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Thread: Big turbo anti lag tuning

  1. #21
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    Quote Originally Posted by Vigo View Post
    Yeah, I've always been kind of suspicious about anti-lag that engages way before it can really spool the turbo. Seems to me like the hot ticket would be to optimize the airflow potential of the engine (which means as much timing as you can get away with and NA-appropriate AFRs) until you are at least in the ballpark of when it is possible to spool the turbo and then maybe use antilag for 500 rpm below where it would spool anyway.

    If a good running engine cant spool that turbo until 3500 rpm (as an example) then a bad running engine (antilag) has no hope of spooling it at 2000. Ideally you would want to minimize the amount of time the engine was running badly and making no power trying to antilag the turbo to life and have the engine be making all the power it can until it gets to the point where anti-lag can actually make up the difference and get you into boost. If you start anti-lagging too soon you would actually be making time-to-boost worse.
    I used to be able to have full boost by 3500-3700. It doesn't now, now MAYBE 4500 in 3rd and 4th gear. first and second lay over on them selves.

  2. #22
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    Quote Originally Posted by forcedfedmopar View Post
    I used to be able to have full boost by 3500-3700. It doesn't now, now MAYBE 4500 in 3rd and 4th gear. first and second lay over on them selves.
    The only thing you changed was the ecu? I found adding timing in the map up to 5 psi helped acceleration and spool using e85. I tried to keep the afr in the 13.5 range as well. As long as the car responds favorably I wouldnt be afraid to add a significant amount of timing.

  3. #23
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  4. #24
    Moderator Turbo Mopar Staff Vigo's Avatar
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    I think you should tune it like an NA engine below 3500 and activate antilag at 3000. IF it works great, move the engagement point down in RPM until it stops working great. That is probably an oversimplification but my main idea here is not making your 'regular' tune (out of antilag) be all jacked up for turbo spool reasons.

    Keep in mind a carb GLH was a low-16 high-15 car with a 2.2. My 2.5 TBI aries would blow off sticky 205/50/15s in 1st. If your car sucks in first gear it's more about na tuning than it is about lack of boost because even without a turbo a 2.5/5spd L-body should be able to spin street tires at will in first gear. Maybe not your new drag radials, but it should still 'feel' good.

    Dont push the red button.You hear me?

  5. #25
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    Quote Originally Posted by cordes View Post
    From every thing I've read alcohol doesn't mind be run much richer than gas by way of comparison. Am I the only one who has gotten a turbo to spool quickly by taking out a ton of timing early on? I don't like doing that, but it will spool the turbo.
    This is where we get into the hall of mirrors, in terms of the dynamics of timing & mixture. Your experience may be the result of fuel burning in the exhaust ports yielding high exhaust temps (all from retarded timing) and causing early spool
    John Laing

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  6. #26
    Moderator Turbo Mopar Staff Force Fed Mopar's Avatar
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    I find that running richer as you go into boost seems to spool it quicker, even on a stock turbo. Keep in mind that E85 also burns cooler and uses a "richer" AFR. Stoich on E85 is around 9.8 AFR.
    Rob M.
    '89 Turbo GTC

    2.5 TIII stroker, 568 w/ OBX and 3.77 FD

  7. #27
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning


    That was good info, thank you. Not sure how I missed it. I will add some fuel down low after I load the new timing tables....if it ever stop raining. Thanks guys! keep the ideas/experience coming

  8. #28
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    Well, my timing table changes were a great success! The car is responding much better now! feels good again. I did not have time to try and add fuel yet but so far I am happy. Thank you for everyones help!

  9. #29
    Moderator Turbo Mopar Staff Force Fed Mopar's Avatar
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    Quote Originally Posted by forcedfedmopar View Post
    Ok, im going to start by increasing the Advancefromrpm map 5* in the lower areas. 1700-3000 then letting it climb to peak. If I add to this table it will effectively increase the advance frommapwarm table correct? as the advancefrommap Is the "base" map everything else makes its changes from?
    Easiest way to think of them is that AdvanceFromRPM is like mechanical advance, and the AdvanceFromMap tables are like the vacuum advance, in old school distributor terms. So basically the Map-based tables add or subtract timing to/from the Rpm-based table.

    Glad you are getting it figured out! If it's a beast on 93 oct, it'll be a monster on E85 Also remember that your knock on E85 may be much higher than your peak power point. IE, turning up the timing til it knocks and back off a couple degrees may not net you peak power, it might be 4 or 6 degrees below knock. Haven't run E85 enough to know for sure, but it is a possibility.
    Rob M.
    '89 Turbo GTC

    2.5 TIII stroker, 568 w/ OBX and 3.77 FD

  10. #30
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    Wish we got E85 around here.
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    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

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  11. #31
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    Re: Big turbo anti lag tuning

    Wish we got E85 around here.
    the stuff is pretty awesome, you could try to make your own? as long as the neighbors or police dont think your making moonshine (although you really are, just usually not that drinkable depending on where you are sourcing the ingredients from). anything that has "sugar" in it, but if you arent drinking it, it can be older "almost" rotten, or discarded food. i found a brewery by my house that will let me purchase there old beer, or batches that didnt turn out "right", but i usually dont get enough at one time to make a substantial amount, it gets cooked down a lot...

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