Oh btw, on unofficial timing, I figure my van runs about 17.5 with both seats, full size spare(50lb), 40lb tools/junk and a couple of gallons of misc spare fluids, half a tank of gas and 220lb of me.... and I still think it's lighter than Simons... ... I should take it to the track "race prepped" (i.e. seats and junk out) and see if it will get into the 16s.