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Thread: Go Fast

  1. #1
    turbo addict Turbo Mopar Contributor Dave's Avatar
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    Go Fast

    Well we need to start seeing TM's going fast. It's cheap and it's easy. The ball's in our court here guys, we have the overall advantage of going fast for next-to-nothing and keeping it reliable. You can't doubt our engines and transmissions are strong.

    So here's my list of how to make that Turbo Mopar a freaking beast!

    (1. Open that exhaust
    (A. Buy an exhaust cut out!!!!!!!!! I cannot stress this enough. In all 5 of our Turbo Mopars, every one has a cut out that sits after the downpipe, and everyone has shaved 3/10 off the 1/4 mile. Better boost response and way more top end power, yo. They're about $45. Cheap, just weld it in, works great.

    (B. Port that exhaust manifold too! Our cars benefit more on the exhaust side. A big exhaust manifold will not only help spool up but also high end power due to increased flow.

    (C. Invest into a 2.5" or even 3" SV and downpipe.

    (2. Spark plugs...
    Don't ever use NGK Platinum plugs. The tips will break off and destroy your turbine wheel.

    Use the stock Champion RN12YC's. I haven't had any luck with the RN9YC's (a colder spark plug, supposed to be a track only plug). It would continously miss at the line, couldn't build any boost. POS IMO. Don't listen to the V8 guys. They're retards. As the boost goes up the spark plug gap goes down. Stock gap is .035" and stock boost is anywhere from 7-11psi. Hm, now if you're running say 20psi, at .035" how much of that spark will become distrupted due to the increased cylinder pressure? Probally a lot. Bring the gap down to shorten the distance. Helps a lot. W

    While we're at it, base ignition timing should start at 12* and work your way accordingly from there. That's stock BTW.

    (3. Intake
    Okay it doesn't help "that much" but anything will help to get that intake charge down. Put the filter in a cold place will it will get direct air. Behind the grill works best. Keep hot oil and coolant lines away from the intake/intercooler pipes. Try and keep those intake/intercooler lines away from the tranny and head too. Especially the head. The head gets hot.

    (4. Intercooling
    A stocker is only good for so much. At 20psi you can't even touch mine TII's outlet end tank it's so hot. They get heat soaked very quickly. Mine's even mounted as a front mount.

    Upgrade to anything from the stocker. Honestly, screw the stock intercoolers. Someone has yet to prove that any other stock intercooler will flow/cool as well as an aftermarket unit. Don't buy some beer or cigarrettes for 2 weeks, save up for an intercooler.

    (5. Intercooler pipes
    2" pipes work good for around 14-16psi, any higher I'd go with 2.5". Those should be good for as high as 28psi. Try to avoid any tight bends. Tight areas cause turbulence, turbulence causes a pressure drop in the boost, pressure drop causes the turbo to work harder, spin faster, and generate more heat. Got it? Heat = bad.

    (6. Porting the head works wonders. So I've heard. I'll post my experience with a stock head to a ported head.

    (7. Turbo
    Upgrading the turbo works awesome. Less heat expansion, greater flow, higher boost potential. Overall efficiency. Especially from stock. Ditch that T3 Garrett or crap Mitsu. If you have a mitsu, a Garrett is a great upgrade. If you have a Garrett your next best bet is a hybrid. Be careful when going aftermarket. Look at your long term goals and present confirguration as well. The turbo will have to match it. Ask for advice on here before buying a turbo! I got lucky.

    (8. Upping the boost
    (A. Fuel
    +20's are usually good for around 15-21psi of boost. People have used rising rate regulators to squeeze much more pressure and use the injectors to perform like they're bigger. I don't reccommend that. Use an adjustable fuel pressure regulator and just upgrade the injector sizes.
    +40's are usually good for 21-26psi. So I've heard. Anyone have any experience with the limits of the 40's?

    (A1. Pumps
    To run over 16psi it's reccommended to use a 190 L/Hr fuel pump or why not spend the few extra cents and buy the 255 L/Hr fuel pump. It helps.

