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Thread: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

  1. #1
    Mitsu booster
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    Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    I'm trying to help my buddy figure out his car. He has a 1989 shelby Daytona. It has a 2.2l enforcer II long block with the stage II head, 475 cam, 53 lb injectors, walbro 255 pump. The turbo is a custom built one from fwd motion, pretty sure it is the enforcer III turbo. Foreward motion did the computer based on his specs. Inter cooler 24x8x3.5, HkS blow off valve, fuel pressure regulator, 3 bar maps sensor, 3 inch exhaust (with cat for now and muffler) 52mm throttle body, stock intake manifold and exhaust manifold, stock fuel rail. Is hitting 16 psi max, then the bov opens up (from what he tells me). It's slow as balls until it hits 16 psi at about 3500 rpm wakes up a little, and then it loses pressure down to like 12 psi. The thing fees like a high 14 second car.

    i am doing this as a favor for him, and I know very little about turbo cars. He is pretty discouraged as you can see he has a lot of work in this car for it to be so slow.

    any advice would be greatly appreciated guys.

  2. #2
    boostaholic
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Does it have a wideband? that will tell you everything, and keep him from hurting it.....

  3. #3
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    It does not. Maybe I can give halves on one with him because I want it for my car.

  4. #4
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    He does have a snap on MODIS, I'm not sure if that would be able to give him (or you) any answers?

  5. #5
    turbo addict
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    stock intake manifold and exhaust manifold,

    I would change those out. Find a 2 piece intake manifold and get the exhaust manifold ported.


    then the bov opens up

    Get it NOT to open under boost.


    Start with the BOV first.

  6. #6
    Hybrid booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Have you guys checked the ignition timing and cam timing?

  7. #7
    turbo addict
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Quote Originally Posted by tryingbe View Post
    stock intake manifold and exhaust manifold,

    I would change those out. Find a 2 piece intake manifold and get the exhaust manifold ported.


    then the bov opens up

    Get it NOT to open under boost.
    Start with the BOV first.
    What harry said^^^
    Your gonna hurt that turbo quickly from WAY overspinning it if BOV is opening up at WOT in boost. Fix this ASAP. Even removing it temporarily would be a lesser evil than letting it open under boost.
    Todd

  8. #8
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Quote Originally Posted by tryingbe View Post
    stock intake manifold and exhaust manifold,

    I would change those out. Find a 2 piece intake manifold and get the exhaust manifold ported.


    then the bov opens up

    Get it NOT to open under boost.


    Start with the BOV first.
    Where can I find a 2 piece intake and how much are they usually? Would It need to be ported to accommodate the 52mm tb? That should be pretty straight foreward.

    how do you get a blow off valve to not open up under boost? Are they adjustable? I apologize for knowing very little about turbo cars.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tbird232ci View Post
    Have you guys checked the ignition timing and cam timing?
    Yes and yes.

  9. #9
    turbo addict
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Check all charge pipe connections as well.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  10. #10
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor ajakeski's Avatar
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    You have big ports in the head, more valve lift and probably bigger valves with stock intake and exhaust manifolds. Add the big intercooler to that and that leaves a volumetricly inefficient air pump. The manifolds are restricting the amount of air volume allowed to move through the system. You're basically running a restrictor plate.
    Large ports and a big intercooler require a large volume of air to be moved through them. The volume of air needs to move at a speed that will allow the entire volume of intake space to fill with air. The turbo helps this process, but will only do so when it is spinning enough to make boost.

    A ported exhaust manifold and a large swing valve will allow the turbo to spin up faster. It will also increase the speed of the exhaust gasses exiting the chamber which will help draw more cumbustion air into the cylinder.


    There are a lot of other things affecting your system, but it appears the manifolds are the biggest issues.
    Last edited by ajakeski; 03-28-2014 at 03:50 PM.

  11. #11
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Quote Originally Posted by 85boostbox View Post
    Check all charge pipe connections as well.
    To make sure they are not leaking? Can this be done in neutral? I will take a video. I'm trying to convince him to take it out of storage

  12. #12
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Quote Originally Posted by ajakeski View Post
    You have big ports in the head, more valve lift and probably bigger valves with stock intake and exhaust manifolds. Add the big intercooler to that and that leaves a volumetricly inefficient air pump. The manifolds are restricting the amount of air volume allowed to move through the system. You're basically running a destructor plate.
    Large ports and a big intercooler require a large volume of air to be moved through them. The volume of air needs to move at a speed that will allow the entire volume of intake space to fill with air. The turbo helps this process, but will only do so when it is spinning enough to make boost.

    A ported exhaust manifold and a large swing valve will allow the turbo to spin up faster. It will also increase the speed of the exhaust gasses exiting the chamber which will help draw more cumbustion air into the cylinder.


    There are a lot of other things affecting your system, but it appears the manifolds are the biggest issues.
    Since it's topping out at 16 psi, do you think it is venting into the atmosphere at some point? He knows that the intake, exhaust manifold and probably an upgrade fuel rail are ideal, but he didn't expect it to be this slow upon completion.

  13. #13
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor ajakeski's Avatar
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    The BOV could be an issue. I would eliminate it for the time being and concentrate on making the car run right. Once it's running properly, add the BOV back to the system.

  14. #14
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Thanks guys. I convinced him to get it out of storage tonight. We will give it a try, and I will upload videos if we can't figure it out.

  15. #15
    turbo addict
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Quote Originally Posted by 94NDTA View Post
    how do you get a blow off valve to not open up under boost? Are they adjustable? I apologize for knowing very little about turbo cars.
    It should not open under boost, at all. If it does, somebody tampered with it, probably cut the spring or stuck diaphragm or something. You'll have take it apart and look at it.

  16. #16
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor ajakeski's Avatar
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    53 pound injectors may be a bit much. +40s are huge and flow about 46 pounds.
    All the extra fuel could be part of the issue.

  17. #17
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Quote Originally Posted by ajakeski View Post
    53 pound injectors may be a bit much. +40s are huge and flow about 46 pounds.
    All the extra fuel could be part of the issue.
    See, he has people said they are too little and too much. He did what he was recommended by fwdmotion, and the computer is tuned for the set up he has.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by tryingbe View Post
    It should not open under boost, at all. If it does, somebody tampered with it, probably cut the spring or stuck diaphragm or something. You'll have take it apart and look at it.
    I could be describing it wrong. We will take it for a spin. It is also tough because he is about 90% deaf, lol. I will be his ears.

  18. #18
    turbo addict
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    All else fails bring it to Warren Stramer. He will fix it in a hurry. He is in your home town.
    Todd

  19. #19
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    Quote Originally Posted by 4 l-bodies View Post
    All else fails bring it to Warren Stramer. He will fix it in a hurry. He is in your home town.
    Todd
    Is that the guy at the track I see all the time with the ridiculous Laser?

  20. #20
    Hybrid booster
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    Re: Built motor, big turbo, really slow. Please help.

    That would be Warren.

    What kind of BOV is it? You may be able to pull it off and cap the port, or make a quick block off plate by sandwiching a piece of soda can between the flanges.

    Pull the spark plugs and see how they look. They could give you an idea of how its running.

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