Sundance 6g72 "3.0 turbo build thread"(N/A DYNO SHEET pics inside)

[Sundance 6g72]

here is a video of the turbos response that i took a min. ago out on some empty road i found. the first pull was eased into in 3rd at about 35mph.. and i dont think i stayed WOT for long due to slightly wet road. the other two were around 40-45.. close to wot but i dont think i actually got there

i think i just dont like how the spool looks on paper (datalogs) because in real life driving it seems to be gooing pretty damn hard at 45 in third and realiisticly, in a race setting i shouldnt even see 3rd until 55mph.

[RoadWarrior222]

Your voltage looks a little high, when mine was there it was trying to fry things at 17V. I know those factory gauges aren't great though.

[Sundance 6g72]

forget what megasquirt reads but its not really that high. i run an omni voltage regulator.. no internal regulator sbecII anymore.. it used to read lower

[Sundance 6g72]

[Ondonti]

Voltage guage on my P body reads super high and weird. MS confirms voltage is quite normal as well as checking with an ohm meter.
Wish my battery was that strong. My new fancy battery got hurt this year with all the down time

Really hard to get any feel for lag in those videos. You don't need boost in the rpms you don't race at if all you care about is racing. Everything else is just about throttle response and feel/preference.

[Sundance 6g72]

yep yep. it drives like stock until boost kicks in then you go fast.

these came in today. im sure they will slow me down but i like the idea of better brake power. i will have them paired with mini van calipers

[Sundance 6g72]

ran some audi today.. highway was nice and dry so i did a small pull.. sort of. He was looking over at me all like "WHAT CHU GOT" and i gave him some bov flutter but he didnt do anything.. so i pulled away nice and easy and when i got some distance i changed lanes and gunned it (was data logging)

that seemed to peak his intrest so he gave chase.. light turned red and i was coasting when he blew past me and to his luck it turned green while he was still hauling ---.. i got on it and we kept even (i was behind him but he wasnt pulled) I had to let off to go around a small curve and then i did a ricer fly by orrrr he was trying and i blew his doors off.. one of the two. I was sputtering kind of too. not sure if it needs more timing (adding timing has been helping) or its bad spark blow out?

i dont even know what spark blow out feels like, or if you can feel it. Id look it up but i have to think about leaving for work :P

[Force Fed Mopar]

Spark blowout feels kinda like a weak coil or bad wires, kind of a light skip under boost.

[Sundance 6g72]

Ehh.. ill pull the plugs when i get a chance


What gap should i run?

[Force Fed Mopar]

Less... lol It's trial and error, I'd just drop it like .005" and see what happens.

[87turbodance]

I think it's time to go wasted spark! Make a toothed wheel on your crank like I did and then you can run some cheap wasted spark coils from the junk yard to begin with. Cheap and easy!! You already have the hard done with Ms installed and mostly tuned.

Leave your dizzy installed while you do the toothed wheel stuff so you can fall back on that in case something doesn't go as planned. I'll walk you though it if you need any help. The toothed wheel is easy - all you need is a drill, a tap, some bolts and patience. Then grab a sensor from something - I like my 2000 Protege sensor - and make a mounting bracket out of some scrap steel or aluminum angle.

Then you would have a cure for any spark blow-out.

[RoadWarrior222]

and see what happens.

and film it in case there's explosions...

Just kidding, but that is really the only way for any particular engine combo that's non-stock, narrow the gap some and test.

Only variation I've had N/A on mine was the racing plug mod, where you saw off some of the ground strap level with the other side of the center electrode, gapped .040... seemed to be good at RPM, more responsive, but made the idle a little less smooth and gap erosion was accelerated. You'd wanna check 'em monthly at minimum if you wanted to try that. I read after that that you were supposed to gap down .010 with that mod, so I might try it again at .030 sometime. http://performanceunlimited.com/docu...degapping.html

[Sundance 6g72]

i want wasted spark but i dont think i need it yet. Brent ran stock dizzy, coil, and plugs.

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ive nver used a gapper either... lol

[RoadWarrior222]

Ah, you might wanna get one. Setting plugs by eyeball is reserved for tenured shadetree-ers.

[Sundance 6g72]

ive never set them either.. i have a gapper but idk where it is. ill get ahold of one

[87turbodance]

I just thought I'd throw the idea out there since it's not too difficult to do if you have some time and junk yard nearby. Two BIP373 coil driver kits would be required from diyautotune as well.

i want wasted spark but i dont think i need it yet. Brent ran stock dizzy, coil, and plugs.

---------- Post added at 03:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:01 PM ----------

l

[Sundance 6g72]

ive deff been thinking about it but i wont be doing it yet.

i wonder if any megasquirt ign settings can help my issue? dwell, spark duration?

[87turbodance]

More dwell may help but it's hard to tell how much dwell is just enough without a scope. Once the coil becomes saturated and addition dwell will just be turned into heat by the current limiting in the BIP373 coil driver. Too much dwell equals too much heat and a killed coil driver.

Where wasted spark or sequential spark (COP) are useful is when you need more dwell time to saturate the coil(s) to allow for maximum spark. With one coil, it needs enough time to saturate and release the spark three times per crank revolution. With wasted spark it has to do it one time per crank revolution. With COP the coil has to spark once every other crank revolution.

That being said, you should have enough time to charge the single coil three times per crank revolution with a V6. When you start pushing the revs you have less and less time per revolution and that can start eating into your dwell time.

You're using an MSD coil correct? Did MSD give you a recommended dwell time? You could try upping your dwell time and just keep an eye on your coil driver at first to make sure it doesn't get too hot.

Some hotter coils can store a larger charge but require a longer dwell time to charge and that is where wasted spark or sequential spark (requires MS3) would come in handy.

Interesting read: http://www.extraefi.co.uk/dwell.htm

[Sundance 6g72]

they said between 2.5 and 3ms. i think i have it at 2.7 just because


the thing is, i didnt have blow out with my other plugs (that i can remember. ) when i ran the r32 and the wrx.. i ddint feel a miss once and that was 4th gear full out.. even when i topped 5th gear out, i didnt have a miss.. now its about everytime i pull WOT. at first i thought fixing the arf (either in the 13s! or the 10s) but now that the afr is right i still have it.. through some more timing at it (was running less than before) and it seemed to get better but its still there. only thing i can think of is the spark plugs.

im lazy and if upping the dwell or spark duration (or dropping it some) helps then ill do that :P its cold outside

it seems to like to happen at 4000rpms and go away or it just keeps doing it.. i dont have a tach so i go by feeling and exhaust noise.. dosnt really show up in my logs either.

[c2xejk]

i want wasted spark but i dont think i need it yet. Brent ran stock dizzy, coil, and plugs.

I want to go to wasted spark too, but more to make room for my intake...

I will say that going to a crank based position sensor has stabilized spark timing even with the serpentine belt on. I suspect that spark timing was off of what it was supposed to be during the drag runs (based on the %timing err ) Not sure how much power that was robbing...