200 miles on the rebuild and now SMOKING! wtf

[Haibach boys]

been driving the car..85 SC 2.2l. now its stock rebuild honed new rings bearings, head fresh, new valves, seals guides, all belts & hoses, "005" head gasket, Rebuilt T/U turbo (stock replacemant) 3"sv, 3 "exhaust, stainless braided line with the filter.
got everything together checked over everything before starting, great oil pressure, primed turbo on bench and then had everything hooked up and prolly pumped a little over a quart of oil through it. and no egr too.
now car ran fine till like 160 miles then started smoking periodically, so looked around and for the PCV valve (new) its a 90 conected to the pcv then hose hooked to the bottom of the housing that the thottle body hose goes to (also were the egr attached) looked in there and there was a lot of oil in there, so i plugged the port that the hose connected to and ran a hose to an open breather for a PCv, i didnt flush anything due to i didnt no if i did if it would hurt the turbo. now its been like 50 miles and i think its getting progressivly worse. im now thinking rings at this point. or maybe its still burnning oil off than was in there prior.
now the car never got hot i have 2 guages in it electric and mech, the car was ran and timed and taken up the road, and idled down for a few minuetes, then drained oil and rplaced with fresh and new filter. and so far the car has not seen over 4500rpm.
any ideas? or does any one wanta buy a soild 85 SC? im to the point that maybe TMs and going to make good dailys?

[88_pacifica]

What type of rings did you use? Standard or ChromeMoly? What type of hone did you do to the block and what grade or finish/smoothness? Good crosshatching? The PCV system is correct and, at a minimum, setup to a "factory" setup standard?

There are many people that have conflicting views on breaking a motor in, but the majority seem to think that you should drive it a little hard to get the rings to seat. I would venture to guess that based on what you are describing the rings didn't seat or there is a a valve/guide leak of some capacity. Based on your description of a fresh rebuild, I would be very doubtful that it's the head or it's parts. Maybe the turbo is leaking? I have had that happen one time on a fresh rebuild and it took me a while to figure it out and fix it.

[Haibach boys]

they are hastings rings, if they are chro-moly or not im not sure, a guy at that works at an engine shop ordered them, and the same guy helped with the hone and assembly, we used a long stone hone first and followed that up with a ball hone, as far as grades ill be honest and say i dont know, but was cross hatched nicely, now if rings are not seated.. how do i get them to seat?

the head was taken to 2 shops the first shop, heard bad stories about and put the wrong valves in it, and i took to another shop that i have delt with before and had them double check and put correct valves in and pull a vacuum on them to be sure they and seated.

[turbodaytona87]

If the rings aren't seated, you probably have to rehone and rering

[Aries_Turbo]

try unhooking the PCV and running the valve cover just to breather filters (or just open heater hose for a test).

then check the turbo drainback tube for blockage. that will cause smoking.

do a compression and leakdown test and see if the rings are the culprit.

then go out and hammer the car hard with at least 10psi.

Brian

[Haibach boys]

im going to work on it tonight, what should i be seeing for compression, i think before i took it apart it was 150 psi. is that what i should be seeing? and i wanta change the oil, what do you guys recommend, ive been using 10w30 penz HM, and thought about a little bit of lucas? yay or nay? thanks for the help

[88_pacifica]

No lucas. You don't use it at all on a break-in of a motor. Actually, you want a cheap oil(with zinc additive added) that will allow the motor to start "settling in" and wearing in evenly. The compression should be close to the original psi and if it's less than 20psi from original, then something is way wrong.

[Haibach boys]

so took a comp test. and 1-4 the compression reads 60-110-125-150, took it for a ride and actually blew the dip stick, out of the tube completely!.... so i guess its time to do the lower end the right way... now in thinking the it will need to be bored and i'm thinking .20 over. now som questions for you guys...
now its a 85 block, 2.2l t1 stil using the log intake and still intend to keep it that way so
what are a decent .20 over piston?
what do most use of you for rings? the rings in it are hastings do i try them again?
and MP head gaskets are discontinued. so whats the next best one? ive heard cometic?(ive heard they are pricey but if it better i dont mind if it works)
bearings for a 2.2, there is Federal Mogal in it now, are they good for these engines or clevites better/or is it is what it is
and lastly being the 85 its got the 10mm head bolts, I've heard cuting them out to 11mm is better foor more clamping power, is it worth it?

now the car is intended to be my summer daily, and i drive alot. its running 12-14psi and my main consern is RELIABILITY over going fast.
even tho im tempted to cut my losses and scrap this HEAP of bad luck, i likee it and have WAY tomuch invested a get rid of it. so round 3 begins

[88_pacifica]

max boost on engine in the future? 14 psi or less? if so, I would just get stock turbo replacements(Mahle). If you have lofty goals and deep pockets, then get forged. For 80% of the forum though, I would say stockers are just fine....

