'89 Daytona C/S NHRA Stocker

[ShelGame]

This isn't a new project, but since I don't really have a log for my race car, I thought I'd start one so I can share the history of the car and future upgrades and race results.

The Daytona in my sig below has been in my family since 1991. My father-in-law originally bought it to drive to work. Which he did for many years. About 1996 or so, the car permanently came off the road to be a race car.

I don't have too many pics of the car from 'back in the day', but here's a pic of the car ~'97 at the US Nationals. This car was an original C/S AGS car (2.2 T2 with the A555 manual). Not sure why my father-in-law painted the hood and headlight doors blue, but whatever. The car was basically a street car at this point. It had not been rebuilt and had never been apart. I think it had maybe 95k on the odo then (it has 97k on it now). He was #1 qualifier in stock this year and got torn down. I don't think he even made it to competition since the car had never been apart - he didn't have the spare parts to put it back together. They actually had to cut the downpipe the get the head off because it was so rusty. He was running ~18psi boost with a MAP clamp and a manual boost controller (with no fuel added! gasp!). It evetually blew up the original 2.2 - no shock, right? But, it went fast that way for many seasons.

I'll post more info later. Time slips, etc from the 2.2 MTX days...



Here's a link to the complete photo album I setup for this car...

https://www.dropbox.com/sc/71ykrgur7...QigE2m-rW4QNsa

[Vigo]

I am curious to know what it did.. will be watching.

[ShelGame]

He usually sandbagged the car at the top end during qualifying so as to not show what it could really run. So, there's actually very few runs showing the full potential. But I found 1...

Here's his qualifying results from the 1998 Dallas Nationals:

ENNIS, Texas - SUMMIT FastNews - Final order after 2 rounds of qualifying in Stock at the 13th annual NHRA Revell Nationals:

Psn-Num-Class-Driver, Home Town, Machine-------------------ET---Index--(+/-)
1 4426 AF/S Terry Dye, Troy MI, 90 Daytona...................13.522 14.85 -1.328

He ran a 13.52 with basically a stock 2.2 T2. Just using a Mopar computer, MAP clamp, and a MBC. Dangerous, but fast. Even on race fuel. That's a tenth faster than I've ever gone in it with the 2.5 T1 Auto combination. EDIT: Not anymore, I've now done a 13.54 in the car with the 2.5 T1 auto...

I'll try to find more. He did some testing where he ran the car out to see what it would do...

[ShelGame]

Found a video of my class run at the US Nationals last year. I'm the 2nd pair in. Crappy video, so you don't get to hear my time



There's a PT Cruiser turbo right behind me...

[turbovanman²]

Pretty cool history, thanks.

[ShelGame]

I need to go dig in his basement. There's more down there about this car. Times slips, pictures, etc.

I'll also be adding this winters make-over to this thread.

[ShelGame]

OK, so here's the winter plan for this car...

The car really needs to leave the line better. The biggest problem I have is being consistent at the 60' mark (well, that and the R/T - but they're related, bear with me here...). Sometimes, the tires spin a little on launch. Which hurts not only my 60' time, but also my R/T as the tires don't roll thru the beams as quickly as when they grab. So, with that in mind, I want to do several things to the car over the winter.

1) New tires. I think just getting new tires would do wonders for the car. Though, when they grab, my short times are as good as they ever were. Still, I think going to a larger diameter tire will give me more sidwall and a little more 'give' on the line. Which I think will help. It may slow me down at the top end, though, comapred to the 22's. But, I'm crossing at 58-5900rpm now, so I think I can give up some top end RPM.

2) Traction bars. Warrens setup inspired me and I thought of a way to make it a little bit better. I have a spare 1-1/4" swaybar that needs to be modified. Stay tuned.

3) Frame connectors and roll bar. I want to stifen the car up. Eventhough it's not an autocross machine, I think the chassis flex might be hurting me getting off the line. I have some ideas about the roll bar and frame connectors. So, stay tuned there, too.

4) Add lightness. Since the interior mostly has to come out to put in the roll bar anyway, there's no reason it ALL has to go back in. Especially behind the dash. Plus, by adding a bar, I can legally delete the rear seat. And, with a racing harness, all the OEM seatbelts can come out.

