideally, I'd like to run that 14PSI VNT cal you mentioned in another thread that netted you 13.60's with just a cat delete. But I'd also like to leave the stock SBEC unmodded and use another and if I've understood you right, I need a VNT specific module to make that happen? A socketed one no less. I don't have the socketing equipment and though I could just purchase that stuff, I don't like tinkering with electrical and never will. I'd rather pull a trans

14psi cal is a separate topic.
Being earlier units, these modules were firsts of the production run from the Huntsville plant.
Over the years, I have unlocked three controllers for the SAM enabled issue, scrapped one and repaired several for board related issues.
Yes, you will need to locate a VNT specific controller as they were the near equivalent to a "Full Pop" (fully populated) unit and a spare module is always smart.

If you exhaust efforts and are unable to find one, we can entertain populating a standard unit with the VNT components and sealing it up with the production BiWax sealant.
This is not a simple effort and requires baking the module in the oven but it has been done with a 100% success rate.

[2.216VTurbo]

So I found a minor vacuum leak that involved the main vac line, it was just loose, a hose clamp fixed it. Disconnected the battery and the CEL and codes went away, car ran spry too No more weird too many flashes codes either Lasted half a day then CEL came on again and it throws a 61, Baro solenoid shorted/open. Getting closer!