Treadstone Intercoolers

[Directconnection]

http://www.treadstoneperformance.com...12+Intercooler

I like the design (flow) of the Spearco that TU/FWDP sells, but dislike the small core for actual heat exchange.

What's everyone's take on the Treadstone (didn't they make the stock intercoolers for our cars years ago?)

I'd really like a Garrett core.... but they can be pricey when all said and done.

[Warren Stramer]

http://www.treadstoneperformance.com...12+Intercooler

I like the design (flow) of the Spearco that TU/FWDP sells, but dislike the small core for actual heat exchange.

What's everyone's take on the Treadstone (didn't they make the stock intercoolers for our cars years ago?)

I'd really like a Garrett core.... but they can be pricey when all said and done.

Steve, That Treadstone 4.5in. thick core in the link pic is what I have in the Laser. the build quality is quite good on mine. The core fin count is just a Little bit less than a Spearco for comparison, but almost identical.

This is the closest pic I have that you can see the fins and the weld quality.

[4 l-bodies]

Steve,
Your probably thinking of Blackstone. Completely different company. I think I heard they were swallowed up by another company perhaps Valeo?
Todd

[GLHNSLHT2]

I have the TRV25o sitting in my shop waiting to go in my daytona I found on Ebay for like $250. It's a bad ---. Weld quality is good, love the fin design.

[Ondonti]

I am still not sure between the large vertical cooler or the 4.5" thick horizontal cooler.

My concern is the internal fins. Never seen a picture that seems very legit. Would love to see it.

I do like the designs. Imagine those prices and designs with Garrett cores.

[Directconnection]

Steve, That Treadstone 4.5in. thick core in the link pic is what I have in the Laser. the build quality is quite good on mine. The core fin count is just a Little bit less than a Spearco for comparison, but almost identical.

This is the closest pic I have that you can see the fins and the weld quality.

Yeah, that 4.5" one really flows well..... but at 4.5" I don't know how well my radiator will like that, hence why I chose the 3.5" in my mind, anyways. You think the 4.5 will not hamper flow through the radiator? (I removed the ac)

I am still not sure between the large vertical cooler or the 4.5" thick horizontal cooler.

My concern is the internal fins. Never seen a picture that seems very legit. Would love to see it.

I do like the designs. Imagine those prices and designs with Garrett cores.

What do you mean "still not sure between the large vertical cooler or the 4.5" thick horizontal cooler?" The large vertical as being the spearco or one that treadstone has listed? (I must have missed that one)

What pressure drop does Spearco test at again? 1.5 psi as well?

[30 PSI SHADOW]

i have a 24x12x4 in my rampage. ZERO cooling issues. although im running a scciroco race rad .

[Directconnection]

i have a 24x12x4 in my rampage. ZERO cooling issues. although im running a scciroco race rad .

Hey Bill, sorry I didn't respond sooner. I currently have a new aluminum radiator designed for a ford v-8 application (same ins/outs and filler tube location as our's) I forget the core size, but overall dimensions are 17-1/2" tall and 22" wide. 3" thick core with 2 row design (and 1" tubes) Nice looking unit especially for only $169 shipped. (universal model 100% tig welded)

What model one are you using? (part #?) I might do the 4.5" thick version if it fits w/out major cutting and w/out any airflow loss not getting to the radiator.

[Directconnection]

I'm also thinking of this one, which is their version of the Spearco vertical one I have, but comes in a 9" tall and 25" wide core. The Spearco I have has a 6" tall by 18" wide core, and the Treadstone 6" tall by 25" width core is rated at over 1400 cfm at 1.5 psi pressure drop, so that 9" height version must be about the same, but with added cooling capacity.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TRV-259S-Tre...item4aad44a0c8

[GLHNSLHT2]

The Spearco I have has a 6" tall by 18" wide core, and the Treadstone 6" tall by 25" width core is rated at over 1400 cfm at 1.5 psi pressure drop,

That's the treadstone sitting in my shop waiting to go into my daytona. But has opposing end tanks. I think it'll cool fine, and well it flows well

[Directconnection]

Yeah, my thinking comes from the 'ole Gus camp. Short tubes.... (for low flow losses) but lot's of them for needed surface area (and also low flow losses )

Shorter tubes would give the air less time to dissipate heat... so the 9" would probably be better.

