A few transmission improvement questions...

[Zoskalon]

I'm swapping in a 523 trans into my 1985 Laser and I have a few questions:

1. Are all the pressure plates the same? Do they vary between N/A and turbo? Do they vary across the generations? RockAuto part numbers are the same from 1984 to 1995. I compared my R/T's old pressure plate to my Laser's and they look the same, fit the same, but I am unsure about clamping forces here. (The motor might be pushing around 250HP eventually...)

2. What are some steps to help make this a comfortable ride? This is going to be my summer daily driver, so I want to minimize clutch chatter as well as violent jerking when quickly opening/closing the throttle. I always try to align the clutch as best as I can. I heard that worn input shaft bearings can cause these symptoms as well. I've done quite a bit of car work, but I've never ever taken a trans apart. How difficult is it to replace the input shaft bearings? Should I bother with it? Are new bearings all that I would need, or would I have to mic out the tolerances and potentially install some shims? RockAuto has the fronts and rears for about $5-8, so cost is insignificant and I do not mind dedicating a couple hours to do this job.

3. How can I improve shift feel? My 93 R/T shifts incredibly well. I can literally push and pull the shifter with one finger effortlessly, while my 91 Daytona with a 523 mandates that I grasp the shifter with a firm grip. Does the difference lie in the design differences between the 523 and 568? Is the difference between the years? Or could it just so happen that my 568 is in perfect shape while my 523 is in rough shape? The 523 trans that is going into the Laser is pulled from a 94 Shadow. So its got the stronger gears apparently, but I'm not sure if there were any other revisions. I'm wondering if there are certain tricks or maintenance procedures I can do to improve the shift feel, i.e. taking parts apart to clean out grime and oil sludge. I am doing the whole roll-pin mod, where you hammer out the old roll pins from the levers on the trans where the cables attach to, drill the holes out for the next bigger standard pin size. Both of my levers are fairly loose, so this will help in shifter slop.

4. Since I am putting a 523 in an 85 car, the bobble strut mount is off by a bit. I read a while back that you can get away with just using a long bolt to go through the stock mounting tabs and have the strut bolt to the outside of one of those tabs. Should I go this route? I'm not using a solid strut, I'm planning on using the one that came with the trans.

I think this is it for now. I'd appreciate any input any of you have. Thank you all!!!

[cordes]

1. There is a difference between a lot of the PPs. I would go ahead and pony up the cash for a TU offering. They are the best bet as I've found the aftermarket stuff to be a crap shoot even at stock TII power levels in a heavy car.

2. I wouldn't tear apart the trans unless the play in the input shaft is out of spec. IMO the TU units offer superb drivability for the power handling capability.

3. Good condition cables and booger bushings make for some good shifts in my experience.

4. That'll work fine until you're ready to weld in a new tab. I believe Jonny at polybushings sells the best ones I've seen.

[supercrackerbox]

4. Since I am putting a 523 in an 85 car, the bobble strut mount is off by a bit. I read a while back that you can get away with just using a long bolt to go through the stock mounting tabs and have the strut bolt to the outside of one of those tabs. Should I go this route? I'm not using a solid strut, I'm planning on using the one that came with the trans.

I reccommend putting a spacer between the ears, such as a stack of washers or a short piece of tubing, and running a very long bolt through both ears and the bobble strut just for the extra support. I ran a setup like that in my '86 Daytona for several years.

Also, if your car still an EGR system, there is a tab on the transmission above the starter mouning that you will have to cut off to clear the EGR tube. Lastly, if you don't have the transmission mount for the 523, you can notch your current with a grinder to make it fit the new trans.

[Zoskalon]

Lastly, if you don't have the transmission mount for the 523, you can notch your current with a grinder to make it fit the new trans.

I do have the mount bracket for the 523. Do I use the 523's mount bracket with the larger rubber mount? Will it fit into the mounting point on the car?

[supercrackerbox]

Yes, I believe so.

