This car is the wifes daily and she does not like the stock program. Sounds like she's a boost button stage III fan.
This car is the wifes daily and she does not like the stock program. Sounds like she's a boost button stage III fan.
Well this ended up being a computer issue. Had a 88 TII smec lying around and figured I'd try that. Bang on exact computer controlled boost. Not a thing wrong with the car!
Yes, I'm going to be "that guy" resurrecting an old thread..
Recently, for the first time in over 20 years, I decided to try using factory style computer controlled boost again. I've tried a little of everything through time. I started with an aquarium valve bleed before moving onto grainger valves. Somewhere in there I played with a pressure switch controlling a solenoid. But in the end I kept with grainger valves because they just worked and I was happy with the results.
I still plan to start a new thread for what I'm doing but I decided to first reply on this thread. This is one that I've looked back to before deciding to let the computer get back to doing its thing. I continue to review it to try and wrap my head around how it really all works. I'm wondering if there still are people out there that are interested in using the "factory" boost control? Are you successful? Were you discouraged and just went with an option that got a quicker result?
I know up until about a week ago, both of my two running Turbo Mopars had single grainger valves for boost control. Way back, this was just my only good option. Now changes can *flash* in a few seconds. I still kept going with old faithful. I also have a HDI electronic controller that I haven't even opened yet. I'm hoping to make use of some of the benefits of what the engineers spent their efforts on. Hopefully it will lead to something Knowledge Center worthy for those that want to have it without getting discouraged.
I didn't hesitate buying one after reading positive reviews, then seeing how it works for Wayne. I had planned to have it installed for Drag Week last year, but I never got to it with the overall scramble.
Here are a few reasons I really want to put some time into the factory control:
- Part Throttle control at a lower value
- Hi/Lo Boost off switch input
- Correction for Knock
- Boost by speed
Then something was wrong. Sorry but a shut wastegate to increase the boost weather it's mechanical or electrical is still a shut wastegate.
Ha, not taken as poo poo at all. I know there are options out there and I have already thought whether or not any of this time can be better spent elsewhere. I haven't gotten my more important project out of the garage yet this year and playing with this "started" as only taking a little bit of line to plump up the long abandoned WG actuator on my Spirit. Recently I saw two people who were trying to use computer control and I thought I'd try it out. I thought Ken (5DIGITS) had pretty informative posts in this thread. I think some of the reasons people have been discouraged is that most are using Turbonator/MPTUNE and there isn't any simplified instruction (at least that I've found) that takes that good explanation of the routine and outlines the particular tables/constants in Turbonator. The "Turbonator Wiki" section on fine tuning computer control boost was never completed on the version that I've found.
I don't really understand programming language, but I know scanning through the Turbonator code the T1 boost control routine still uses values that are listed under the VNT section. I think most trying to play with a cal using T1 Boost control would likely overlook/ignore the VNT section just like I did.
At the moment I am using Turbonator SBEC 2.2MTX cals, running a pretty much stock 89TII setup in a Spirit.
G-valves are simple and have good results. Multiple aftermarket electronic controllers have good results. I don't doubt that the factory computer is more than capable running a boost control solenoid effectively for a modified setup at higher boost level, with the benefit of the other engine data and protection.
i bet using a mac solenoid that tons of other people use nowadays on turbo cars would work well as long as the coil resistance is the same or more as the stock solenoid. those transistors that are controlling the solenoid cant handle tons of current.
the stock system had adaptive control so without disabling this, its hard to get the Boost level/vs duty cycle correct.
with T2 style boost control you can disable the adaptives by setting NoWastegateDutyCycleCorrectionAboveThisRpm to something super low, like idle.
with T1 style boost control you can disable the adaptives by setting NoWastegateDutyCycleCorrectionBelowThisRpm to something super high, like above redline.
Then you set FullThrottleWastegateDutyCycle C8is100Percent FromMap to a flat line at a specific duty cycle and FullThrottleWastegateDutyCycleAdjustmentFromBoostT arget to zero you can go out and hammer it and see what boost you get. write down that duty cycle and boost value. change the duty cycle and try again and write down that boost value and what duty cycle you got.
eventually you will have a list of duty cycle values and boost levels that result from said duty cycle.
you can put those into FullThrottleWastegateDutyCycle C8is100Percent FromMap and the boost control should work much better.
Note.... FullThrottleWastegateDutyCycleAdjustmentFromBoostT arget table isn't set correctly in the T2 style boost control. it should be the inverse.... the further away from the boost target, it should decrease duty cycle to get the turbo spooled up.
Brian
Originally Posted by turbovanman
Couldn't one just use a relay to trigger the different solenoid if the stock computer can't handle the boost? I would think some of the fancy solid state jobs out there these days would have no problem switching it quickly enough?
I can't resist posting on boost threads!!
I'm electronically challenged so I have to use manual boost control.
With a heater fan switch clamped in my shifter, 6-12-18-24 psi instantly.
I couldn't ask for a more reliable and fun system and it's essentially free.
Back to you guys!
Thanks
Randy
There is no logical reason to call an Engine a motor.
Randy Hicks
86 GLHS60
86 GLHS 373 : SOLD, but never forgotten
89 Turbo Minivan
83 Turbo Rampage : SOLD
Edmonton,Alberta,Canada
Originally Posted by turbovanman
I don't even use Graingers, just a bank of Dodge solenoids with brass bleeds.
Graingers can be a little fussy, brass bleeds have been rock solid.
Thanks
Randy
There is no logical reason to call an Engine a motor.
Randy Hicks
86 GLHS60
86 GLHS 373 : SOLD, but never forgotten
89 Turbo Minivan
83 Turbo Rampage : SOLD
Edmonton,Alberta,Canada