That would explain why the cal has special standing-start pump-shot values.Originally Posted by GLHNSLHT2
If everyone interested in this is basically running a custom setup, then it's probably OK to ignore the standing start stuff.
That would explain why the cal has special standing-start pump-shot values.
If everyone interested in this is basically running a custom setup, then it's probably OK to ignore the standing start stuff.
Too many valves, Too little lift from the cams. However, full boost by 2K RPMs, is that responsive? Such a subjective question.
AJ (no More Alan) 84 Rampage RT TIII/568 Quaife 87 GLHS dealer optioned Red 16V Masi/568/Quaife
90 Masi 16V White/Ginger/Black
89 TC Masi 16V Red/Ginger/Black
86 GLHS #110 RoadRace Built 89 CSX-VNT Recaro Car
89 Turbo Mini 'Woody' 85 GLHT 'RedBox'
2014 Explorer DD'r 3.5Twin Turbo Ecoboost AWD and 500HP
My profile page has over 20,000 views, I'm somebody LOL
by responsive I mean blip the throttle and you get 2k rpms of gain. Or is it all so heavy you blip the throttle and the revs struggle to climb 500rpms.
No, from what I'm understanding it is responsive. It's not "snappy", but from what I've seen/heard it drives like a nice V6. That was the whole point behind the really small turbo. The one or two times I've heard one run it seems to rev like a stock TII, but that's just sitting there blipping the gas.
My build is 2.2L (TII crank), 8.5:1 (I need to double check that, might be 8.2) Venolia's .020 over, BC pro rods, 4-bolt mains, ARP studs in all the critical areas, TU "race" steel flywheel, Fidanza cam pullies (hoping to get an aluminum version of the stock I-shaft gear), RDI prepped head with all the goodies (except the cam buckets...they were out of my $ range at the time). I haven't decided on the turbo yet, but I'm leaning heavily toward a BW EFR. I'm aiming for the same type of power band as Alan (redline around 8500, so not quite as high revving). I might attempt something that hasn't been done in our community that I know of. There are a few that know what it is, but I'm keeping that card close for now.
I know I'm going to need a custom intake to make my eventual goals, but I want to get the car going and be able to drive it and get used to how to tune it.
I looked into the BW EFR turbo but couldn't find a size that I wanted. Which one did you have in mind? The t3 .82 I considered to be a bit large for a street car but I guess it would work for a drag racing. The size under that is a t25 inlet flange which is too small.
I am looking at the 8374. Yeah, it's friggin huge (compressor housing outer diameter is around 8" from what I can tell). My goals are 750crank, 8500 redline. Either using the .92 T4 TS internal WG, or the .83 T3 internal WG. From what I've read the cars that have run this turbo (mostly EVO's) have all reported exceptional response, good drivability, and boost starts to come in around 4000-4500 on a 2.0L. They are putting down the numbers I'm looking for. There are also a number of time attack cars I've found that use either this turbo or the even larger 9180.
I'm not planning to drag race my car at all, really. I want to road race it (track days), and do LSR type stuff. Silver State Classic is pretty much the end goal. I want a sustained 200+mph.
Yes, these choices are large, but to meet my goals I think this is my best options. It offers a lot of nice integrated hardware, and the design is a ground-up deal aimed directly at the performance market. The fact that the Ford EcoTec that was in the Daytona Prototype did pretty darn well in the Rolex 24, and set a new lap record around the tri-oval with no turbo failures...that impressed me.
Yeah, they are expensive, but given everything they come with and are capable of, compared to similar turbos that still need external peripheries, it's a good deal. Plus, I can add the compressor wheel speed sensor REALLY easy! That makes it SUPER simple to figure out how the turbo is working for the way it's tuned. Add an exhaust backpressure probe and you can pretty much tell if you have the right turbo or if there is something else in your system that needs attention to get the most out of everything. If I had the spare funds, I'd be ordering it tomorrow! I'm THAT sold on them.
Bump, since you're on a "custom cal "pause"" maybe this will get finished???