Just unsure I want to ditch my Spearco for this......

[Ondonti]

When I say vertical cooler I am only referring to the largest one they have. I think that these intercoolers are all excessive for what most people are running. 12x4.5xwhatever length flow enough for over 800 at the wheels and the vertical cooler will flow much more then that, and 800 is conservative. Now, heat soak and things like that might ruin its cooling capacity but it will flow fine. I think the problem with the vertical coolers that Aaron seemed to bring up is that all that extra flowpath is great but when you start maxing out the flow potential, that is when you see the short core fail to pull enough heat. When you are using half the flow potential the air is moving half as fast through the core and therefore has double the time to lose heat. I believe intercoolers also have very little difference in flow losses when near maxed out and half or 1/3 maxed out so there is probably no gains from overdoing the intercooler. For a big v8 that wants to run low boost its a great compromise.
I will also remind that 3" intercooler pipes are good over 1250whp when you are running high boost pressures.

I do know that the 4.5" thick treadstone is a great unit for short blasts, but I know of an 800whp car that heatsoaked it before making a complete 1/4 mile. I could blame that on poor airflow through the front of the car and improper ducting. My tube fine 12x3 really seems to have not been one bit of a restriction and that style flows much less then an equivalent bar and plate. So that has me thinking that going with the 4.5" thick horizontal style will be excessive but not as excessive as the vertical cooler. I like the opposing endtanks vertical cooler but Aaron's commentary on intercoolers has made me back off.
Warren might enjoy the use of a very large intercooler but I don't think that is reason for people with half the HP to copy him.

[Directconnection]

When you are using half the flow potential the air is moving half as fast through the core and therefore has double the time to lose heat.

I understand that. I won't make any goober bench racer guesstimates to my power production once it's all tuned and running properly, but what cooler(s) would you recommend for a 16v 6262 that would see 30-32psi (most likely alky injection at that level)

I know that Spearco is a nice cooler and would do the job.... but heat soaking is my concern. (and probably be really pushed hard at 32psi)

[Warren Stramer]

Steve, The Spearco 6x18 will not cool your setup very well at all. I ran one of those for years, they would flow well enough but NOT cool well. That is why I had to resort to alcohol injs. with the old setup.
I have not had any heating issues with the 4.5" core, but I also installed a huge welded aluminum rad. at the same time.
And yes I have driven it on the street enough to find out.
I have come to believe you should install the BIGGEST IC you can reasonably stuff in the space you have, so long as the rad. will get enough air, and you dont have to induce any sharp bends in the inlet or outlet piping.
I know many will dissagree, but I dont think you can have TOO BIG of an IC.

[dixiedodge7369]

I think bigger is better too... But as long as there's still good flow. If you have a giant crappy flowing intercooler then that's no good. But if it's a high quality one with some decent flow then your golden

[Shadow]

Steve, The Spearco 6x18 will not cool your setup very well at all. I ran one of those for years, they would flow well enough but NOT cool well. That is why I had to resort to alcohol injs. with the old setup.
I have not had any heating issues with the 4.5" core, but I also installed a huge welded aluminum rad. at the same time.
And yes I have driven it on the street enough to find out.
I have come to believe you should install the BIGGEST IC you can reasonably stuff in the space you have, so long as the rad. will get enough air, and you dont have to induce any sharp bends in the inlet or outlet piping.
I know many will dissagree, but I dont think you can have TOO BIG of an IC.

Agreed with everything you said and x2 (I've had the same experience)

I think bigger is better too... But as long as there's still good flow. If you have a giant crappy flowing intercooler then that's no good. But if it's a high quality one with some decent flow then your golden

Flow is only 1/2 the equation.......IF that! Flow = Nothing IF your cooler is heat soaked. My twin stockers @ 450WHP and y-piped had No issue with flow, but they would heatsoak after 1 pass. IF I hot lapped the car I would loose 3-5mph. Let it cool and I was good again.

With the big cooler I've hot lapped the car 3-4 times and on the 4th run I was down Maybe 1mph. Last fall my routine was run two BtB passes, then let it cool. (more for the mtr than the I/C) Never noticed Any difference between the two passes. (power loss)

I learned that the Volume of aluminum (shear size and amount of build material) needed to be able to dissipate the heat at a rate that can keep up with demand is AS important as flow. So Gus was right IMO Bigger IS better!

