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Thread: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

  1. #1
    Mitsu booster
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    Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Hello all:
    I am about to loose what little sanity I have left. I put a full rebuild kit in my a670 3.0L 3spd trans. It really was in nice shape inside. The forward rear clutch was the only thing fried. 167,000 miles. It was shifting funky for awhile trans treatment kept it going. It finally quit. I have now put a transgo kit in it, a sonnax governor kit the full master kit, and cleaned and polished the valve body spools. It won't go into 1st gear. It pulls solid in reverse. I can only back in to my garage so I can't get the thing out. ;-) ! Put a rebuilt converter in and flushed the cooler. It whines when idleing, never did this before except the last day or so before it finally quit. I get about 35lbs line pressure at idle and only 55 or so when I give it gas. This is with the pressure adjustment cranked up several turns from stock. I recently pulled and found bad NEW seal on the forward rear clutch piston. Replaced it and air tested it. It seemed to work fine. Put trans back in and it still doesn't work. I am waiting for another valve body as I write this. What valve, spool check ball etc. should I focus on. Or could loose bushings / seal grooves etc. cause enough leakage to make the clutch not engage. I did not replace all the bushings as they looked fine. The bushings I did replace had a little visible wear but they looked fairly decent. The ring seals were ALL replaced though. Any Ideas? By the way the trans had almost no end play or looseness any where. My mother bought this van new then sold to my brother. So it had an easy life. I need to keep it going but also want to. It has good Karma ;-) !

  2. #2
    turbo addict
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    How much fluid has gone in so far? They're a bugger to "burp" and get the fluid level right after a good drain. Whining is possibly aerated fluid because its too low and not bled round yet.
    DD1: '02 T&C Ltd, 3.8 AWD. DD2: '15 Versa Note SV, replacing.. DDx: '14 Versa Note SV << freshly killded :( ....... Projects: '88 Voyager 3.0, Auto with shift kit, timing advance, walker sound FX muffler on 15" pumpers wrapped in 215/65/R15 H rated Nexens.... and a '95 phord escort wagon PnP head << Both may need to go :( ..... I like 3.0s ... so??? ... stop looking at me like I've got two heads!

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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    I don't have my book here but it sounds like the pump isn't working properly. Whining is usually a bad TC or a stuck regulator valve. I would be pulling the pump and checking it carefully. Also, check your servo's and how did you adjust the bands. What clearance did you set the clutch packs at?
    No first means the small rear clutch isn't applying.

    Go here for some info on what to do to your valve body and where the balls go-

    http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/sh...uild-info-A413
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
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    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

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  4. #4
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Hello:
    I just spent my entire weekend replacing the head gaskets on my only remaining vehicle. I didn't have time to get back and check on my post. Drained 3 Gal. of goo out of the crankcase. Back to My Trans now.
    I put new gears in the pump the old ones still looked good. The pump clearances looked good. I am hopeing that the new rebuilt converter isn't the whine. The small clutch does appear to be the problem. I'm not sure why it does not seem to get enough pressure to operate. It was air cycleing fine. Is there some way to get some fluid pressure into the circuit to help get it primed. I put 9 qts. ATF+4 in it. I got another valve body today, but have not had time to check its condition.

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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Which port are you using to check for line pressure?
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

  6. #6
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Sounds like plenty of fluid unless it's running right out again.

    Could be a valve body issue, I know I reused my modded VB from a failed tranny and thought I cleaned it out good, but the throttle valve or something was hanging up anyway, maybe got a score in the bore from debris, need to go over it with a magnifying glass.... but anyway when I switched in another VB everything was good.
    DD1: '02 T&C Ltd, 3.8 AWD. DD2: '15 Versa Note SV, replacing.. DDx: '14 Versa Note SV << freshly killded :( ....... Projects: '88 Voyager 3.0, Auto with shift kit, timing advance, walker sound FX muffler on 15" pumpers wrapped in 215/65/R15 H rated Nexens.... and a '95 phord escort wagon PnP head << Both may need to go :( ..... I like 3.0s ... so??? ... stop looking at me like I've got two heads!

