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Thread: standalone EMS

  1. #1
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor
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    standalone EMS

    Looking for input on what is the easiest to use standalone Engine Management System available. Ease of use and tuning would be top priority followed by cost.

  2. #2
    turbo addict
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    Re: standalone EMS

    F.A.S.T. is a very common ems that has good phone support to walk you through the tuning
    http://www.fuelairspark.com/Pages/17...lsXFIOver.aspx
    AEM EMS is another common ems that is very capable system with lots of support
    http://www.aemelectronics.com/engine...ystems-ems-11/

    unfortunately they are both in the 1500 to 2500 range along with other common standalones including like haltec. Some systems go all out like MoTeC and autronic for over 3000.

    Megasquirt is cheap but no matter what other people say its not that easy to setup, Yes tuning is easy but setup sucks.

    You could also go with a piggyback, no not some apexi safc that might as well be sold at walmart in the toy section. I am talking something like the GReddy Emanage or powerhoue mapecu. The only problem is these can only do so much and sometimes its a little tricky how they pull timing for boost and other things like that. These are in the 400-800 dollar range.

    The stock computer in these cars is pretty powerful and for around 35-95 dollars you can have your stock computer socketed and for 175 you can get an ostrich and start tuning your stock ECU. The learning curve is a little steep but you can get all the help you want and need right here on turbo-mopar. You can even have Rob (shelgame or boostbutton.com) make you up a cal for your needs that works for now and as you learn you can make changes as needed. I think this is the best and easiest way to start so you dont have to start from scratch.

    So check out Boostbutton.com (thats where I got the socketing prices) and maybe give him an email.

    Hey Rob, I just thought of something, whats it take to become a Moates dealer? It would be nice if you could offer ostriches prefilled with your tunes.
    Ian Adams Function>Form 1990 shadow scrapped, too rusty:( 1991 Spirit R/T Scrapped, parts sold:( 1989 Turbo Caravan Daily beater with built-[I]ish [/I]​engine slowly evolving into weekend turbo beater.

  3. #3
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Guess I should add some more details. I have a car that has no wiring. I am starting from scatch so can go with anything I can afford. Yes the stock computers can be used but take a while to learn. Tuning by email does not sound fun. I was looking for options that might come with a Tuning For Dummies book.

  4. #4
    turbo addict
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Quote Originally Posted by karlak View Post
    Guess I should add some more details. I have a car that has no wiring. I am starting from scatch so can go with anything I can afford. Yes the stock computers can be used but take a while to learn. Tuning by email does not sound fun. I was looking for options that might come with a Tuning For Dummies book.
    I think FAST is about the most "user friendly" option and they have a number to call and they help you program the system.
    Ian Adams Function>Form 1990 shadow scrapped, too rusty:( 1991 Spirit R/T Scrapped, parts sold:( 1989 Turbo Caravan Daily beater with built-[I]ish [/I]​engine slowly evolving into weekend turbo beater.

  5. #5
    Visit www.boostbutton.com... Turbo Mopar Contributor ShelGame's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Quote Originally Posted by shackwrrr View Post
    F.A.S.T. is a very common ems that has good phone support to walk you through the tuning
    http://www.fuelairspark.com/Pages/17...lsXFIOver.aspx
    AEM EMS is another common ems that is very capable system with lots of support
    http://www.aemelectronics.com/engine...ystems-ems-11/

    unfortunately they are both in the 1500 to 2500 range along with other common standalones including like haltec. Some systems go all out like MoTeC and autronic for over 3000.

    Megasquirt is cheap but no matter what other people say its not that easy to setup, Yes tuning is easy but setup sucks.

    You could also go with a piggyback, no not some apexi safc that might as well be sold at walmart in the toy section. I am talking something like the GReddy Emanage or powerhoue mapecu. The only problem is these can only do so much and sometimes its a little tricky how they pull timing for boost and other things like that. These are in the 400-800 dollar range.

    The stock computer in these cars is pretty powerful and for around 35-95 dollars you can have your stock computer socketed and for 175 you can get an ostrich and start tuning your stock ECU. The learning curve is a little steep but you can get all the help you want and need right here on turbo-mopar. You can even have Rob (shelgame or boostbutton.com) make you up a cal for your needs that works for now and as you learn you can make changes as needed. I think this is the best and easiest way to start so you dont have to start from scratch.

    So check out Boostbutton.com (thats where I got the socketing prices) and maybe give him an email.

    Hey Rob, I just thought of something, whats it take to become a Moates dealer? It would be nice if you could offer ostriches prefilled with your tunes.
    I've thought about it. I think I'm going to start with the flashable computers and go from there. For sure, you will be able to get a custom tune pre-installed on the flashable computer if you desire...
    https://db.tt/SV7ONZpQ
    Rob Lloyd
    '89 Daytona C/S

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    boostbutton.com
    tuning wiki

  6. #6
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Quote Originally Posted by ShelGame View Post
    I've thought about it. I think I'm going to start with the flashable computers and go from there. For sure, you will be able to get a custom tune pre-installed on the flashable computer if you desire...
    Crap, I forgot about those I guess the ostrich wouldn't be needed with those.
    Ian Adams Function>Form 1990 shadow scrapped, too rusty:( 1991 Spirit R/T Scrapped, parts sold:( 1989 Turbo Caravan Daily beater with built-[I]ish [/I]​engine slowly evolving into weekend turbo beater.