[30 PSI SHADOW]

Steve, The Spearco 6x18 will not cool your setup very well at all. I ran one of those for years, they would flow well enough but NOT cool well. That is why I had to resort to alcohol injs. with the old setup.
I have not had any heating issues with the 4.5" core, but I also installed a huge welded aluminum rad. at the same time.
And yes I have driven it on the street enough to find out.
I have come to believe you should install the BIGGEST IC you can reasonably stuff in the space you have, so long as the rad. will get enough air, and you dont have to induce any sharp bends in the inlet or outlet piping.
I know many will dissagree, but I dont think you can have TOO BIG of an IC.

warren is correct. I dont think you should forgo the thought of cooling as THAT is more important that flow. If you go big, like mine, you will not have any issues. 25psi multiple passes,in summer heat and the exit is still cool...

---------- Post added at 11:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:32 PM ----------

heat soak= detination

[Ondonti]

I understand that. I won't make any goober bench racer guesstimates to my power production once it's all tuned and running properly, but what cooler(s) would you recommend for a 16v 6262 that would see 30-32psi (most likely alky injection at that level)

I know that Spearco is a nice cooler and would do the job.... but heat soaking is my concern. (and probably be really pushed hard at 32psi)

I have been pining after vertical coolers but seeing that every high boost small displacement engine I see that has metric tons of money into it and has not been converted to water to air, is running a long core, I have become disillusioned.

Those vertical coolers all seem to be used on v8's that run super low boost and need very little cooling capacity, have little space, but need big flow. When I see 8 second cars with the same intercooler size that people here with much slower cars are running, I begin to wonder if quality also counts.

Biggest intercooler I have seen that big hp guys use is the ETS 6" thick intercooler. http://www.extremeturbosystems.com/E...tercooler.html
People are actually making the HP numbers they quote, not crank HP guesstimates. Also, these are actually used on cars that take huge beatings even when someone here might say the core is not big enough (because they are using the same size with half the HP). People who can afford bigger if it made sense. Matt Monett did 1090awhp on the 6" Supra core in his 3000gt and that was only 32psi boost. He did 950awhp on a 4" core and decided to upgrade a few things and run a little more boost.

Look at what SFWD people are running 8's and low 9's in on 40-50psi boost. Heatsoak is something you need to fix by managing the direction of air coming through your front end. Ducting works amazing. Seen that on a nice T1 log car that ran at Bonneville (belongs to Stan). He spent all his time on that stuff instead of trying to make more power. I had read about it but never really seen someone go crazy and implement it on a personal project.

[Ondonti]

Example of what 8 and 9 second huge boost hondas run.

http://www.full-race.com/store/inter...tercooler.html

You guys are making half the power and running the same intercooler sizes. These guys would upsell customers to the next size if it was such a great idea. I thought about taking a 4.5" treadstone core, cutting it in half, and creating a 12" tall vertical cooler that was 4.5" thick. I have since decided maybe that was not going to help anything but my ego.
Warren is just barely using his intercooler's capacity so make sure you plan on being up where he is before pulling that string.

[Shadow]

Example of what 8 and 9 second huge boost hondas run.

http://www.full-race.com/store/inter...tercooler.html

You guys are making half the power and running the same intercooler sizes. These guys would upsell customers to the next size if it was such a great idea. I thought about taking a 4.5" treadstone core, cutting it in half, and creating a 12" tall vertical cooler that was 4.5" thick. I have since decided maybe that was not going to help anything but my ego.
Warren is just barely using his intercooler's capacity so make sure you plan on being up where he is before pulling that string.

Not sure who your trying to convince here? I think most are posting up results they have had with what Works (real world personal experience) Not just speculating about what something they saw or read somewhere Might do.

I tested the twin stockers to their limit, just like I've taken everything else I've done to it's limits before changing up. When I replaced them, I didn't want to Ever have to replace my I/C again. My I/C is prob good for 800WHP at higherish boost levels, so prob over 1000WHP on larger displacement on lower boost levels. It works Flawlessly for MY application and I'm hoping I don't have to change it up again.

Why would I screw around with ducting and directional air flow in order to make a smaller unit "try" to work as well as something I can bolt in and Never worry about?

I believe your overthinking this.............