Sent out payment for the mold, should be 2-3 weeks for the first prototype to return. Once it's verified to work I have another 2 weeks before the mother load comes in. This will include a full gasket with correct height matching spark plug gaskets. I'm going to try and work something out with the vendors to include this product as well. I will keep everyone posted.
I don't have one but great work! Now you have to fabricate the tools for the Getrag!????
Make that spectacular job!
This will be bad if you get these done as a individual over one of our vendors...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Originally Posted by 85boostbox
Not sure why that would be bad... Competition is always a good thing for the consumer. I'd be happy to pull my name off that other waitlist and buy four VC gaskets from you so you can recoup some expenses...
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I've already spoken with Chris and have the go ahead. I made sure not to step on any toes before I went forward. He's fully supporting of it and he will probably get one of the first gaskets for testing. I would like to have his backing for the quality and fitment before I start unloading them.
I think many heavy Masi guys would kick just about anyone out of bed to get a new gasket. Reaper1 will be happy.
Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56
I'm not a Masi guy but will still tip my hat to anyone who brings a worthwhile product to market for the community.
Sweet!
I think it'll be great if somebody can find a tooling place that will make a mold to do this. Knowing what I do about tool machining, this will be at LEAST a $10,000 mold given the material, CAD design, tooling path design, and machining time. Then the trick will be to have that mold work with a manufacturer's process to actually mold the parts. Then you are paying for material, machine set-up time, and actual production machine time. In the end...total...I wouldn't bat an eye at $50,000 for the total investment to pop *1* usable valve cover gasket. Even after all that, there is no guaranty that the part will be worth a crap. Things work GREAT on paper...just ask the people that said the 787 would be a large snap-together type plane. Yeah...that didn't work out so great.
I hope I'm proven wrong. I do know what a quote was for another company to do this. It was WAY more than what I came up with!
One thing I have thought of, is to have a machinist remake the valve cover vent ports that came on my preproduction cylinder head in CNC billet aluminum for the production heads. This should eliminate the need for the 1/2 moon parts of the gaskets at the rear of the cams and make sealing the valve cover with good 'ol RTV a lot easier and provide a good valve cover vent solution to boot. The ports tuck right into rear of the camshaft recesses and should have decent baffling due to the design, but I've never run them. Thoughts?
The mold is being made, I already paid for it. I'm expecting another week or two before I get the first gasket. I sat down with an engineer and we made it off of the original gasket while adding .015 to both top and bottom and taking off .015 from the sides for 15% compression as my original was already compressed. The center spark plug rings are made at the same time with the same height so they will work in harmony. They have my valve cover as we speak and I'm going to give them my entire cylinder head when the first one comes for testing and any mods can be made before they make the rest of the batch.
Those numbers are similar to what we were being quoted but from what I understood Joel is friends with the guy who is doing this. I'm sure there is a shorter, less expensive path to getting the product completed and it always helps to have an "in" to help you save money along the way.
Chris-TU
Chris Wright www.TurbosUnleashed.com Chris@TurbosUnleashed.com 602-76-BOOST Tech/Sales#: Monday-Saturday 9AM-7PM MST Proudly Serving the Turbo-Mopar Community since 1997 TU is a performance, not marketing company. We provide accurate performance data on all our performance products. Fabricating data to make us appear better is just not our style. Do the research before you buy. ROCK BOTTOM PRICES WITHOUT THE HIDDEN HANDLING FEES.... -----HOME OF THE 9 SECOND FWD T-M CLUTCH-----
Certainly having an "in" is helpful. I'm all for it if this works out. I was just posting up a somewhat educated "reality check", so-to-speak, so people get an idea of what it takes for this type of thing to happen and the "real world" costs. I think it helps to illustrate why this has been a very long and tough road and why it hasn't really gone that far. The expense is immense without being able to do it yourself or if you "know a guy".
Something Rick reminded me of when I brought up the breather-in-the-endcap idea was that on a hard right turn the oil in the head will slosh to that side and can make its way into the breather port. I know this was an issue for somebody else with this engine already in the stock PCV tube location on hard acceleration (I think that's what it was).
I think a professional gasket maker has a bit of an advantage on streamlining (cheapening) the build process significantly. There is listing price, then there is real price. That is where the profit is. If someone is not worried about profit (friends) then it can probably be very streamlined. If you charge your buddy shop hours for all this the $ adds up but some small businesses allow certain trustworthy employees to use equipment during off hours and not charge for anything but what the worker requires for his time. That takes a 100/hr shop fee to 20-30/hr if your friend is being nice. Most of what Reaper1 is quoting is labor hours.
Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56
Chris you might be thinking of Quacks car. I had installed a Jaz mini breather and had zero oil collecting in breather on street but bolt on the slicks and it would fill the breather tank in 2 runs! Quacks valve cover had a fabricated tube coming out of valve cover and not the factory PCV tube that slopes vertically. That IMO seems critical in controling the oil (at least on acceleration). It became obvious to me why it slopes vertically for that specific reason. The underside of valve cover is supposed to have a baffle in place to prevent this, but I've seen some cover covers with missing or modified baffles under the valve cover. This obviously was a concern to engineers as evidenced by the different PCV locations, different style of baffles, and PCV tube configurations.
Todd
Yes, this is correct. The materials aren't that expensive, really. It's the labor and machine time.
Yup, this sounds like what I was thinking of.
im up for this!
but as you know i have a lot of high priority projects, so its just about what has the most interest. but this sounds like a very small simple item, am i right? any pics?
I'll try to get some pics today. I'll probably just start a new thread on some preproduction stuff when I have some pics.
They are pretty small/simple pieces though with a 5/8" hose nipple for venting the valve cover. I haven't tried to put them in a regular production head/valve cover but they should work the same.
If the rest of the valve cover is the same you could probably use the gaskets I'm reproducing and just carefully cut the half moon shapes off of them to seal on your billet pieces.
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