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Thread: The Holset he341 3.0L

  1. #981
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Crower seems to have dropped in quality so thats not who I went with. My cams were $350 if I remember correctly. Im willing to pay more to get it done right.

    No one seems to care enough to work on the 3.0 ecu. I personally could care less because MS is just that much better.

  2. #982
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Quote Originally Posted by Ondonti View Post
    Had to replace the fusible link that powers the OEM ASD (auto shutdown relay) and ecu and coil and fuel pump relay and alternator field. Not sure why Dodge wanted to have so many things powered by one fusible link or why they have to splice it at so many different locations. I had the first 30 amp fuse blow out right away when I turned the key "on" (didn't even know it was the correct fuse) so I went through all the systems, disconnecting them all and looking for a short to ground. Only ground was where the various power wires hooked up to the ecu (not sure why that is). Anyways I finally got the guts to put it all back together system by system and the fuse didn't blow.
    That was in June....


    Problem reared its head again. Drove for a few minutes home from work and lost two 30 amp fuses in about a mile. Bypassed the fuse to get home and no wires were warm.

    Going to go through the diagram and remove something from the circuit. Something is spiking the circuit and popping the fuse VERY randomly. Car has been sitting a few days because I have been moving stuff and cars (Duster, Starlet) to my new to me house.
    Last edited by Ondonti; 09-02-2014 at 07:16 PM.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  3. #983
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Took apart the engine harness and changed the coil wire to feed off the larger 14 guage EGR sensor wire. Now that EGR sensor wire on the engine bay harness side is tapped into my fuel pump relay hotwire setup.

    Will see if that prevents the ASD circuit from blowing. I wanted to do this since it is going to make the coil charge faster since it should be at higher voltage instead of being part of a giant circuit to everything fed by one tiny wire.
    Also happy to stop driving wife's 3.0.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ondonti View Post
    That was in June....


    Problem reared its head again. Drove for a few minutes home from work and lost two 30 amp fuses in about a mile. Bypassed the fuse to get home and no wires were warm.

    Going to go through the diagram and remove something from the circuit. Something is spiking the circuit and popping the fuse VERY randomly. Car has been sitting a few days because I have been moving stuff and cars (Duster, Starlet) to my new to me house.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  4. #984
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    I'm forgetting, does fuel pump current run through ASD?
    DD1: '02 T&C Ltd, 3.8 AWD. DD2: '15 Versa Note SV, replacing.. DDx: '14 Versa Note SV << freshly killded :( ....... Projects: '88 Voyager 3.0, Auto with shift kit, timing advance, walker sound FX muffler on 15" pumpers wrapped in 215/65/R15 H rated Nexens.... and a '95 phord escort wagon PnP head << Both may need to go :( ..... I like 3.0s ... so??? ... stop looking at me like I've got two heads!

  5. #985
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    yes it does. Friends Lancer shelby he just bought was constantly running the fuel pump when the key was on. The hacks that owned it had jumpered the poles in the ASD relay plug with some wire. Wierd part was that the car operated fine until a week or so later where it wouldn't shut off when you turned the key off. A new ASD relay solved it all.

  6. #986
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    The ASD relay powers the red/white wire splices to green/orange and that goes to the engine harness and then splices to power the fuel injectors, coil, and the alternator control.
    The red/white powers the fuel pump, oxygen sensor, electronic engine controller, also powers electronic transmission controllers on the passenger side of the engine bay. The oxygen sensor and fuel pump don't get power until the fuel pump relay is grounded.
    I don't like how Chrysler did their auto shutdown relay. Seems like they want the car to shut down if one tiny problem happens and then make it nearly impossible to figure out which item is failing.
    Quote Originally Posted by RoadWarrior222 View Post
    I'm forgetting, does fuel pump current run through ASD?
    Quote Originally Posted by GLHNSLHT2 View Post
    yes it does. Friends Lancer shelby he just bought was constantly running the fuel pump when the key was on. The hacks that owned it had jumpered the poles in the ASD relay plug with some wire. Wierd part was that the car operated fine until a week or so later where it wouldn't shut off when you turned the key off. A new ASD relay solved it all.
    Last edited by Ondonti; 09-06-2014 at 05:18 PM.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  7. #987
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Drove the car once to work but figured out the car was....off....It seems the wideband was reset when I had the alternator feed wire touch something without being unplugged. Radio was reset. I realized the MTX-L output settings are probably wrong after doing a recal thinking calibration was the problem. I need narrowband output for the stock ECU. Innovate MTX-L wideband defaults to wideband output which is the opposite range of narrowband and 0-5 instead of 0-1. So the ECU will do the opposite of what it should when it gets into closed loop and tries to bounce around 14.7 AFR. It just goes crazy lean most of the time unless you get it into closed loop mode (more throttle).

