Puffing Blue Smoke

[DoubleD]

I have a 92 IROC R/T and every time I start the car is puffs blue smoke when its warm and taking off after idling or sitting at a light it puffs blue smoke. I rebuilt the turbo about a month ago and re-ringed the motor around the same time.(155 psi in all 4 cylinders after) Car has 105,000 on it. I have to run a catch can or it blows the dipstick out of the tube, running at 26 psi. I have replaced the turbo drain hose and that is straight too. Does this sounds like the valve seals are shot? I have the new seals from FWD and the tool to do them on car, just kind of dreading taking the valve train apart and want to make sure this is the problem...

Yesterday is stop and go traffic was really annoying with all of the blue puffing!

[trannybuster]

Not sure about how r/t but check your catch can hose routing. Would it allow any oil to be sucked into the pcv valve if the valve stuck for a second or two? Sounds like turbo to me, had the same issue with T2, and I changed out valve seals, no go. Let it idle then drop exhaust at manny see if theres oil wetness. I would make certain that it wasnt turbo before I moved on to other could-be's...

[turbovanman²]

How did you have the pcv setup before the catch can?

Blowing out the dipstick is usually a sign of excessive blow by. I would borrow or rent a leak down tester.

I've noticed on my head the valve seals like to lift, this will cause intermittant puffs of smoke.

Remove the plugs and look down the holes, if you can see clean spots on the pistons at 12 and 6 oclock, its the rings. How do the plugs look?

[DoubleD]

I haven't had a chance to pull the plugs yet, but a month ago I tore the motor apart and honed the cylinders and installed new rings, Last time I checked the compression was 155 across all 4 cylinder, but Ill check it this after noon before I tear into it. I am running a modified PCV set-up with a supra PCV valve I had a crude drawing before but Ill double check it tonight. The only reason why I think its valve seals is because that is literally the only thing that has been changed, when I had the head done this spring, I didn't replace the valve seals... stupid me. I hope the turbo is still good since I literally rebuilt it a month ago and the stupid rebuild kit is near $200!!! Problems seem to be amplified since I started pushing the boost on the car.... Time to dig in after work!

[turbovanman²]

I haven't had a chance to pull the plugs yet, but a month ago I tore the motor apart and honed the cylinders and installed new rings, Last time I checked the compression was 155 across all 4 cylinder, but Ill check it this after noon before I tear into it. I am running a modified PCV set-up with a supra PCV valve I had a crude drawing before but Ill double check it tonight. The only reason why I think its valve seals is because that is literally the only thing that has been changed, when I had the head done this spring, I didn't replace the valve seals... stupid me. I hope the turbo is still good since I literally rebuilt it a month ago and the stupid rebuild kit is near $200!!! Problems seem to be amplified since I started pushing the boost on the car.... Time to dig in after work!

Rings can still have good cranking compression but fail a leak down.

$200 for a kit? wow, expensive, shouldn't be more than $75-$100.

Pull plugs and report.

[Chris W]

If there are no signs of oil on the spark plugs or air inlet hoses and it doesn't smoke at initial startup it generally means the oil is present after the combustion chamber. This could be from the exhaust valve seals/guides or turbo itself. Is the turbo under warranty or did you rebuild it yourself? BTW- For future reference, we rebuild these turbos for $295. and that includes a 2 year warranty.

Chris-TU

[turbovanman²]

BTW- For future reference, we rebuild these turbos for $295. and that includes a 2 year warranty.

Chris-TU

Good deal,

[DoubleD]

It's a Turbonetics T3/T4 hybrid with the big shaft, so that is why the kit was soo much. Ill report on the plugs later when I get the car in garage.

But how would new rings go bad if they are maybe 400 miles old and are in freshly honed cylinders that are with in spec. I carefully inspected all of the cylinders and pistons before installing the new set of sealed power rings with the proper end gap??

[turbovanman²]

It's a Turbonetics T3/T4 hybrid with the big shaft, so that is why the kit was soo much. Ill report on the plugs later when I get the car in garage.

But how would new rings go bad if they are maybe 400 miles old and are in freshly honed cylinders that are with in spec. I carefully inspected all of the cylinders and pistons before installing the new set of sealed power rings with the proper end gap??