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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoadWarrior222 View Post
    Sounds like plenty of fluid unless it's running right out again.

    Could be a valve body issue, I know I reused my modded VB from a failed tranny and thought I cleaned it out good, but the throttle valve or something was hanging up anyway, maybe got a score in the bore from debris, need to go over it with a magnifying glass.... but anyway when I switched in another VB everything was good.
    He has low pressure, unless he's using the wrong port to check it.
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

  8. #8
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    I'm using the line pressure forward clutch port as shown in the atsg manual. I didn't get to work on it today. The valve body I just recieved looks pretty decent on a quick look over. I will check it when I get off work tomorrow. My gauge is only good for 160 lb so I didn't try it on the reverse port yet. Do you think it would go high enough to pop the gauge? The 1st time I worked on the valve body after the trans went out the 1-2 and 2-3 valves were stuck tight. I was able to free them up pretty easily. I cleaned it thoroughly and polished the spools with scotch brite. The trans did have sticking governor and shift valve symptoms before it finally went out. I put a sonnax kit on the governor when I cleaned it. The valves all seemed to move freely after after the cleaning. I was thinking something might be sticking and not shifting the spool valve to fully engage and causing the whine and low pressure. It did start to whine right before the clutch fried and went out. The only gear that worked was reverse then too.

  9. #9
    The moderately moderate moderator Turbo Mopar Staff
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    The valves should be polished with 1500 or 2000 grit sand paper The scotch brite pads leave too rough a surface, IMHO. I would try the other VB since this one had stuck valve issues.
    Bryan
    86 GLHS #161, 2016 Impala
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Quote Originally Posted by voyager92 View Post
    I'm using the line pressure forward clutch port as shown in the atsg manual. I didn't get to work on it today. The valve body I just recieved looks pretty decent on a quick look over. I will check it when I get off work tomorrow. My gauge is only good for 160 lb so I didn't try it on the reverse port yet. Do you think it would go high enough to pop the gauge? The 1st time I worked on the valve body after the trans went out the 1-2 and 2-3 valves were stuck tight. I was able to free them up pretty easily. I cleaned it thoroughly and polished the spools with scotch brite. The trans did have sticking governor and shift valve symptoms before it finally went out. I put a sonnax kit on the governor when I cleaned it. The valves all seemed to move freely after after the cleaning. I was thinking something might be sticking and not shifting the spool valve to fully engage and causing the whine and low pressure. It did start to whine right before the clutch fried and went out. The only gear that worked was reverse then too.
    Sounds like a pressure leak somewhere. I'll check tomorrow on the ports and pressures.
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

  11. #11
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Unfortunately I got home to late to do any work on valve body today. I appreciate all the help. This looked like it was going to be a relatively easy fix when I started. I seem to get lucky that way sometimes, simple things difficult, difficult things simple. I am hoping the valve body will get me somewhere as I really don't want to pull this thing out again. I got all the bushings so I can replace the works this time if I have to. They just didn't look worn enough to cause this kind of pressure loss. The air test actuates the clutch nicely, but there is some air blowing by internally. Of course all the clutches and servoes have some leakage when held at a steady pressure. I assume some leak by is normal as long as they actuate solidly. The reverse definately pulls hard when engaged. I think if the pump or converter were a problem reverse would not work so well. Thanks again for your help.

  12. #12
    The moderately moderate moderator Turbo Mopar Staff
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    On GM transmissions there was almost nothing blowing by when doing an air test. That means something isn't sealing. Did you use any trans gel or vaseline when you were rebuilding it? Sounds like a seal got cut or rolled during assembly. Are the 413's different when it comes to air tests?
    Bryan
    86 GLHS #161, 2016 Impala
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    A man has got to know his limitations.....