    My serial to USB connector is at another location right now. Pretty grumpy that I can't fix my car over a digital setting and I don't plan on driving half an hour each way to pick up my connector :P I was trying to figure out if it would be better to just buy another one so I have a cord inside the car instead of the worthless serial connector end.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  8. #988
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    I've got my serial/USB connector at my house. Dunno if that would do you any good though. I could meet up with you or something if you like.

  9. #989
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    After on and off driving the car to work, sometimes it being decent at cruise/idle and with throttle response...others no throttle response and crazy lean or rarely rich.

    Figured that the BEGI "combo" rising rate fuel regulator was needing a rebuild even if that was not the real problem. Took it apart. It has a lower section in charge of base pressure and throttle response (the standard regulator side) that has a piston and spring. The piston appears to have been seizing because all the lubrication inside is a hard powder. Chaffing/corrosion marks on the cylinder and the piston. I polished it out and I am going to moly lube it and put it back together without replacing anything.

    Long term, I might need to buy the rebuild kit (60 bucks and the base regulator piston doesn't seem to match my 1st generation combo RRR) or at least some gaskets and a ghetto fix.

    Seems to make total sense why the car was totally unpredictable. Once that piston gets stuck, fuel pressure will be wrong depending on engine demands. Instead of settling where it should, its gonna get stuck slightly above or below proper pressure since the vacuum pressure that moves it will not have much force to overcome friction of seizing parts to get all the way to where it should adjust to. Quick throttle response could be no throttle response.

    Corky Bell told me I should try to rebuild it every 10,000 miles and its got about 8 years on it since it was serviced (had a failed gasket/diaphragm). I don't know why the lube dried out and turned into a hard crust, maybe fuel leak at that gasket or just too much time passage with constant gasoline vapors getting into that chamber? The upper boost chamber piston lube was very happy but I have re serviced the upper section more recently (3 years ago) and used moly engine assembly lube. I did serious work to the regulator in 2009 to allow extreme amounts of fuel to bypass from twin fuel pumps AND have low fuel pressure on my Duster and I replaced zero internals back then.


    Here is the album previously posted for this thread when I last went through the regulator. It still looks like what it did when I reworked the upper chamber. Moly lube still looks happy.
    http://s546.photobucket.com/user/ond...re%20Regulator

    Here are the new pictures. Grey chunky lube sitting on the table. Took two pictures to show some of the modifications to the original flowpath. The original passages are much smaller and have 90 degree angles. I got away with making both valve seats very thin.







    Last edited by Ondonti; 10-30-2014 at 11:25 AM.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  10. #990

    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Since you are running Megasquirt on this, could you run just an AFPR? Possibly set for just one pressure?

  11. #991
    Garrett booster
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    No megasquirt on this one. thats off the daily driven spirit with a stock ecu.

  12. #992
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Quote Originally Posted by c2xejk View Post
    Since you are running Megasquirt on this, could you run just an AFPR? Possibly set for just one pressure?
    Quote Originally Posted by Spiritman View Post
    No megasquirt on this one. thats off the daily driven spirit with a stock ecu.
    Yup, this car is very basic. Spiritman texted me saying an in cab pressure guage would be great to have. Probably a bigger deal since the combo Rising Rate Regulator has to take such complex command of fuel pressure.

    In a ghetto way I do think I could see myself swapping this modified regulator to my Duster and cheating on injectors again even with Megasquirt. Doesn't make sense to buy another one of these regulators when they cost over 300 dollars and megasquirt is comparatively affordable for its capabilities.
    -------------

    The pictures above are after most of the damage was removed. I didn't try to take away any material, just scotchbrite by hand and then a light dremel polish. Still plenty of the deeper seizure marks remain. Moly lubed and reassembled. Piston now slides with no resistance except the spring.
    Last edited by Ondonti; 10-31-2014 at 12:43 PM.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  13. #993
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    My opinion on the importance of gauges is: 1. Wideband, 2. In-cab fuel pressure, 3. EGT

    RRR's are crazy money considering you can get programmable piggybacks or even standalones for VERY little more.

    But, if you know how to set it up and stay on top of it they are a lot easier to install! Still seems crazy you can double the WHP on a 3.0 with nothing but a RRR for 'tuning'.

    Dont push the red button.You hear me?

  14. #994
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Whoa, RRRs are dying out, I swear there were more around cheaper a few years ago, now they seem to be getting more specialist again.
    DD1: '02 T&C Ltd, 3.8 AWD. DD2: '15 Versa Note SV, replacing.. DDx: '14 Versa Note SV << freshly killded :( ....... Projects: '88 Voyager 3.0, Auto with shift kit, timing advance, walker sound FX muffler on 15" pumpers wrapped in 215/65/R15 H rated Nexens.... and a '95 phord escort wagon PnP head << Both may need to go :( ..... I like 3.0s ... so??? ... stop looking at me like I've got two heads!