Gotcha, those big shaft kits aren't cheap,

Anything can happen, improperly honed, incorrect ring gap, not broken in correctly, using synthetic too early etc.

[Chris W]

It's a Turbonetics T3/T4 hybrid with the big shaft, so that is why the kit was soo much. Ill report on the plugs later when I get the car in garage.

But how would new rings go bad if they are maybe 400 miles old and are in freshly honed cylinders that are with in spec. I carefully inspected all of the cylinders and pistons before installing the new set of sealed power rings with the proper end gap??

While poorly seated rings could be the source of oil, I don't believe they are in this situation. There would be smoke at initial start up if they were allowing oil to get by.

You may also want to take a look at our Knowledge Center article located here:

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/co...ooting-Article

Chris-TU

[tryingbe]

Pictures of your PCV setup?

If you take out the oil cap, does it smoke?

[DoubleD]

Got 14 of the valve seals replaced and the smoking has seemed to taper off. Two of them were too difficult to get out by myself.

[DoubleD]

Seems to still push some oil under boost, so I'm leaning towards the 50 trim being a POS. Swapping to an HE341 or 351 this winter.

[DoubleD]

Been awhile but the random puff of blue smoke is still there. since my last post I have swapped to a rebuilt HE341. I have replaced the last two exhaust seals. Some times I will get a random puff of blue smoke if I sit and idle at a light for too long, I can also get a puff if I restart the car after it sits for only a few minutes after being hot. I am not sure what else it could be. I removed or replaced both items that I though could have been doing it. Anything else that could cause this? I will also sit idling at a light and smell the burning oil. I am stumped, maybe I should do a compression test again...

[turbodaytona87]

I had (and now have again) oil puffs when leaving stop lights and general smell of oil even if it isn't actively blowing large clouds. My issue (and I assume it happened again on a different set of valves) was bad valve seals. I only replaced one cylinder last time because it was the dead of winter.

[shackwrrr]

My spirit did this, one exhaust guide was free from the head and was moving up and down with the valve.

I also had extremely worn and broken rings. Some of my rings had groove clearance of over .020. Somehow it still tested 165 in every cylinder.

[kvnndvn]

Chris is right, that is what happened with my 89' Daytona Shelby. I even bought a TU modified super 60, cannot wait to try it after returning from deployment. Anyways, yeah I had oil leaking into the combustion chamber. I did not smoke on start up, but after it warmed up. It then stalled out, probably because of higher fuel flow and oil clogging it up.

[DoubleD]

Ran the car in an autocross/ top speed run this past weekend and I am believing the rings are not sealing anymore. Time for a short block rebuild.
Thread continued over in the TIII Section. I hope the blue smoke goes away then!

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/sh...Block-T3-Style

[turbodaytona87]

I wanted to update on my blue smoke issue for anyone looking for answers in the future. The first time I had a bunch of smoke, it was due to a valve seal riding with the valve (and I only replaced the one cylinder since the car was outside in the dead of winter). When the issue popped up again, blue smoke while idling, smell of burning oil, huge cloud of blue when leaving a stoplight, the issue was just severely worn valve seals (on the other cylinders that weren't replaced). All seals were seated, but I looked at the tops of the seals when I pulled them off and the hole the valve goes through was significantly larger on the the worn seals compared to the new seals. The hole edges were also torn up. New seals completely stopped the smoking/smelling issue. I also found a broken valve spring so that was good.

I took off the cam and used a universal OHC spring compressor and the standard Felpro umbrella seals. The OHC tool was much faster, and easier to use than the dodge/ford type tool that hooks on the cam.

[lbaonocsetr]

I have a problem similar. Dont know if its the seal in the stock rebuilt turbo 1 1/2 years ago or if its the valve seals in the head. Head was gone over when head gasket went. Started it today. Got sorta warm idle, lil bit of steady smoke. Driving big puffs of smoke at times under boost n not. Dont wanna tear turbo off if its not. If i pull valve cover would i see the problem n how do i make sure its not the turbo? Thanks for help. Sorry to barge in on conversation.