[Haibach boys]

yeah not huge performance goals with this one, just want it reliable, and be able to stay together for the next few years, and drrive and enloy it. i have the drag car to go fast. and yeah max boost 14, and ill prolly end up putting a g-valve in it and turn it down to 10lbs.

[88_pacifica]

Go with stockers(cast) then...

[tryingbe]

Why not just go with another engine? Find a good running one and swap it in and be done with.

Also, find out the cause of the failure.

[turbo pacifica]

sounds likethe head is not seated to the block,sounds like the dowell pin is not aligned with the head ?

[onerippinturbo2]

sounds like it broke a piston or rings.

[turbo pacifica]

with the variance of compression from 60 # 1 to 150 #4 it looks like head is not sealed to block bieng high on #1 and sealed at #4. pull head and it should tell you what is going on.Let us know what you find?

[trannybuster]

^^Any detonation and it cracked a ring land. The stock mahles work fine but they wont last under any heavy detonation. Even if the rings didnt seat real well you should still have decent compressio. I would find yourself a common block. Not only does the 85 use smaller head bolts but it has weak rods. You can re-use just about everything, head,turbo,exhaust manny. The block shouldnt cost more than 175.00....and a properly built T2 bottom end is nearly indestructible with a set of forged pistons.

[onerippinturbo2]

85 rods arent weak, they are near the same as t2 rods minus the wrist pin bushing. the 86-87 rods were the lw rods. 84-85 had decent rods in them from the factory.as far as the head not sealing, that is damn near impossible to not seal at 1 end and seal up tight on the other, a warped head or block would cause something like that but not to the extremes that this one has, he has issues with the pistons/rings at least 2 pistons are done.

[trannybuster]

^^Yup thats right, the 85 are the heavy ones, been so long since I messed with one BUT if your going to find a T2 bottom might as well as use all hardware.

---------- Post added at 11:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:01 PM ----------

Some good reading here http://www.thedodgegarage.com/ as well as this site, obviously.

[Haibach boys]

i found out that the guy that helped me didnt file fit the rings and, being that it blew the dip stick out and is blowing oil everywhere i'm thinking the rings became broke, or maybe a piston or 2 took a poop. i wouldnt think that the head isnt seated done to that it hasnt lost a drop of coolant, (i would think it would act like a blown head gasket it it was that sinario) i have a 2.2 and a 2.5 common block laying around that i have thought about, but everything on the 85 is new, but the car is now on the back burner for now, gunna try and get some $ saved up and and just take my block and bored and gone through, and hope for the best.

but if i was to use a N/A common block that i have, will that crank an rods hold up? or do i need to get turbo rods and i diff crank.

and the reason i dont want to find a used engine and drop it in is because my hole goal with the car was to build it once put everyhing new in it and drive it for the next several years.

[88_pacifica]

Based on your first post and this last post, I would discourage a whole new attempt at this. I would not use a different block and there is no need to re-bore and re-hone the block, if you did a "decent" job on the initial re-hone. It should still be ok with that low of miles. You can always double-check the crosshatching, but I would think that's it's still ok.

These blocks have a high nickel content(durability and strength) and unless you will be beating the heII out of it(over 400hp), it should be fine. There are PLENTY of people on here using the non-CB blocks and making power and running for long periods of time. As the previous posters said, the Mahles do not do well with extensive detonation, but if you take your time and are close to stock initially, they should be ok.

Warning: The following recommendation is for those that are mechanically savvy, take their time and recheck their work as they go, and clean, clean, clean the resulting mess this makes BEFORE reassembly. I would STRONGLY recommend finding a local member to your area that is on here and has experience with these motors to assist.

If there is minimal play in the bores(piston doesn't 'rock' in cylinders) then you should be able to leave most things alone AFTER you doublecheck your rings, clearances, pistons, and cylinders. If you drop the pan, remove the pistons/rods, you should be able to do re-do on the top end of the rotating assembly(rods, rings, and pistons). Provided the block is good, recheck, redo, and reinstall. If everything else is in order, it should be fine after reassembly and you WON'T have to remove the motor.