  13. #13
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Yes I used Trans Gel. The seals slid in very easy. I did not force them. I did have a problem on the first try as I mentioned in original post. I don't know by experience just how much leakage is normal. I know that now the clutch apply is solid with some audible air. Before it just blew freely with no apply and fair amount of noise.

  14. #14
    The moderately moderate moderator Turbo Mopar Staff
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Hopefully one of the other guys will chime in here soon. A small amount should be ok, but I can't say for sure. It sounds like it is working under air.
    Bryan
    86 GLHS #161, 2016 Impala
    SDAC National Member, SDAC Buckeye Chapter Member

    A man has got to know his limitations.....

  15. #15
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    I hope the other guys can give a little guidance on the amount of air leakage. Its kind of hard for them to listen to it over the internet though. I am definately going to try the valve body before I pull the trans. again. I will make absolutely sure I get it right before it goes back in if the valve body doesn't get it though. I checked myself so much I was sure it was ok, but it is really being a pain.

  16. #16
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Hey I finally got it going. It was leakage in the clutch. The seal was cut again. I found that I mis-assembled the clutch. It shifts very nice with the Trans-go kit. The line pressure is cranked up about 3 turns from stock. I am still playing with the throttle adjustment. It was very performance oriented initially. I backed it off a tad too far today. Going to move it back some. I was overreving at a 50 mph kickdown. I went a little to far though, now it won't kick down over 60 arrgh. Been tweaking and driving to from work to test it. I was afraid the trans-go kit might be to mushy, but the Sonnax governor spring kit and line pressure increase seems to tighten it up nicely. No more shuddering or sticking in high gear. There is some air leakage but it seems to be about the same in all the checks. The reverse band servo is sealing better than any of the others.
    Last edited by voyager92; 04-08-2011 at 10:23 PM.

  17. #17
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Great news, well done.

    Yeah, the kickdown on 3.0/670 vans seems to be a particular b!tch to adjust and many of the manuals don't really have an adequate diagram/procedure it seems, always leaves you wondering, then you just start jiggering it back and forth until it drives right, thinking "Please the gods there must be a better wayyyyyy!!!!!!!"
    DD1: '02 T&C Ltd, 3.8 AWD. DD2: '15 Versa Note SV, replacing.. DDx: '14 Versa Note SV << freshly killded :( ....... Projects: '88 Voyager 3.0, Auto with shift kit, timing advance, walker sound FX muffler on 15" pumpers wrapped in 215/65/R15 H rated Nexens.... and a '95 phord escort wagon PnP head << Both may need to go :( ..... I like 3.0s ... so??? ... stop looking at me like I've got two heads!

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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    They wont kick down from around 50-60 mph in 3rd as you'll hit redline, not good for warranty reasons.

    To adjust the kickdown, its easy, pull up the clip, have a buddy wot the pedal, gently pull the cable back, push clip back in, done. DO NOT adjustment more than say 2 clicks on either way otherwise you could damage the trans.

    There will be a bit of air leakage but if you hit it with enough air to seat the seals, then you shouldn't have any. Hope that makes sense.
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

  19. #19
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Mine does not have that type of linkage. It has a rod with a clamp bolt. It slides back and forth pretty much any where you want to put it. I've been using a small 6 in. scale to measure before and after so I can tell how much I have changed it. I think I got it today. I 'll find out as I drive it a little more this week. Yeah it was winding really tight trying to hit 1st at 50! Today it kicked down to 1st at 45 then shifted to 2nd without any stutter so I hope It will work ok. It used to not kickdown to 2nd well at 60 or faster, now it will if set tighter. I don't have a tach on it. I may have one stashed in my mess somewhere I can hook up.

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    Re: Rebuilt a670 trans no 1st gear reverse ok.

    Got a pic, sounds like someone changed out the cable. AFAIK, all 1-2nd Gens had the same kickdown cable.
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

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