Int. Shaft play....in and out??

[89ShelbyGuy]

Well, i am doing the head gasket on my shelby...i noticed that my Intermeit shaft has about an 1/8 play if you pull and press on it...the backlash is good...is that how its suppose to be? it was never noisy or ever gave me problems...my oil pressure is awesome...i am just woundering since i have access to it now....rather be safe then sorry.

Tom

[turbovanman²]

Are you sure an 1/8" If so, fix it, should be maybe a 1/16". Probably the retainer got chewed up.

[89ShelbyGuy]

I will have to make sure.....

Wheres that retainer located? is it the peice that bolts to the block?

Tom

[turbovanman²]

I will have to make sure.....

Wheres that retainer located? is it the peice that bolts to the block?

Tom

Yep, that hunk of aluminium with 3 10mm headed bolts, that's the only piece that really controls the play, unless the block is worn or the actuall shaft flange is worn. Its possible some dummy doubled up a gasket?

[135sohc]

The seal housing is what sets the end play for the I shaft, it could be excessivly worn (highly doubt it) or was it installed with the felpro paper gasket vs the oem method of anerobic gel ?

Edit: beat me to it.

[89ShelbyGuy]

Looks like i will be pulling it out and putting some sealer on it...i've never had it out since i bought it....the machine shop probably put a felpo on it...

Thanks guys.

Tom

[cordes]

The gaskets are wafer thin for the int. shaft retainer. To have that much play something else must be afoot.

[turbovanman²]

The gaskets are wafer thin for the int. shaft retainer. To have that much play something else must be afoot.

Not the aftermarket one's, they are quite thick.

[moparloper]

If I'm not mistaken a gasket shouldn’t make a difference to end play. End play is dictated by the thickness of the retainer and the distance between the sprocket seat and shaft thrust face. The shaft is driven into the retainer by the directional force of the oil pump gears. The factory used a thin film sealant to keep the retainer flat to the block and perpendicular to the shaft bore. A gasket tends to tilt the retainer plus using a RTV which clogs the oil passages all this leads up to a galled retainer.
That said I would say excessive endplay is because of a worn down retainer.

[GLHNSLHT2]

Always use anerobic sealer there. the sealer probably has about a .005" thickness vs. close to .100" thickness or so for the stupid felpro gasket. There's a end play spec for the shaft in the FSM. I don't have my books in front of me or I'd look it up.

Moparloper if the thrust face of the retainer is sitting .095" out farther because of a gasket in there then the shaft will be allowed to move that much more than it should be.

[prepared]

Always use anerobic sealer there. the sealer probably has about a .005" thickness vs. close to .100" thickness or so for the stupid felpro gasket. There's a end play spec for the shaft in the FSM. I don't have my books in front of me or I'd look it up.

Moparloper if the thrust face of the retainer is sitting .095" out farther because of a gasket in there then the shaft will be allowed to move that much more than it should be.

This^^

Before I found out about Anaerobic Sealer, I always used the gasket and had the excessive endplay. I drove MANY miles and beat the living crap out of these motors setup that way, though. IMO it is nothing to worry about until it comes apart for some other reason, then fix it.

[89ShelbyGuy]

Well, i finished installing the new head gasket yesterday...everything went well....i measured the play in it and found out its less then a 16th...woo who! Put everything back together, timed it...and man...it started up much better..no need to prime the fuel pump anymore...and the boost was awesome.....i can't wait till m +20s get back from being cleaned and flow tested....


Tom

[moparloper]

Always use anerobic sealer there. the sealer probably has about a .005" thickness vs. close to .100" thickness or so for the stupid felpro gasket. There's a end play spec for the shaft in the FSM. I don't have my books in front of me or I'd look it up.

Moparloper if the thrust face of the retainer is sitting .095" out farther because of a gasket in there then the shaft will be allowed to move that much more than it should be.

Your right I couldn't remember how I measured the end play and I thought I used feeler gauges (between the sprocket and retainer). The sprocket hub is smaller than the seal surface so it is the web in the block that retains the small end of the shaft. Now with that said I could not find a spec in both my FSM's for Int. shaft end play. So if it isn't measured it's not important. This is probably why Felpro thought it was OK to use a gasket.

[turbovanman²]

Your right I couldn't remember how I measured the end play and I thought I used feeler gauges (between the sprocket and retainer). The sprocket hub is smaller than the seal surface so it is the web in the block that retains the small end of the shaft. Now with that said I could not find a spec in both my FSM's for Int. shaft end play. So if it isn't measured it's not important. This is probably why Felpro thought it was OK to use a gasket.

I would say the spec is what the OE wanted, no gasket. Putting one in is asking for trouble as the gears can slide back and forth more causing more wear, one would think.

[tsiconquest88]

^ I am sure it could play a role, i too had the same play in my mini, 1/8" is probably a little exaggerated though, more than 1/16" yes but not double that. That was with whatever a previous owner put there (and there was no actual gasket) so either was stock anerobic stuff or similar.

[Aries_Turbo]

with it driving the oil pump, there should be fairly constant force on the gears pushing the shaft to the one side so it shouldnt be flopping around when running.

id still want it to have as little play as possible though.

brian

[turbovanman²]

with it driving the oil pump, there should be fairly constant force on the gears pushing the shaft to the one side so it shouldnt be flopping around when running.

id still want it to have as little play as possible though.

brian

Don't forget when you back off the gas, it will relieve the load momentarily and move.

[Aries_Turbo]

oil pressure is still there though.

[turbovanman²]

oil pressure is still there though.

It still does it, look at the teeth, wear on both sides,

[Aries_Turbo]

yeah i suppose.