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Thread: Possible Fuel pump issue???

  1. #1
    Mitsu booster
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    Possible Fuel pump issue???

    Ok, so i'm back again with more questions for my p.o.s 88' Lebaron turbo... The first fix was easy and I appreciate the fast feedback... BUT, i have encountered another fault in the system... Ran the code reader again and came back with another 13.

    I was driving and just got outta a car wash, cause i wanted my "Lola" Lebaron to shine like a diamond. On my way home, i was going uphill and completely lost all power to the accelerator. I coasted to a stop and pulled over. The engine was barely idling, but all the electronics were working (dash and cd player and all the lights). But it would not respond to me pushing the accelerator to the floor...

    I went to Advance and picked up some new plugs, and a power steering pump (cause they needed to be replaced anyways). While I was there, I asked the guy and he said it could be something with the Ignition coil, or the fuel pump, or some faulty wiring... My dad and I pulled out the ignition coil and the ohm reader was reading right where it should be... Took that into Advance to have them test it, and they said it was fine....

    So now i'm once again carless... And asking for advice... Haha, and fuel pumps for an 88' Lebaron aren't necessarily in my price range...



    Any ideas??? ALL FEEDBACK IS APPRECIATED!!!

  2. #2
    Rhymes with tortoise. Turbo Mopar Staff cordes's Avatar
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    Code 13 indicates that there is a vacuum line problem 99% of the time.

    http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/fault/code13.html

  3. #3
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    Thats what is was before, and it was fixed >http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53024<

    The rotor is not even spinning when the key is turned in the ignition...

  4. #4
    Rhymes with tortoise. Turbo Mopar Staff cordes's Avatar
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    If the rotor isn't spinning while you are cranking the motor something is amiss. See if the cam is spinning while you are cranking. If it is, then there is probably an oil pump/ intermediate shaft problem. If it's not, then the timing belt is probably broken.

    Either way, I'm betting that you still have a vac line problem.

  5. #5
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    jkeese's dad here:
    There is no spark. Started looking at the plugs - nothing. Checked the coil wire to the distributor - nothing. But coil is fine. This seems really weird - how can there be no spark (one problem) AND the rotor doesn't turn. Aren't those 2 totally separate problems?!? How could they have both happened at the same time? Don't know where to go from here.

  6. #6
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    Pulled off cam cover - Timing belt is not broken, but is not turning when we try to start it. I think she's dead.

  7. #7
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    How can all of the other belts turn when trying to start but not the timing belt?

  8. #8
    Hybrid booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    The timing belt is broken. Could be the teeth on the belt are stripped.

  9. #9
    Hybrid booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    the teeth are ripped off the timing belt down on the crank sprocket, happens quite often, not to worry though these engines are not interference engines, no bent valves! just get a new timing belt and set the engine back in time and install new belt and you are back on the road!

  10. #10
    Mitsu booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    so i need an engine lift to install the timing belt?

  11. #11
    Hybrid booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    Go here. It will explain what needs to be done.

    http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/enginetiming.html

  12. #12
    Buy my stuff!!!!!!!!!!! :O) Turbo Mopar Vendor turbovanmanČ's Avatar
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    Quote Originally Posted by jkeese View Post
    so i need an engine lift to install the timing belt?
    No, just some basic hand tools and a jack.
    1989 FWD Turbo Caravan-2.5 TIII, GT35R, auto, a/c, cruise, pwr windows/locks, fully loaded with interior and ran with full exhaust. RETIRED FOR A FEW YEARS! 12.57@104 :O)
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    Aurora ignition wires for sale. Link to info

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  13. #13
    Rhymes with tortoise. Turbo Mopar Staff cordes's Avatar
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???





    Just make sure the little hole in the cam shaft is at the top when you set the arrows. I didn't address that in the videos.

    Also, the belt can be changed in under two hours with basic tools on the side of I-70.



    ETA: Please make sure to give me some feedback or questions regarding the videos. I haven't had them up for long. I winged it while actually doing the belt so I misspoke a couple of times and may have also missed something important.

  14. #14
    turbo addict
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    GREAT VIDEO, well explained too.

    I only watched a friend put the timing belt on my car the day I bought it and this really broke it down for me since at the time I was a noob and really had no idea what was going on besides making the gears lined up somehow.

    and yes a code 13 is vac leak, but I know i was getting that code and had oil in my lines, I blew them out and was good to go.