Maybe. I have to get caught up first...
The best way to understand the drivability of the Masi is to think of it as the passenger car V8 that Chrysler, at that moment, didn't have.
The Masi with its heavy rotating assembly and its smallish ports and small turbo (especially the compressor) was built to meet or beat the power curve of the V8s that were in the luxury cars of Ford and GM.
Yes, in stock form they don't spin up quickly but you don't notice that because of the torque. And, make no mistake, they DO spin, quite happily, and - for a four - very smoothly. It was designed to match the power characteristics expected of a late 80's 4 or 5 liter luxury car.
And like Alan says - easy peezy out of the hole, off idle. One day my niece called to say that she was going to Europe and that she would have to drive clutch rental cars there and she knew I had some and could I teach her - I had several cars to choose from, I chose the Ramerati. Made her stop on a steep hill, told her to imagine that there was another car tight and right behind us, that she would crash into it if she blew the start . . .. she let out the clutch and chug chug chug, no sweat.
Here are comparison pics - .42 A/R and center off a Volvo (IIRC what Boyd said) below and stock ISI on top.
Last edited by johnl; 06-20-2014 at 03:10 PM.
John Laing
"The sole condition which is required in order to succeed in centralizing the supreme power in a democratic community, is to love equality, or to get men to believe you love it. Thus the science of despotism, which was once so complex is simplified, and reduced . . . . to a single principle."
-- Alexis de Tocqueville
"One of the methods used by statists to destroy capitalism consists in establishing controls that tie a given industry hand and foot, making it unable to solve its problems, then declaring that freedom has failed and stronger controls are necessary."
--Ayn Rand
"To evolve, you don't need a Constitution. All you need is a legislature and a ballot box . . . . things will evolve as much as you want. All of these changes can come about democratically; you don't need a Constitution to do that and it's not the function of a Constitution to do that."
-- Justice Antonin Scalia
Thanks John. hopefully my 2.5 cast crank, Oliver rods, GT30R with .82 exhaust and external WG, Aluminum flywheel, UDP, Fidanza pulleys on all 3 gears and a BR crank pulley should be a little more "responsive".
I'm done waiting on the guy from work to finish welding my exhaust manny, just going to get it and take it to my pay guy.
I would be interested in that stock IHI RB5 turbo if you wanna part with it John. My White Masi needs a little upgrade, stock is a 12T compressor, with a 16T compressor they maintain stock-like driveability with a 35HP kick up top.
AJ (no More Alan) 84 Rampage RT TIII/568 Quaife 87 GLHS dealer optioned Red 16V Masi/568/Quaife
90 Masi 16V White/Ginger/Black
89 TC Masi 16V Red/Ginger/Black
86 GLHS #110 RoadRace Built 89 CSX-VNT Recaro Car
89 Turbo Mini 'Woody' 85 GLHT 'RedBox'
2014 Explorer DD'r 3.5Twin Turbo Ecoboost AWD and 500HP
My profile page has over 20,000 views, I'm somebody LOL
Is the exhaust manifold on that flipped over?
I don't imagine you need a totally stock Masi IHI?
I think my factory masi turbo is going to turn into a bedside lamp.....
Sure but I should wait until after I get this thing up and running and re-registered.
John Laing
"The sole condition which is required in order to succeed in centralizing the supreme power in a democratic community, is to love equality, or to get men to believe you love it. Thus the science of despotism, which was once so complex is simplified, and reduced . . . . to a single principle."
-- Alexis de Tocqueville
"One of the methods used by statists to destroy capitalism consists in establishing controls that tie a given industry hand and foot, making it unable to solve its problems, then declaring that freedom has failed and stronger controls are necessary."
--Ayn Rand
"To evolve, you don't need a Constitution. All you need is a legislature and a ballot box . . . . things will evolve as much as you want. All of these changes can come about democratically; you don't need a Constitution to do that and it's not the function of a Constitution to do that."
-- Justice Antonin Scalia
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