So, I've come to the conclusion I need to get a welder. I'll probably just get a Harbor Frieght deal, but I'll get the arbon bottle, too for welding in the cage. I don't like the flux-core stuff for anything other than exhaust systems.

[ShelGame]

Does anyone have the dimensions of the Competition Engineering Mustang Roll Hoop (C3125)? Alternately, has anyone tried the BrokeDick racing G-Body roll bar?

http://www.competitionengineering.co...?CatCode=11006

http://shop.brokedickracing.com/MOPA...DY_c_4939.html

[BadAssPerformance]

Sounds like some good plans consistency is key for sure Like Angelo running fatty slicks on his TBI Horizon

1) New tires. I think just getting new tires would do wonders for the car. Though, when they grab, my short times are as good as they ever were. Still, I think going to a larger diameter tire will give me more sidwall and a little more 'give' on the line. Which I think will help. It may slow me down at the top end, though, comapred to the 22's. But, I'm crossing at 58-5900rpm now, so I think I can give up some top end RPM.

For what it's worth, my T2 Shadow runs almost identical ET and mph on the 24.5x8.5's and 23x7's (both M&H) I have to launch higher with the 24.5's or it will bog, the 23's too high and it will spin

2) Traction bars. Warrens setup inspired me and I thought of a way to make it a little bit better. I have a spare 1-1/4" swaybar that needs to be modified. Stay tuned.

Traction bars legal in stock? ... how about straps? Your car is retired from the street right?

3) Frame connectors and roll bar. I want to stifen the car up. Eventhough it's not an autocross machine, I think the chassis flex might be hurting me getting off the line. I have some ideas about the roll bar and frame connectors. So, stay tuned there, too.

I do not think flex hurts a FWD like a RWD, at least on stock setups. Heck, chassis flex may help it hug teh track? LOL! Back when the Z has the 2.2L in it, it was a solid 11.70 car and by adding the 10pt cage it did not 60' any better and slowed down due to the added weight

4) Add lightness. Since the interior mostly has to come out to put in the roll bar anyway, there's no reason it ALL has to go back in. Especially behind the dash. Plus, by adding a bar, I can legally delete the rear seat. And, with a racing harness, all the OEM seatbelts can come out.

If you can come out lighter with the bar, thats cool

Here's teh S&W 10pt CM kit:

http://badassperformance.com/mrides/z/cage/cage.html

BTW... did I read the rule book right? You cannot port the manifolds, but for a turbo car you can run a header?

[ShelGame]

For what it's worth, my T2 Shadow runs almost identical ET and mph on the 24.5x8.5's and 23x7's (both M&H) I have to launch higher with the 24.5's or it will bog, the 23's too high and it will spin

I have a double whammy - I can't launch it at high enough RPM or it spins, plus I can't hold it on the starting line with the manual brakes. I even moved the brake pedal pivot and everything. Still too hard to hold it. With the 2.5, I'm not too worried about bogging the 24's.

Traction bars legal in stock? ... how about straps? Your car is retired from the street right?

They are for RWD V8's. The problem I'll run into is explaining them (if I ever have to). They will kind of look like a torque arm - which is also allowed, but only 1. I was going to put a link on each side of the engine down to the sway bar to eliminate the flex in the middle.

Have you seen Warren's torqe link traction bar setup? I think there's really something there. Completely different approach than straps. The torque link will actually tend to lift the front end, but only because the engine torque is pushing the front wheels down. Straps just keep the front end from lifting. I honestly don't think that is good for traction. I say let the body rotate, as long as the tires stay on the ground. You put a strap on there, and the momentum of the body rotation wants to take weight off the fronts when the straps hit.

I do not think flex hurts a FWD like a RWD, at least on stock setups. Heck, chassis flex may help it hug teh track? LOL! Back when the Z has the 2.2L in it, it was a solid 11.70 car and by adding the 10pt cage it did not 60' any better and slowed down due to the added weight

Probably not, but I can hear/feel the doors moving over bumps (that reminds me - need to add fixing the door hinge bushings to the list above). This car is really pretty clean, but there is some rust at the park brake cable hole, and some on the bottoms of the rockers. Not enough to weaken yet, but I want to get it fixed before it becomes a problem.