    (A2. Regulating
    When adding larger injectors you'll need to lower the base pressure in order to prevent it from running too rich. An Accufab (new style) or FM (old style) adjustable fuel pressure regulator is what you'll want. I'd also purchases a 0-60psi Summit Racing fuel pressure gauge. It's way more accurate than the 0-80 or 0-100 psi gauges.

    (B. Boost control
    I use an in-cabin mounted HP Performance MBC. I use 2' of vaccum line on each side. It only spikes 1psi and doesn't creep. Complete control at my fingertips. Sorry I have ADD.

    The boost controller will aid in boost response and total control.

    (B1. Going past 14.7
    You have a few choices of going past 14.7psi (2 bar)
    1-A manual cut out raiser. This allows a certain cut out point
    2-A diode. This sends a false signal to the MAP sensor making the cut out point however high you set the voltage to.
    3-A MAP clamp. This clamps the vaccum line and again, allows the cut out point to be wherever you want
    4-A 3bar MAP sensor, which brings the cut out point to 29.4psi.

    (C. Beefing up internals
    Not really neccassary but advised.

    Folks have ran up to 28psi on the stock bottom end and made continous passes. I'm running 20-21 psi on the original 114,000 mile block and head. No parts have ever been freshened up internally except for the oil pump and rod bearings.

    It's advised to use oversized forged pistons and Clevite bearings.

    So to wrap everything up, get air into and out of the engine as quick as possible, get the intake charge as cool as possible, and keep your Air/Fuel ratio fat and happy.

    G'luck folks

    -Bryan

  2. #2
    turbo addict
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    Re: Go Fast

    Might want to add extra injectors under the fuel section, as well as water/alcohol injection. Both proven methods that are good alternatives.

  3. #3
    turbo addict Tony Hanna's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    +1 on the alky injection. 28 psi on a bone stock fuel system with no problems.

  4. #4
    turbo addict
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    Re: Go Fast

    Simon's detonation problem was what really opened my eyes to the alky injection. I plan on putting it on my car just as a safety if nothing else.

  5. #5
    Buy my stuff!!!!!!!!!!! :O) Turbo Mopar Vendor turbovanmanČ's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    Quote Originally Posted by Whorse
    Simon's detonation problem was what really opened my eyes to the alky injection. I plan on putting it on my car just as a safety if nothing else.
    I know, it suprised the crap out of me, dropped 2 secs at the same boost. Can't wait to install the Devilsown kit I bought.

    Bryan, if you had gone to SDAC, you would have seen cheap TM's destroy the skittles,
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

  6. #6
    turbo addict JDAWG's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    I have ADD.

    lol

  7. #7
    Garrett booster
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    Re: Go Fast

    I can't agree on the cooler plug causing misses. My car runs great on RN9YC's, gapped down to .028 at higher boost....and 2.25" intercooler piping is plenty big enough for anyone running under 11.0 ET's. dave St Louis had no problems running 11's on a 16V T-II motor and a big turbo, all using 2.25" stuff....car probably made over 400 WHP too....and 2.25" allows an easy coupling to the throttle body too.

  8. #8
    turbo addict Turbo Mopar Contributor Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    I know, it suprised the crap out of me, dropped 2 secs at the same boost. Can't wait to install the Devilsown kit I bought.

    Bryan, if you had gone to SDAC, you would have seen cheap TM's destroy the skittles,
    Excuse me? Skittles? So what is this, you dropped two seconds off by adding meth. injection?

    BTW this is just a simple write up, nothing too fancy or extreme.

  9. #9
    turbo addict Turbo Mopar Contributor Mario's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    SRT-4's.
    Mario Di Cesare [url]www.boostedmopar.com[/url] 1985 Dodge Omni GLH - The Original "BOOSTBOX" 1991 Spirit R/T - "Grandma Boost" [url]http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=270429&postcount=1[/url]

  10. #10
    Hybrid booster
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    Re: Go Fast

    Yep, Skittles is the newnickname for the Srt-4's

  11. #11
    Buy my stuff!!!!!!!!!!! :O) Turbo Mopar Vendor turbovanmanČ's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave
    Excuse me? Skittles? So what is this, you dropped two seconds off by adding meth. injection?