[Zoskalon]

1. There is a difference between a lot of the PPs. I would go ahead and pony up the cash for a TU offering. They are the best bet as I've found the aftermarket stuff to be a crap shoot even at stock TII power levels in a heavy car.

2. I wouldn't tear apart the trans unless the play in the input shaft is out of spec. IMO the TU units offer superb drivability for the power handling capability.

3. Good condition cables and booger bushings make for some good shifts in my experience.

4. That'll work fine until you're ready to weld in a new tab. I believe Jonny at polybushings sells the best ones I've seen.

I'm planning to put together a whole 'nother motor and trans next spring, so I will invest in a new PP, clutch, and flywheel then. For now, I have the option of using either the original 85 TI PP, or a PP from a 91 CS Daytona with a 568.

I figured if swapping input shaft bearings wasn't too labor intensive, yet yielded positive results, I would invest the time into it. But I might just save that for when I decide to do a complete rebuild.

I've got a set of used shift cables that I'll lube before using. I always go with polyurethane bushings too. I was wondering if there was something more that could be done on the transmission end to ease shift effort.

[GLHS0769]

Now this swap will require that the shifter assembly from the 523 donor car be used. The 85 shifter even though its a cable shifter cannot be used with a 523. Right?

[BadAssPerformance]

1. I might be able to piece together a spare clutch but you probably will need to replace it before you get to 250hp. I know I have a spare brand new TO bearing somewhere, will sell for whatever I got into it…

2. For stockers, clamping forces, N/A, Turbo I/II/IV and T-III each got a different one. Old trick was to use a T3 plate on a T2 disk in anything 8-bolt. Also, two different sizes (plate bolt circle) for 6-bolt and 8-bolt flywheels

3. Jerking when opening/closing the throttle can be modulated by smoother throttle input or by engaging the clutch ….to do the input shaft bearings you might as well replace anything worn inside as its all gotta come apart.

4. cables, wear, binding, etc. Stiffer bushings actually adds effort to shift. I have plastic (acetal) bushings and it is rather stiff

5. The 85 was an A525? Maybe just upgrade to a 89 K-member and control arms too? Or you cut the tabs off and figure out where you want them and I’ll TIG glue them back on

Now this swap will require that the shifter assembly from the 523 donor car be used. The 85 shifter even though its a cable shifter cannot be used with a 523. Right?

correct, needs a 523/568 shifter/cables

[Zoskalon]

JT, I responded to your post via the mailing list. Thanks!

I knew about the cables and shifter, I have that taken care of. Thanks for the heads up though!

[83scamp]

The N/A cars use a 215mm clutch(except minivans I believe, they use the turbo clutch), the turbo cars all use 230mm clutches. Unless they changed something on the TIII/TIV clutches I'm not aware of. So a TIII pressure plate should fit on your 6 bolt turbo flywheel. Now, if your car is N/A, then you need a flywheel as well. Good luck finding a 6 bolt turbo flywheel. Unless your going to push it really hard, the TII/TIII hybrid clutch from FWD Performance is tough to beat for street duty. It should handle 250hp.

[Zoskalon]

The N/A cars use a 215mm clutch(except minivans I believe, they use the turbo clutch), the turbo cars all use 230mm clutches. Unless they changed something on the TIII/TIV clutches I'm not aware of. So a TIII pressure plate should fit on your 6 bolt turbo flywheel. Now, if your car is N/A, then you need a flywheel as well. Good luck finding a 6 bolt turbo flywheel. Unless your going to push it really hard, the TII/TIII hybrid clutch from FWD Performance is tough to beat for street duty. It should handle 250hp.

Yeah, I really like the TII/TIII combo the vendors have. My mostly stock 93 R/T has it and it works amazing. It pumps out around maybe 250HP, and it held up perfectly with drag radials at a strip. So I think the stock PP with a fresh clutch should hold up fine for a DD until the spring.

[Sundance 6g72]

I would really invest in a solid bobble strut mount from KMPerformance or pollybushings.com along with solid shifter bushings.