Building an a604 to handle 1000hp? How to protect the input shaft.

[shackwrrr]

So, how far backwards and forwards can you go with the PCMs? What years cross... I know they're officially a bunch of different part numbers, but which are functionally identical? Which have all the same signals but different plugs? Which will work if you change out sensors for newer style ones? Which might you need a full solenoid pack transplant with?

If I found say a nice '93 Spirit, could I go to the yard and get a '97 CV PCM and wire it up? How late could I go, '98? '99? or how early do I need?

I have heard that the solenoid packs are interchangeable, The newer ones put the little monkey with the ratchet in a sound deadened room.

[RoadWarrior222]

Noes, how the hell will I know if a A604 vehicle pulls up without that little monkey!!!111 ... crikikikikikikik ...

[87turbodance]

I though that the newer ones relocated the solenoids inside the trans case.

[Reaper1]

Nope. Still outside the case.

[turbovanman²]

So, how far backwards and forwards can you go with the PCMs? What years cross... I know they're officially a bunch of different part numbers, but which are functionally identical? Which have all the same signals but different plugs? Which will work if you change out sensors for newer style ones? Which might you need a full solenoid pack transplant with?

If I found say a nice '93 Spirit, could I go to the yard and get a '97 CV PCM and wire it up? How late could I go, '98? '99? or how early do I need?

You could probably swap any computer you wanted as long as the TCM hooked up, not sure what year they stopped using the standalone TCM, but probably around the mid to late 90's.

I have heard that the solenoid packs are interchangeable, The newer ones put the little monkey with the ratchet in a sound deadened room.

Yep, I've done a few recently for leaking and the new packs shift alot nicer.

[Vigo]

The tcm used the same connector for a long time but i know the pinouts changed around obd-2.. 95-97 somewhere. This has come up with people trying to swap autostick TCMs into obd-1 cars. As for which, what, when? We need someone with alldata (or similar) access willing to do a lot of clicking around to find that out.

[Force Fed Mopar]

Even the late 90's and early 00's still had separate TCM's.

[Kreel]

The tcm used the same connector for a long time but i know the pinouts changed around obd-2.. 95-97 somewhere. This has come up with people trying to swap autostick TCMs into obd-1 cars. As for which, what, when? We need someone with alldata (or similar) access willing to do a lot of clicking around to find that out.

I once put an obd-2 autostick TCM into my 93 Duster just for the heck of it. It shifted ok but it didn't downshift unless I came to a stop.

[Aries_Turbo]

i have a 97 (i think) intrepid autostick TCM and i had a 1990 but i dont know what happened to it. i cant find it anywhere.

im gonna pull the later one apart and see what chip is on it and maybe pull the code off of it.

i know rob wanted early stuff but im sure we'll want to see later code at some point.

i think the best way to control this is with a modded factory controller. the Megashift doesnt have adaptive coding to keep the shifts where you want themand the $$$$ PCS aftermarket controller doesnt do the adaptive wear compensation either and it also doesnt control the solenoids the same way as the factory either. the factory controller sends a 100% duty cycle signal out for a bit and then backs off to a lower duty cycle signal (30-38% depending on gear) and every so often, another blip of 100% to keep the solenoid activated.

i thought the PCS controller was just sending out a constant 60% (or whatever you have it set to do) duty cycle signal to the solenoids which was overheating the controller in some instances.

i want to put a 604 behind my SRT motor in my kcar later. it will make the AWD swap easier too and you can still get parts unlike the 5-speeds.

i have a 2001 caravan box too so i have one with the tallest gears and some of the good later parts. i want to get a 2004-2005 neon 40te as well for some more updated parts and some shorter gears to have a selection.

Brian

[glhs0426]

There was a major change in electronics for the 1999 model year involving the transmission range sensor. Before 1999 it was just a neutral safety switch like is used in the 31TH. Very early 1999 models used the 1998 transmissions and TCMs. This range sensor was a logic input to the TCM to allow it electronically monitor gear shift posistion. Hardware changes involved a hole in the case, a sensor code plate and sensor added to the valve body, wiring, and related software changes to the TCM.

If you are just looking at the transmission electronically, there is very early 1999 down, and regular production 1999 up. Then there is autostick.......

[Vigo]

Uhh what exactly changed?

Also, the TRS has/had the temp thermistor in it so it does that as well.

What you're saying sounds like the change that happened in 93-94-ish where they added TRS functions and got rid of the separate neutral safety switch and one other switch and their attendant holes in the case.

[shackwrrr]

here are the wiring diagrams, looks like in 89 the pinout was different but after 90-91 it changed to the new style and mostly stayed the same. Also added wiring diagram showing the autostick wiring that started in 96 on certain models. Its only 2 wires from pin 44 and pin 5

[bakes]

Correct me if im worng it has been years since i did the A604 trans cousre but i remember it that you had to have had a Auto stick valve body and TCM for the
auto stick feature to work.

[RoadWarrior222]

Well I understand a hydraulic transaxle needing a specific VB for "autostick" but I thought all the valving was done by solenoids and all the programming was in the PCM... unless there's electronics in the solenoid pack, or "crosswired" valving that doesn't work for autostick.


(And next up, how do I get Mazda sport stick to work in my Escort??? )

[turbovanman²]

Well I understand a hydraulic transaxle needing a specific VB for "autostick" but I thought all the valving was done by solenoids and all the programming was in the PCM... unless there's electronics in the solenoid pack, or "crosswired" valving that doesn't work for autostick.


(And next up, how do I get Mazda sport stick to work in my Escort??? )

That is correct, there isn't really a valve body so to speak, the solenoid does the work and the pack fits every 604 made.

i have a 97 (i think) intrepid autostick TCM and i had a 1990 but i dont know what happened to it. i cant find it anywhere.

im gonna pull the later one apart and see what chip is on it and maybe pull the code off of it.

i know rob wanted early stuff but im sure we'll want to see later code at some point.

i think the best way to control this is with a modded factory controller. the Megashift doesnt have adaptive coding to keep the shifts where you want themand the $$$$ PCS aftermarket controller doesnt do the adaptive wear compensation either and it also doesnt control the solenoids the same way as the factory either. the factory controller sends a 100% duty cycle signal out for a bit and then backs off to a lower duty cycle signal (30-38% depending on gear) and every so often, another blip of 100% to keep the solenoid activated.

i thought the PCS controller was just sending out a constant 60% (or whatever you have it set to do) duty cycle signal to the solenoids which was overheating the controller in some instances.

i want to put a 604 behind my SRT motor in my kcar later. it will make the AWD swap easier too and you can still get parts unlike the 5-speeds.

i have a 2001 caravan box too so i have one with the tallest gears and some of the good later parts. i want to get a 2004-2005 neon 40te as well for some more updated parts and some shorter gears to have a selection.

Brian

I have a 93 or 94 TCM, do you want it to check out?

[Aries_Turbo]

sure, ill pull it apart and extract the data... though i wonder if rob can read the data out the sci or whatever bus it has.?

Brian

[bakes]

sure, ill pull it apart and extract the data... though i wonder if rob can read the data out the sci or whatever bus it has.?

Brian

you dont have to pull them apart i used to flash them with the DRB3 at the dealer ship

[Aries_Turbo]

yeah but i dont have a drb3.

besides, even if i did have one, can i save the .bin to my computer after extracting it?

Brian

[bakes]

Rob did find the procol to get the send command i would PM him

[turbovanman²]

Rob did find the procol to get the send command i would PM him

I can, but I think I remember he's just too busy to take on this as well, right now.