If you can come out lighter with the bar, thats cool

It'll probably be a wash...

BTW... did I read the rule book right? You cannot port the manifolds, but for a turbo car you can run a header?

Correct. I've thought about a header, but I don't know what good it would do with a Mitsu turbo on there. Other than make it more accessable. And, honestly, I can get the turbo off in about 20minutes without the brake booster or P/S pump on there. I don't really see much advantage to a header for this setup.

[ShelGame]

Some class winner pics from years past...

[Vigo]

Cool pics.

I also dont think the header will get you anything. Are you allowed to modify the swingvalve housing? What exhaust is on the car?

[ShelGame]

Cool pics.

I also dont think the header will get you anything. Are you allowed to modify the swingvalve housing? What exhaust is on the car?

Yes, the SV is ported. That was actually one of the first things I did. It was years ago while I was waiting for the engine parts to come back from the machine shop. That was 3 engines ago, but I still use the same SV.

The exhaust is a 2-1/2" DP about a foot long feeding into a 2-1/2 to 4" tappered megaphone (left over motorcycle part) pointed toward the ground at a 45* angle just past the k-frame. The whole exhaust is about 3' long...

One of the best mods I did was the PT Lifters. I switched to them 2 years ago over the winter. I picked up a tenth, and it's wayyy more consistent now. I think the stock (they were new !!!) lifters couldn't let air bubles out and were partially colapsing at higher RPM (high RPM for this car is 5500 rpm). Unpredictable valve lift is not good for the ET from race to race...

[Vigo]

I have yet to try those things but i REALLY want to. Probably in my spirit since it's the only TM i own that i rev past 6k .

Ive always wondered what kind of affect a megaphone thing like you mentioned would have.

[ShelGame]

I have yet to try those things but i REALLY want to. Probably in my spirit since it's the only TM i own that i rev past 6k .

Ive always wondered what kind of affect a megaphone thing like you mentioned would have.

It's loud, lol. Boost control required some tuning, but I have it working just fine under computer control.

[ShelGame]

OK, actually did a little work on this car today. The doors have been saggin' on this thing for as long as it's been in my garage at least and probably longer. For some reason, the guy that was racing the car before we got it back (long story) replaced the doors when he painted the car silver. We have no idea why. Maybe they were rusty? These doors are base model doors just like a C/S should have, but they were obviously marron originally. The car was black from the factory. Anyway, they were never aligned properly and the bushings were pretty much shot on the replacement doors. Also, they only put 2 bolts in each of the hinges (where they need 3). So, today I set about replacing the pins/bushings on the drivers door (pass side will have to wait for spring, I can open the door more than about a foot as close as I parked it to the workbench, and it's up on stands for the winter).

It was actually pretty easy to replace them. I made a cradle to hold the door upright on my motorcycle scissor lift and strapped it down with a ratchet strap. It took longer to align the door tha nto replace the bushings. Maybe 2 hours in the project including the 30minutes to build the cradle. Here's some pics...

[ShelGame]

Also, my roll cage parts came in from Competition Engineering and I picked up a couple sets of 24.5x8.5x15 M&H slicks from Jason Hagger. It's going to be a fun winter

[BadAssPerformance]

Nice work Rob! I need to do the hinges in mine someday too. Good idea ont he cradle for them heavy (damn near 100lb) G-body doors.

Cool on the cage! Cant wait to see how it looks compared to the S&W one. Definitely sounds like a fun winter!

[135sohc]

Looks like the welded half of the upper door hinge is starting to crack and seperate from the door shell ?

[ShelGame]

Looks like the welded half of the upper door hinge is starting to crack and seperate from the door shell ?

I don't think so. There's a rough sheetmetal edge there all the way down. Like a seam that didn't fit the next panel perfectly (big shock). I'd like to see another Daytona to compare. But, the door feels very solid right there. No real flex. So, I think that's just a rough edge, not a crack in the metal. Though, it does look quite a bit like a crack at the angle I took the pic...