2.2/2.5 big plenum custom intake GROUP BUY

[acannell]

Quote originally posted by the Pope on Turbododge Forums
"someone local brought over there new TU header and it brought up some issues. They cut the old one / original one different than the new one. The casting at the head with my old one is cut at an angle to get the header away from the intake a bit more, the new one is cut level with the casting at the head and cut at an angle on the turbine side. Haven't measured it but your talking about 7-10 degrees at least. There could be a lot of issues with the newest run of manifolds. It was supposed to be test fit with a 2 piece before coated, the guy I saw last night. His has a big grind spot at the #1 intake runner, I suspect to clear a 2 piece. Tonight I'll try to get some photos on the heads and see what were looking at. But what I can see from last night they all need to be angle machined at the heads to get where the old castings were. They shouldn't run a standard SV anyway, all should be running the ATP type or band clamp from other turbos anyway. As the turbo is offset anyway. But make no mistake though, the cut is about 3/16" deeper on the block side of the old header."







Quote originally posted by me on Turbododge Forums
"Would you mind documenting the difference between the original TU Header and the most recent version and posting it. The machinist will have to have it to do the work anyway.

I have the most recent version of the TU Header but, I have not even started to install it yet. I've been lurking here for several reasons one being to follow this issues development. If I had the information I could have my TU header re-machined where it attaches to the head at the ports. I think the header bolt holes will be out of alignment after it is re-machined. They may have to be filled and re-drilled because they will not be perpendicular to the face of the machining of the header after it is re-machined. The bolts may not pull the header up against the cylinder head evenly. It would depend on how much different the cut is but this may be an issue to be dealt with."




Quote originally posted by acannell on Turbododge Forums
"unless there is something I'm missing, even a very small (more than a few 0.001") out-of-parallel between gasket surface and head might cause a big issue. maybe its more forgiving than I'm thinking but bolting stuff down where the bolt axis and the under bolt head surface arent perpendicular is usually not going to work.

Maybe try posting this on TM and/or emailing Chris directly would shed some light"


Does anyone else have any more information or opinions about this?

thanks Moparmark1 for the organization and effort to give this attention. But this isnt explicitly related to the BMF intake, esp. because the clearance issues appear to be most serious with the stock intake if I'm reading things correctly. Perhaps it would be more appropriate in the TU vendor subforum?

[Moparmark1]

Yes, I have to agree this is not the best place for the post about the TU Header. I'll go find it and copy and paste it there, however there is a issue with the clearance for the waste gate linkage of the hybrid turbo with the BMF intake. I'm going to follow that build 87wagon is doing and see if the z-bracket resolves the clearance issue for him. Maybe it will work without re-machining the TU Header.

[acannell]

kind of silly to post more pictures of the latest intake I'm assembling since they all look alike lol!

but moparmark1, this is your intake being welded up today! I should be able to ship it in the next few days.

I believe I can say that my welding is definitely improving. I dont even pay attention to "whether my pinky has support" anymore..I just free hand the whole thing, torch and filler rod, from whatever direction needed, upside down, at some weird angle, whatever. Seems I can control the puddle even if I cant see most of it as when doing the runner with the weld bead on the opposite side where most of it is invisible.

This series 8 aka 24 torch definitely made the big difference. For the price I cant imagine why anyone doing TIG work on manifolds wouldn't have one. I've been using the gas lens which is already tiny, but last week I switched to the standard no lens cup and collet, and its another 1/2" shorter!! And it worked just fine too, although it was alot harder to start an arc, but I think thats because I was also trying out the pure tungsten electrodes.

[acannell]

okay I take that back..I dont actually free hand the torch (well..sometimes but very rarely), I guess whats different now is that I seem to always, easily, and second-naturedly, have whatever support I need without struggling to find a stable setup..it all just goes like NBD (no big deal)..

[acannell]

okay I take that back again..turns out I do free hand both the torch and filler rod simultaneously quite a bit..I guess the take away is that I am much more comfortable and dont really notice the mechanics of what I have to do to lay down good beads....doesnt really matter cause nobody is reading this anyway and I'm just talking to myself..

[GLHNSLHT2]

I'm reading it. Let's see some pics of the latest bead work instead of just the parts put together

[acannell]

I'm reading it. Let's see some pics of the latest bead work instead of just the parts put together

okay but keep in mind that just because I'm getting better does not mean I am able to guarantee a cosmetically appealing bead consistently..thats "the next level" I think..

right now they turn out pretty good the majority of the time but I change positions and angles so much they dont always blend into each other

the weld at the bottom of the pic, from 7 oclock to 3 oclock was done totally free hand (torch and filler)

if your main concern is the weld flatness at the end plates thats quite a different beast than the runners..different torch and different material thicknesses

and of course the pic is right after welding without any brushing so thats why there are soot marks and such..

[GLHNSLHT2]

Those welds look really good. Do me a favor when you get to mine. Don't brush them. Leave them sooty.

- - - Updated - - -

P.S. keep the weld pics coming

[acannell]

Those welds look really good. Do me a favor when you get to mine. Don't brush them. Leave them sooty.

- - - Updated - - -

P.S. keep the weld pics coming

thanks

I have to brush them to check the welds, but I'll try to be gentle

[zin]

More folks watching than you'd guess, me thinks!

