Priced a reman cardone computer at $196 bucks. Have to think about that....
Priced a reman cardone computer at $196 bucks. Have to think about that....
Installed a late model td solenoid and plug today. Now I get 12 psi part throttle and 7psi full throttle. This is progress. Going to drive the car a few days and see if this improves. Also just got the ac fixed and the car does a crazy swinging idle at stops.
Progress !!Originally Posted by going4speed
Although, the pressures should be the other way around.
This may imply that the plumbing is backwards relative to the DC % coming from the controller.
What nipple is the WG connected to (top, middle or bottom)?
What nipple is the intake connected to (top, middle or bottom)?
T1 control so I have it set up to the middle nipple of the new solenoid. Perhaps give it a week and then set up t2 boost in the cal. This idle thing is more of an issue now.
So based on the below being t1 on the second nipple NO if this was not working I would have uncontrolled boost right?
If you have it plumbed like T1 (not just at the solenoid, but the whole system), you will NEVER have uncontrolled boost. You will either have computer control, or actuator control. That's the main point of the system - it is a 'fail-safe' design. Where the T2 CAN fail to uncontrolled boost.
Then there's the TIII and '92+ boost control which is the best of both worlds. Interruptor-style boost control with fail-safe plumbing.
Hmm okay so I potentially still have an issue. I guess I'm not counting chickens just yet.
What could I change in the cal to test computer controlled boost?
Is there a way to set it so it would be higher than where it is now? Like duty cycle? The boost target is set to 16 psi but its not getting there.
Last edited by going4speed; 04-19-2015 at 12:33 AM.
The #2 and #3 in the chart denotes the number of solenoid nipples being utilized.
Directly from the vacuum diagrams....
88 and later turbo-I:
Bottom nipple - breather vent
Middle nipple - Tee'd into the line that goes from the compressor (or intake) to the WG with the restrictor between the intake/compressor and the solenoid Tee.
Top nipple (if equipped) should have a vacuum plug/cap on it
85-87 T-I and T-II :
Bottom nipple - Intake pressure feed
Middle nipple - to the WG with inline restrictor
Top nipple - breather vent
Ah that top ports supposed to be plugged? I bet money if I plug that I get 5 psi again.
So this is how I figured it out:
1989 t2 setup, smec, turbonator cal using t1 boost control. It works perfect plumbed like this.
For t1 boost control with a 3 nipple solenoid, the manifold vac line goes on the normally open port on the WG solenoid, the WG can goes to the common, and the normally closed is the vent. Leave the vent unblocked.
the computer cycles the solenoid (increases DC) to build boost not to send boost to the WG can to open it. That way if the solenoid failed to actuate you would be limited to low boost with the manifold signal going straight to the WG instead of overboosting.
That is exactly how the T3 and 92 T1 work. It should also work for the earlier T1, but may need some DC tuning...
I dont really think it matters if you hook up to the turbo or the manifold. Pressure is pressure regardless where it comes from.
But with manifold vacuum plumbed to the solenoid that is technically t2 boost.
What Rob said is 100% correct and is how you should have it plumbed IF the T-II option is not selected.
Please don't confuse the pressure source with a two completely different control architectures.
It's how the over-all system is plumbed that determines whether it's a T-I or T-II arrangement, not the boost source alone.
Although, a compressor source vs an intake source makes a difference on an intercooled vehicle.
This is due to the pressure drop realized across the intercooler and means the pressure supplied from the compressor will be higher than the pressure realized at the intake.
This effects the duty cycle required for any given boost target because the supply pressure is different between the two cases.
On a non-intercooled vehicle it obviously makes no difference where the supply pressure is sourced.
Really, there are 3 different boost control schemes available for these cars (not counting VNT, that would make it 4).
1. T2 - This is a 'source' control. May also be called 'interruptor' style. The WG solenoid is plumbed normally closed and as such, it has no fail-safe. WG Duty Cycle is decreased t raise boost.
2. T1 - This is a 'bleed' control. The WG solenoid is plumbed normally open. This is a failsafe setup because if the solenoid fails, you still have actuator control over boost. WG Duty Cycle is increased to increase the boost.
3. T1 (late) - This is a 'source' control like T2. However, it is plumbed normally open and has a fail-safe. The WG Duty cycle is increased to increase the boost.
So, you can use the 'T1' boost control setting in T/SMEC or T/SBEC and plumb it like #3. This is probably the best setup. You will need to adjust the WG DC to get the desired boost as the tables are setup for #2.
Ah okay I forgot about the pressure drop across the intercooler. I'm going to need more vacuum lines to run to the manifold source.
Exactly.
The VNT, on the other hand, is laid out like the old T-II (less the source switch solenoid) and therefore sol#3 functions like it should for a T-II.
In fact, when I finally desided to abandon the VNT and after a 14 hour straight conversion from 6pm to 8am conversion, the car was driven home and functioned amazingly well on the #3 solenoid alone, as a T-II.
So installed a stock 88 tii computer and get 5 psi. Do the computers need time to learn to get to target boost or should it just be target boost as soon as the car is warm?
The stock boost schedule won't give full boost until the coolant temp is above ~120F. Depending on the computer.
I want to try this. If I can't get this to work, I'll probably just go straight T1 style. I've heard the term "lazy" applied to boost rise with a bleed system, but with my stock SRT-4 turbo, instant boost would be an understatement. I could use some laziness in boost rise around town.
Jon J.
1989 Daytona ES 2.4L DOHC
2003 Neon SXT - gone but never forgotten
If it ain't broke, fix it 'till it is!
By warm I meant warmed all the way up. 5psi is all it gets. Grainger it is. There really is nothing else I can do to this car unless I replace the harness.
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