    BTW this is just a simple write up, nothing too fancy or extreme.
    Did you read the SDAC thread? its the new nickname for SRT4's, as stated,

    Yep, dropped 2 secs using my homemade setup I posted about a month or so ago. After some more tuning with it, I am sure I have a few more secs. Also, after next week, I am taking my setup out and running the Devilsown kit,
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

  12. #12
    turbo addict Turbo Mopar Contributor Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    Quote Originally Posted by turbovanman
    Did you read the SDAC thread? its the new nickname for SRT4's, as stated,

    Yep, dropped 2 secs using my homemade setup I posted about a month or so ago. After some more tuning with it, I am sure I have a few more secs. Also, after next week, I am taking my setup out and running the Devilsown kit,
    Dayum.

  13. #13
    Garrett booster
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    Re: Go Fast

    Dave, with your new setup & "alky", 12's would be a walk in the park!

    I'm tellin ya... once you start running alky, you'll wonder why you never did it sooner, and you'll never be without it again on a turbo car.

  14. #14
    Hoosier Daddy?? Turbo Mopar Staff Clay's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave
    Well we need to start seeing TM's going fast. It's cheap and it's easy. The ball's in our court here guys, we have the overall advantage of going fast for next-to-nothing and keeping it reliable. You can't doubt our engines and transmissions are strong.
    Are you the Tony Little of Turbo Mopars?????????
    Clay
    1986 GLH-T - Flat black......... learn it, love it, LIVE IT!
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  15. #15
    turbo addict Tony Hanna's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    Quote Originally Posted by TrrboJeep
    Dave, with your new setup & "alky", 12's would be a walk in the park!

    I'm tellin ya... once you start running alky, you'll wonder why you never did it sooner, and you'll never be without it again on a turbo car.
    I need to get off my butt and install the alky setup on the Sundance.

  16. #16
    Hoosier Daddy?? Turbo Mopar Staff Clay's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave
    (B1. Going past 14.7
    You have a few choices of going past 14.7psi (2 bar)
    1-A manual cut out raiser. This allows a certain cut out point
    2-A diode. This sends a false signal to the MAP sensor making the cut out point however high you set the voltage to.
    3-A MAP clamp. This clamps the vaccum line and again, allows the cut out point to be wherever you want
    4-A 3bar MAP sensor, which brings the cut out point to 29.4psi.
    so as not to confuse people, 2 bars = 29.4 PSI. A 2 bar MAP sensors range is from -14.7 PSI (vacuum) -> +14.7 PSI (boost), for a total of 29.4 PSI.

    Also, a diode and a MAP clamp are effectively the same thing. A diode is typicaly not adjustable, while a MAP clamp typically is adjustable. But they are both electrical mods, not a clamp on a vacuum line.

    and to run a 3 bar MAP, you have to have a computer capable of using it. The output voltage of a 2 bar MAP and a 3 bar MAP are the same, ie 0 -> 5 volts. So the scaling of a 3 bar MAP is completely different than a 2 bar MAP, so the computer has to be setup to run that sensor.

    clay
    Clay
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  17. #17
    turbo addict Turbo Mopar Contributor Mario's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    1 BAR = 14.504...or is it different for cars?
    Mario Di Cesare [url]www.boostedmopar.com[/url] 1985 Dodge Omni GLH - The Original "BOOSTBOX" 1991 Spirit R/T - "Grandma Boost" [url]http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showpost.php?p=270429&postcount=1[/url]

  18. #18
    Hoosier Daddy?? Turbo Mopar Staff Clay's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    well I know when I was in school a 1 bar was 14.504, but for some reason ever since Ive been into the TDs, everyone has always used 14.7.......... so who knows!!

    Im sure the sensors actually only work until 14.5 PSI, but Ive never tested it on a bench or anything.

    clay
    Clay
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  19. #19
    turbo addict
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    Re: Go Fast


  20. #20
    Hoosier Daddy?? Turbo Mopar Staff Clay's Avatar
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    Re: Go Fast

    there you go. 1 ATM = 14.7 psi, so somewhere along the line ATMs were confused/mixed/whatever with BAR. (by more people than just me!)
    Clay
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    1988 LeBaron GTC Turbo


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