I imagine that if you add up how many inches of weld you have under your belt at this point, you'd be surprised! I'm sure it accounts for a big part of the improvement.

Practice and pride in your work, goes a long way towards developing genuine talent!

Mike

[acannell]

MOPARMARK1, YOUR INTAKE HAS SHIPPED!

moparzrule DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
Shadow DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
k03hemi DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
GLHT_yeah_baby! DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
k03hemi SHIPPED/PAID IN FULL
Moparmark1 SHIPPED/50% PAID
k03hemi PAID IN FULL
GLHNSLHT2
tryingbe
88C/S
The Pope
The Pope
shelbyvnt2
omniluvr
Turbulence
LaserDad
iTurbo
Vigo
Old Man Jones

[minigts]

Agree with Mike. The welds look much better from the prototype to now, however they all look good, just better with practice.

[acannell]

Agree with Mike. The welds look much better from the prototype to now, however they all look good, just better with practice.

thanks guys

I cant stress how much of a HUGE difference getting the smaller torch made. The prototype was made with my huge 300 amp water cooled torch. You just cant control the arc and every time you try and make a bead you are crossing your fingers that it will turn out okay..probably wouldnt make much difference if you closed your eyes at the same time. The torch is just too huge and too heavy to get in close with fine control.

With the little torch, its like using a toothpick whereas the big torch was like using a hot dog. (???)

Practice is definitely making the whole experience for me alot easier on the brain as far as not worrying anymore that I can reliably make a bead without messing around for 10 minutes trying to find an angle, now its a sure thing that doesn't take any planning or special consideration, and instead I just worry about burning my skin off if my sleeves roll up while I'm doing the 200 amp welds.

[OmniLuvr]

my friend just picked up some cool looking "pyrex" shield cups, pretty sweet, you can see right through them to the tungsten, not sure if that would help? but you are laying down some nicer beads for sure...

[acannell]

my friend just picked up some cool looking "pyrex" shield cups, pretty sweet, you can see right through them to the tungsten, not sure if that would help? but you are laying down some nicer beads for sure...

Ive seen those too...I predict I will at some point need them, probably not for this intake, but for some other project. CK worldwide makes some very low cost ones that include a kit with super high performance gas lens too..something like $25..cant wait to have an excuse to buy one muhahhaha

http://www.ckworldwide.com/gas_saver.htm

[OmniLuvr]

ya, those are them! pretty trick to be able to see the arc, not going to lie... and reasonable price! also nice to save the gas when welding a lot...

[acannell]

Thank you Moparmark1!!

moparzrule DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
Shadow DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
k03hemi DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
GLHT_yeah_baby! DELIVERED/PAID IN FULL
k03hemi SHIPPED/PAID IN FULL
Moparmark1 SHIPPED/PAID IN FULL
k03hemi PAID IN FULL
GLHNSLHT2
tryingbe
88C/S
The Pope
The Pope
shelbyvnt2
omniluvr
Turbulence
LaserDad
iTurbo
Vigo
Old Man Jones

[k03hemi]

2nd intake arrived safe and sound.

[BoostedDrummer]

I keep coming back to this thread telling myself "no, no save your money!", youre deployed to save as much money as possible, but its too awesome of an intake lol. The head on my Omni is already ported and polished with oversized valves, etc. and it is port matched to a shelby 2 piece. I want to convert to E85 and maybe bigger throttle body and make the big numbers, which im already at 324whp now. So, my questions would be (1) would the runners likely need to be port matched to the head as well and (2) what sort of gains would this intake yield?

[acannell]

I keep coming back to this thread telling myself "no, no save your money!", youre deployed to save as much money as possible, but its too awesome of an intake lol. The head on my Omni is already ported and polished with oversized valves, etc. and it is port matched to a shelby 2 piece. I want to convert to E85 and maybe bigger throttle body and make the big numbers, which im already at 324whp now. So, my questions would be (1) would the runners likely need to be port matched to the head as well and (2) what sort of gains would this intake yield?

The head flange opening is about 1/16" over the usual stock head port opening size. So the port matching would almost certainly be 100% on the head and not on the intake. If you already gasket-matched your head, then you may have very little overhang into the port if any. I think. I suppose that depends on if the BMF intake matches your gasket location precisely relative to the bolt locations, which it may or may not, depending on how your head was cast relative to the bolt holes.

As far as performance, I essentially built this "to spec" and I am not the most knowledgeable person to ask about that. The plenum volume and runner shortness/fatness, along with the huge throttle body elbow, are major increases from even a heavily ported 2 piece. From what I've read, this may allow higher power at lower boost levels from a combination of effects. But as far as I can tell, only one person has installed the intake on their engine and is imminently about to use it, and thats moparzrule/87wagon. Stay tuned to see what he might have to say! Or others, please chime in.

When taking into consideration cost, remember you can always sell your existing intake to pay for a new BMF intake.

Also, the price will be going up for the next batch, I'm not sure to exactly what. I'll know in the next several weeks.

- - - Updated - - -

2nd intake arrived safe and sound.

Glad to hear it!

Your third intake is fully welded. I'm going to pack and ship it today!