The Holset he341 3.0L

[c2xejk]

Do you run a flex joint for the crossover pipe? Not sure how your turbo is ran in this, is it crossover mounted or is it rear mounted?

Edit: I looked through the pics again and noticed its crossover mount. Question still stands if you run a flex joint on the crossover pipe?

Brent's is different from how I do them now. His is bolted to the transmission with flexs to the manifold.

To get the cost down I now take a stock crossover mount and reuse the flanges and flex joint. The turbo is supported by a solid connection (steel pipe) to the front manifold.

Ed Kelly - www.kmperformance.com

[Ondonti]

My manifolds were built a long time ago when none of us involved really wanted to take any risks. There is even a brace for my wastegate (bolts through the unused hole on the front of the trans where the clutch cable goes through).
I also have a mini bracket that puts 1 bolt into the front head from the turbo flange, but i no longer use that. I could probably save some headaches and use that one hole bracket and cut off the transmission bracket but I will never do it.

You could probably put 1000 pounds on my turbo flange and have no problems.

[bond_bbs]

Thanks for the insight. I'm building tube headers for my 3.0L, and was thinking of not running any flex joints - just the front header straight to the turbo flange, and the rear header bolts to a joint before the turbo flange on the rear and run my external WG out the bottom side of the join below the turbo flange.

[Ondonti]

Well I put a G-valve on the wastegate line and got it to run 3 psi, then even more after I put in 92 octane after work. Now it goes to 5 then creeps way above that. I am not exactly sure if it made it all the way to 10psi. I didn't have the guts to stay in the throttle while looking at the gauge.
Holset seems to have a boost creep problem. It leans out up top which is probably partly caused by increased boost and party by the cam. Not sure what I can do because I already have a full external setup. I would consider porting the turbine housing out if that would help.

I can get 5psi by 2500 rpms but the cams have killed off the power between idle and 2000 rpms. Even though I get boost, power is not there until you get much higher in the revs.

[shayne]

what about installing stock profile cams, or a milder cam profile that is geared towards lower rpm power. that way the turbo could take care of the mid to higher rpm power, and you could have better off boost power and drivability from a milder cam? i know turbovanman has a cam available that is a good mild rv type cam to give these motors even better low and mid rpm power. thats the way i will be going myself, i dunno, just sayin.

[Vigo]

What size is the wastegate? 38mm? Is the pipe feeding it big enough to move to a bigger wastegate?

[Ondonti]

38mm with a pipe from each bank feeding the turbo. I would have to assume as Shayne that the Cam moving so much air on the top end does make a difference with creep, since creep is RPM dependent.
The newer TIal wastegate supposedly flows a little more. I think the pipe is 38mm when it comes together. I am not sure if the larger Tial MUST use a larger pipe. Problem is I would need new flanges.

Right now I am scared to get that high in the RPMs because of the weird wall of power it builds. It just pulls harder as it goes faster in whatever gear. The tires don't wan't to let go in the low rpms because of the gradual creep of boost making a very smooth power delivery, but when the RPMs get high, it gets scary. I am used to having an OBX so this is a very different situation when wheelspin starts. The cams are technically smaller then when originally installed in the Duster because the solid rockers are 1.5:1 ratio and the oem rockers are 1.6.
The warm roads here are hooking really well. I know the Duster was pretty violent with its power hit but this car feels fast without that violence. I would assume that the moment I put in a boost spring that just creates a certain boost level right away without slowly creeping, that smooth feeling will go away.

I think I need to install the Walbro & change filter before freaking out. I don't think 10psi boost is a bad thing, but its bad if you don't have enough fuel. Thankfully I have the ring gaps done to take a lot of abuse. 10psi boost on the Ebay turbo was too much for my original turbo setup with stock fuel pump.

Really enjoying driving it to work but I am using the fresh rings excuse to drive a little too fast (hitting the throttle to keep seating rings). I can see this car getting me into trouble so I need to be careful. Been driving the same route for months and I was always thinking I would do certain parts of the drive differently with a fast car......and I am. Merging apparently requires downshift + a little boost. I need to poke around with the car but i am so exhausted from work that I don't want to touch it.

I would love to race the car right now even though the tune is not perfect. I would definitely need the pump changed for that. Not sure if I will ever get a free day to actually race because we are working 7 days a week as of this last week and I don't know when its gonna stop.

[Ondonti]

BTW vigo down for a 1/4 comparison vs the Aries? :P
This setup could be built for a lot less then 2k.

[Vigo]

All the straight line stuff in my $2009 budget only added up to less than $600. The rest of it was wheels, tires, eibachs, and konis (~$1k).

