L Body + 91+ Knuckles Question

[zin]

I'm a little confused as to how the swaybar would effect anything, assuming it is free to pivot in the K-member bushings, it shouldn't add anything to the spring rate, until there is a differential between the wheels...

I suppose if the bar is tight in the bushing and was tightened down with the wheels drooping, there could be something caused by the bushings... Am I missing something here?

Mike

[thedon809]

Theoretically the sway bar should move completely free.

[black86glhs]

I see it now. I forgot the center line of the axle moves the wheel and tire assembly up that inch. I was fixated on the lower control arm being pushed down. Barely raise the car a 1/4".

[OmniLuvr]

I'm a little confused as to how the swaybar would effect anything, assuming it is free to pivot in the K-member bushings, it shouldn't add anything to the spring rate, until there is a differential between the wheels...

this is mostly true, but i also believe our swaybar isnt as free moving as we would like it to be (thats why others have put rod ends on the ends of them). now im not sure if its just the sway bar acting like a sway bar, but it can be dang difficult sometimes to move the lower control arm down on one side with trying to get the balljoint into the spindle when doing a CV axle, even when both spindles are disconnected. so im not sure if this is bushing or swaybar bind, but i can imagine that both arms being forced down an extra inch (if stock spring height) would cause a light vehicle to lift slightly.

[Dr. Johny Dodge]

resistance in lowering the control arm to install the balljoint into the bottom of the knuckle is mostly the swaybar being twisted as you try to lower the one a arm + a little "grab" from the bushing

if both ends of the bar are unbolted it lowers with great ease

if you had a preload in the sway bar , ie one end is twisted up or down in relation to the other side I could see it affecting ride height but once both ends of the bar are reassembled to the a arms with the lower balljoint I see no reason the swaybar would effect ride height

shelby charger and turbo z the swaybar ends lower easy with a 5 foot steel bar sliped between the frame rail and the hole of the A in the control arm +150 pound guy on bar

my shelby z with the thicker bar needed noteably more effort to sepperate the balljoints - like 200-225 pound guy on end of the bar

ride height is dependant on wheel size , sidewall height and the compressed hieight of all suspension parts from spindle centerline to the bottom surface of the strut bearing mount

balljoint position won't affect the ride height unless so low as that the car sits on them instead of the tires

[OmniLuvr]

shelby charger and turbo z the swaybar ends lower easy with a 5 foot steel bar sliped between the frame rail and the hole of the A in the control arm +150 pound guy on bar

dang, that must be my problem, im a 125lb horse jockey... but i like horsepower not horses...

[GLHS60]

[QUOTE=Dr. Johny Dodge;1080758]if both ends of the bar are unbolted it lowers with great ease/QUOTE]

This ^^^^^^

Thanks
Randy

[AzShadow]

The first obstacle in gaining more camber is this edge. It is the first thing that interferes with the strut (you can see the precious yellow koni paint on it). Lets grind that guy off.






Now I know this is my no means any sort of precise measurement but it tells me we are trending in the right direction. Its a starting point. I have accepted this whole thing MAY have to come back apart for more adjustments.

Before

After (~2 degrees difference)


Now with this being done the upper slotted hole on the strut itself has run out of adjustment (naturally). I am going to slot that further like bgbmxer did. Unlike him however, I am going to open up the holes in the strut to accommodate the larger bolts. I have come to peace with molesting by brand new parts.

Now onto my ball joint issue. I ordered ball joints for a 93 Lebaron and removed my brand new Horizon ball joints. Turns out the OD of the press part on the Lebaron is slightly smaller and just slides directly into the LCA with no press....this wont work. After closer inspection the cut out in the stud is the same on both ball joints! (although the angle of parts in the picture is hard to see that) The key here is use L-Body ball joints and the larger bolt from the 91+.

Lebaron stuff on the left, L-Body on the right.

[rbryant]

Now onto my ball joint issue. I ordered ball joints for a 93 Lebaron and removed my brand new Horizon ball joints. Turns out the OD of the press part on the Lebaron is slightly smaller and just slides directly into the LCA with no press....this wont work. After closer inspection the cut out in the stud is the same on both ball joints! (although the angle of parts in the picture is hard to see that) The key here is use L-Body ball joints and the larger bolt from the 91+.

Lebaron stuff on the left, L-Body on the right.

85-90 ball joints are the same for Lbody and Kplatform cars (83 and 84 are probably also the same). Basically all of the fairly modern stamped steel control arm ball joints are the same. This includes the stamped stub strut and stamped dual pivot.

The 91+ ball joints are different. I believe that the Neon also uses the same ball joints as our cars in some years (it also might be a cast neon vs stamped neon difference).

I didn't notice the OD difference but the snap ring height is different for the stamped and cast ball joints.

-Rich

[bgbmxer]

I have found that 90 percent of the bolts they send with ball joints never fit and I just use the old one and throw the new one away. Enlarging the holes in the struts is just as good as what I did also. I just don't like seeing people use the little bolts with the different spindles it's dumb in my opinion. Also if u look at my pictures you will see the key stock we welded to the top of the strut. You might also want to do this your alignment guy will thank you.

[AzShadow]

quick update. struts have been modified (holes enlarged to 91+ spec, and top hole slot elongated). The car has been mostly reassembled and set to MAX negative camber adjust. Using my Watkins Smart Camber gauge I am 0.7 and 1.0 degrees of positive camber.....

There is some material i can still remove from the knuckle and the top hole can be elongated further but I'm not sure if that will give me my desired results (Negative 1 degree min). I may have to slot the bottom hole as well.

[bgbmxer]

quick update. struts have been modified (holes enlarged to 91+ spec, and top hole slot elongated). The car has been mostly reassembled and set to MAX negative camber adjust. Using my Watkins Smart Camber gauge I am 0.7 and 1.0 degrees of positive camber.....

There is some material i can still remove from the knuckle and the top hole can be elongated further but I'm not sure if that will give me my desired results (Negative 1 degree min). I may have to slot the bottom hole as well.

Grind more and slot more. Look at my pictures compared to yours. I would avoid slotting the bottom hole.