  15. #15
    Garrett booster
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    WOW CORDES! Props to you guys representing the true TD'er spirit! All be it probably the #1 most dangerous/deadly place to be on a freeway. I think the only thing more dangerous is stupid people backing up on the freeway. I thought I was daring 15 yrs ago when I had to drive my turbo tbird 200 miles from my home to the college I was attending (to avoid emissioning it). I stopped at a rest stop 100 miles from home, opened the hood, saw the oil return line was on fire, calmly dumped some water bottles on it to extinguish it, changed it right there, and turned around and went home. Changing a timing belt on the side of the interstate is pretty insane! How many highway patrol officers stopped by?
    I assume you aren't blaming the car wash for the problem, because I think a majority of people on here will attest that your trip to the car wash combined with your car dying, is just coincidence.
    You said that all the lights were working when the car sputtered and died, did the check engine light come on solid before it died? I assume you got the code 13 after this happened?
    I may be wrong about this (and its late @ night) but if the computer doesn't register the crank shaft turning, and doesn't it use the hep in the dist. for this, then it doesn't power up the asd which would be the reason there is no power to the coil and also to the fuel pump. Isn't this what a code 11 is, except that code only shows up after there is a complete loss of power to the computer and then on the 1st crank of the engine, the computer doesn't register info from the hep, showing the engine is turning.
    If your crank turns, along with all the motor accessory belts, but the timing belt doesn't move; then the timing belt has lost its teeth @ the crank. In my opinion this probably happens more often on belt driven cars than the belt actually snapping.
    I thought I heard that a code 13 may also be triggered by a voltage issue to/ from the map sensor. I bring this up only because you said you fixed the vac lines to the map. I would first test vac right at the map, then maybe test voltage readings going into and coming out of the map as well as also continuity through the ground wire @ the map. If this looks alright, then try t'ing in there with a line that you can run into the car with the gauge and then you should also use a volt meter to test the voltage from the map @ the computer. To really check these properly, you need to rig something so you can drive the car while reading the gauges. If the idle readings seem correct, you need to bring the vacuum/boost gauge and the volt meter into the car. It helps to get some one competent enough to read the gauges and record the results to ride along with you. This way you can see the full range of vacuum and voltage to the sensor. May be a bad map but it can also be a wiring issue to the computer. Just an idea if the problem keeps coming back.
    Best of luck!

  16. #16
    Rhymes with tortoise. Turbo Mopar Staff cordes's Avatar
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    Re: Possible Fuel pump issue???

    Quote Originally Posted by boboli View Post
    WOW CORDES! Props to you guys representing the true TD'er spirit! All be it probably the #1 most dangerous/deadly place to be on a freeway. I think the only thing more dangerous is stupid people backing up on the freeway. I thought I was daring 15 yrs ago when I had to drive my turbo tbird 200 miles from my home to the college I was attending (to avoid emissioning it). I stopped at a rest stop 100 miles from home, opened the hood, saw the oil return line was on fire, calmly dumped some water bottles on it to extinguish it, changed it right there, and turned around and went home. Changing a timing belt on the side of the interstate is pretty insane! How many highway patrol officers stopped by?
    I assume you aren't blaming the car wash for the problem, because I think a majority of people on here will attest that your trip to the car wash combined with your car dying, is just coincidence.
    You said that all the lights were working when the car sputtered and died, did the check engine light come on solid before it died? I assume you got the code 13 after this happened?
    I may be wrong about this (and its late @ night) but if the computer doesn't register the crank shaft turning, and doesn't it use the hep in the dist. for this, then it doesn't power up the asd which would be the reason there is no power to the coil and also to the fuel pump. Isn't this what a code 11 is, except that code only shows up after there is a complete loss of power to the computer and then on the 1st crank of the engine, the computer doesn't register info from the hep, showing the engine is turning.
    If your crank turns, along with all the motor accessory belts, but the timing belt doesn't move; then the timing belt has lost its teeth @ the crank. In my opinion this probably happens more often on belt driven cars than the belt actually snapping.
    I thought I heard that a code 13 may also be triggered by a voltage issue to/ from the map sensor. I bring this up only because you said you fixed the vac lines to the map. I would first test vac right at the map, then maybe test voltage readings going into and coming out of the map as well as also continuity through the ground wire @ the map. If this looks alright, then try t'ing in there with a line that you can run into the car with the gauge and then you should also use a volt meter to test the voltage from the map @ the computer. To really check these properly, you need to rig something so you can drive the car while reading the gauges. If the idle readings seem correct, you need to bring the vacuum/boost gauge and the volt meter into the car. It helps to get some one competent enough to read the gauges and record the results to ride along with you. This way you can see the full range of vacuum and voltage to the sensor. May be a bad map but it can also be a wiring issue to the computer. Just an idea if the problem keeps coming back.
    Best of luck!
    That pic doesn't show it well, but we were probably a good 10-15ft away from the ultra wide shoulder. If it were a regular spot on the freeway we wouldn't have done it there. No cops stopped, and we didn't see any go by. There were a TON of fellow SDAC guys who stopped and offered help, tools, water etc. No better place to break than SDAC.

    As far as the topic at hand, you are right that without a HEP signal you won't get power to the coil or the injectors.

    Once the timing belt gets changed the car will probably fire right up.

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