  7. #7
    Buy my stuff!!!!!!!!!!! :O) Turbo Mopar Vendor turbovanmanČ's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Quote Originally Posted by karlak View Post
    Guess I should add some more details. I have a car that has no wiring. I am starting from scatch so can go with anything I can afford. Yes the stock computers can be used but take a while to learn. Tuning by email does not sound fun. I was looking for options that might come with a Tuning For Dummies book.
    The stock setup is slighter harder to learn than any other standalone per say, plus Rob or others can help or send you a chip.

    Check out "badassperformance and turboshad", I believe they are using Meqasquirt, or if not, see what they are using, they love their setups.
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
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    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
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  8. #8
    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    JT (badassperformance) has a FAST on his ShelbyZ. Turboshad has the megasquirt.

    Stock computer isnt bad as long as you dont look at the long list of tables and get overwhelmed. ive listed the main tables you need to tune most of the time to get the fuel and ignition timing dialed in well. there are about 6 of them and its not hard at all. if you look at all the tables, its easy to get overwhelmed.

    the majority of aftermarket ecu's dont have good knock detection. its not a wise idea to not have good knock detection on a turbocharged car. its one tank of bad fuel or foolish decision with tuning away from a blown motor.

    Brian

  9. #9
    Buy my stuff!!!!!!!!!!! :O) Turbo Mopar Vendor turbovanmanČ's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Quote Originally Posted by Aries_Turbo View Post
    JT (badassperformance) has a FAST on his ShelbyZ. Turboshad has the megasquirt.

    Stock computer isnt bad as long as you dont look at the long list of tables and get overwhelmed. ive listed the main tables you need to tune most of the time to get the fuel and ignition timing dialed in well. there are about 6 of them and its not hard at all. if you look at all the tables, its easy to get overwhelmed.

    the majority of aftermarket ecu's dont have good knock detection. its not a wise idea to not have good knock detection on a turbocharged car. its one tank of bad fuel or foolish decision with tuning away from a blown motor.

    Brian
    Oh yeah, right, FAST with JT.

    Good points on the knock stuff.
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
    1984 Chev Getaway van, 6.2 Diesel with a remote mounted turbo setup burning WMO-For sale.
    2003 GSW 2.0L TDI, auto, fully loaded, modified, 360K-wife's.
    2004 GSW TDI, 5 speed, fully loaded, modified.

    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

    Super60 roller cams or custom/billet cams. Link to info

  10. #10
    Hybrid booster Turbo Mopar Contributor Austrian Dodge's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    wiring (work) is the very similar on all EMS, so i'd go and take a look what IN/OUTs you want to use and how tuning friendly each system is.
    download the software of your favorites and surf around, see what you like best and keep that in your decision process as you'll be working with that interface for quite some time.

    i went with the haltech platinum sport, software and tuning is straight forward plus it suits all my IN/OUTs for a good price.

    wow, that sounded like an ad LOL

  11. #11
    See me ride out of the sunset... Turbo Mopar Staff BadAssPerformance's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Quote Originally Posted by Aries_Turbo View Post
    JT (badassperformance) has a FAST on his ShelbyZ. Turboshad has the megasquirt.

    the majority of aftermarket ecu's dont have good knock detection. its not a wise idea to not have good knock detection on a turbocharged car. its one tank of bad fuel or foolish decision with tuning away from a blown motor.

    Brian
    Yep, I'm running FAST (Classic, not the newer XFi) and it is probably the simplest most user friendly system out there. Closed loop WBO2 makes tuning a snap. I have run it with a distributor on the old 2.2L and now with a WS coil on the 2.4L with an added on eDist box. You can add a knock sensor if you want (I have not).

    What kind of car is it on? If a 2.2L/2.5L? Race car or cruiser/daily driver?

    JT
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  12. #12
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Putting a TIII in a 1988 daytona as a semi dailey driver. Taking the TII out and installing in a 91 Daytona as a racer only. The 91 could end up with a TIII also if I can get a head repaired.

  13. #13
    Boost, it's what's for dinner... Turbo Mopar Staff Aries_Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    on the fast classic, how does the knock sensor hook up? if its like the BS 3 and the XFI, you have to use a GM knock module and sensor which are not a good fit for our cars at all.

    if you dont use a GM module, you have to make something that will output 8v when there is no knock and 0v when there is to connect to any of the speedpro/FAST/BigStuff3 systems.

    Brian

  14. #14
    See me ride out of the sunset... Turbo Mopar Staff BadAssPerformance's Avatar
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    Re: standalone EMS

    Correct, they all require a GM knock sensor.

    Karlak, if you're running race car on race gas, can tune OK w/o a knock sensor, at least I have been able to so far...

    Also for the FAST system, Forward Motion sells a bolt in kit for the distributor setup. ... a tad more pricey than a MS setup but way easier IMO

    JT
    SDAC Director
    SDAC-Chicago President
    JOIN SDAC and your local Chapter TODAY! - SUPPORT the CLUB that supports YOUR HOBBY!
    87 Shelby Z - 10.50@141.66mph
    87 CSX #751 Clone - 12.88@102.88mph

    www.badassperformance.com
    Check out Turbo-Mopar Times!
    Submit your 1/4 mile times HERE!!

    Support SDAC! Join Today!
    "I'm not some pro athlete with a bajillion dollars, I'm just an every man"
    Note: The information and any images provided in this post are not for distribution outside this forum without the author's permission.

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