  15. #995

    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    If you search 'FMU' on ebay you can find a bunch for around $100.

  16. #996
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    BTW, I drove the car to work and it was still being a bit weird. Tried to check the two fuel pressure settings and when I pulled the lower vacuum line where the 'dried out' chamber + piston is and gasoline started dripping out. This makes me feel bad for cylinder #2 which is where the fuel vacuum port is connected to.

    I ordered some extra gaskets and shims from BEGI. I am just going to drill a hole through a 3" gasket they sell and use it as a diaphragm. Their full rebuild kits do not match my early production model so I would have had to ask Corky about what was needed or just send it in. The MR kits have a new piston so I could swap my old one in but the kit is 60 bucks and I spent 1/3 that for new small gaskets, 1 large gasket, 1 set of shims. I would feel like a chump talking to him over what is mostly my aversion to spending money. Previous talks were about the oddness of my early production MR2035. I also figured out later that I was setting point of onset incorrectly for a long period of time.

    The last time my RRR failed I took a picture of my vacuum hand pump air line full of fuel out of the ports on the regulator.

    I ordered multiple small gaskets since the lower unit seems to be what dies more often and I am impatient. Ready for rererebuild.

    RRR's are a weird use of money if you go name brand but they can make more power on the same injector
    BEGI also has modernized their RRR fleet to supposedly have superior "point of onset" that seeks to better mirror engine fueling demands.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  17. #997
    Moderator Turbo Mopar Staff Vigo's Avatar
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Last time i looked all the cheap RRRs either didnt have adjustable base pressure, didnt have adjustable rate of gain, or both. I dont consider them that useful without those traits. I did pick up a 'non adjustable' (at least without swapping internals) unit off CL for ~$40 but the intent was always to modify it to make it actually useful.

    Dont push the red button.You hear me?

  18. #998
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Got the replacement gaskets and shims. Only installed a small gasket. The moly lube was contaminated with gasoline. Took a hole punch to the center, looked cleaner than the hole they made on theirs. For me this is a $3 dollar plus shipping rebuild (but I bought extra parts for the future) instead of the $60+ custom. The upper gasket gets a lot less wear since it only activates near atmospheric pressure. The lower is constantly getting taxed as vacuum changes during normal driving.

    With it all back together, no longer leaking internally, I found my base pressure is about 32-33 psi. My "point of onset" pressure was only about 37 psi. That would be why it leaned out so bad (19:1 AFR's etc) and lost power near zero vacuum. I turned it up to a bout 42psi and I was getting 16:1 AFR near zero vacuum with no breakup but also no power. 50psi and I was getting high 13:1 AFR to low 14:1. At that point power in the boost transition zone really picked up. Goes to 12 and 11 as it gets into boost but I didn't press farther. Bumped it to 53psi point of onset and didn't test again. I seem to remember originally setting the unit a few years ago to 48psi point of onset. I don't know why its was so low. Maybe that is an indicator that the upper diaphragm stretched out or who knows.

    Anyone have an idea what that gasket material is? Easy to get .003" stainless steel shim (heard of people using thicker) and with gasket material, I could change this stuff more often and not feel like I am spending a lot of money on it.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  19. #999
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Drove to work. Great to have throttle response back. I wonder if performance degraded so slowly that I just didn't notice. I know the car felt pretty laggy in recent memory and that eventually reminded me of how it was driving a few years go when I had to reset the pressures on the regulator. That is why I inspected the regulator and found a myriad of things wrong.
    Brent GREAT DEPRESSION RACING 1992 Duster 3.0T The Junkyard - MS II, OEM 10:1 -[I] Old - 11.5@125 22psi $90 [U]Stock[/U] 3.0 Junk Motor - 1 bar MAP [/I] 1994 Spirit 3.0T - 11.5@120 20 psi - Daily :eyebrows: Holset He351 -FT600 - 393whp 457ft/lb @18psi 1994 Spirit 3.0T a670 - He341, stock fuel, BEGI. Wife's into kid's project. 1990 Lebaron Coupe 2.2 TI/II non IC, a413 1990 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1993 Spirit 3.0 E.S. 41TE -- 1994 Duster 3.0 A543 1981 Starlet KP61 Potential driver -- 1981 Starlet KP61 Parts -- 1983 Starlet KP61 Drag 2005 Durango Hemi Limited -- 1998 Dodge 12v 47re. AFC mods, No plate, Mack plug, Boost elbow -- 2011 Dodge 6.7 G56

  20. #1000
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    Re: The Holset he341 3.0L

    Nicely done, can't complain about that at all.

    What happened to the video of the 12 sec pass?
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