But sure, ill compare a bigger motor with better heads and better cams and better intake and better exhaust and better turbo to my completely stock 2.5 with a t1 garrett and an intercooler.. why not.

[RoadWarrior222]

Whoa, ima need a gallon more coffee and a reread of the assorted 3.0 sections and groups since time began, 'coz I missed where we have better heads and cams

[Vigo]

Maybe you havent looked at an 8v head lately?

Also brent does not have stock cams in this car.

[bond_bbs]

Brent doesn't have stock anything in that car, it seems.

[shayne]

all work and no play makes johnny a dull boy. still watching with great interest. be carefull working that much can take a lot out of you and cause problems

[Ondonti]

Our cams are microscopic.

I looked up some slightly larger wastegates with the same flange. Precision sells a 39mm and JGS sells a 40mm but the JGS looks kinda sketchy. Apparently a lot of turbo v8 boys use that company.
I really want an SBEC cal because I think a simple VE change could help fix things by keeping the AFR lower....And be able to rev higher (which leads to more creep).

The Duster once had creep problems when it was first put together but when I referenced the wastegate to the compressor and made sure the tune was okay, it stopped.
I can't really spend a lot of time on cars. Now that this is running, I need to finish immigration financial paperwork and finish my last class.

[Ondonti]

I just remembered these cams have the adjustable gears on them. Maybe that could help a little bit....or make things worse :P I have set points on them for 106 and 102 degrees, OEM = 110 and its set that way because the Duster could rev to whatever I wanted with Megasquirt.

[Ondonti]

I also found today that the reason why the gear shifts have gotten annoying is that the motor does not want to idle down until I come to stop. Since I am no longer running "zero" psi boost, I am going to take the base fuel pressure rate down to 31ish from 42, and then see if I can close the throttle stop some without it dieing as I come to a stop. I like smooth gear changes, not a shudder each time the clutch has to force the motor to idle down.
I think the car is pretty ridiculously fast for 3-4 pounds of boost so regardless of problems, I had a huge smile on my face a few times driving home from work. Also seems from the experiences with boost creep that more boost will be fun.
Hoping the cam timing change will result in something positive.

Since I am dropping the base rate I will probably give the Rising rate a little bump. My biggest worry is actually that the OEM fuel pump won't provide fuel when boost gets too high because our pressure relief will open when fuel pressure starts going crazy high.

I think I am going to try the bypass relief mod on my in tank walbro before I install it. That would give me another level of safety, especially with a RRR system that will get crazy high pressures.

[Vigo]

Well, im definitely all for you being safe with your fuel system. After the failures youve already had and the money and work you put into the Duster system it would be a damn shame to have this one fail since you already have the benefit of experience.

[shayne]

have you had any luck so far with tuning your setup? did lowering the base pressure and raising the gain rate help with driveability at all. so far, how is a turbo 3l for a daily driver? you should post up fuel pressures when you find a setup the car is happy with.

[Ondonti]

Dropped down to about 31psi. I was able to drop the idle speed without the motor stalling out when cold. Gave the RRR about half a turn. AFR has turned out about the same. The car now decels most of the time if I am at something like 3000 rpms or higher.

The wideband not starting up is causing me the real problem because then it does die. I pop started the car at a stopsign today as it died at the white stop line and got pulled over (on my way to work). Told him I pop started the car because the oxygen sensor stopped working and he let me go. Must have thought I was drunk.

I think its possible that the AIS is wired incorrectly. Its also possible that the cams are annoying the ECU too much. I never worried too much about idle in the Duster. I want to do all i can to avoid putting in a smaller cam but if I have to then I have to. Car would behave like stock if it had a stock cam. I just like the top end too much...even if I can't use it. I ran 11.54 on a stock cam and 22ps. Also ran 11.9@117 on 16psi, stock cam. That was in the Duster. I won't run boost that high, or E85 fuel in this car.
I also can't put in a stock cam AND use these mechanical rockers. Not compatible with OEM base circle with oem valvetrain.
I don't really end up having time to work on things right now. I now have to find time to call Innovative and throw a fit about their product that has even gotten me pulled over.
Short term I need to install an OEM oxygen sensor.


It would be fun to get her right on fuel safety and make a pass and show people what she can do. If I get the megasquirt AIS working properly then I could see myself ripping MS2 out of the Duster and putting it in the Spirit. Down the road. I want to race the Duster N/A too. Of course I have no time to do any of that :P Maybe have an MS3 built for the Duster.

[Irocelectric93]

Brent, what kind of WB are you running? LC-1 or MTX? I don't know what size the turbine housing is on the HE341...but do you still have your t67? Just curious if you could do some swapping to try and determine a more specific cause of your boost creep. I might have missed this but are these your reground cams with adjustable rockers?