92 GTC Convertible Resto

[Reaper1]

You could go lower profile than that even if that's the style bracing you are going to do, and that's all it's going to be is chassis bracing. IMHO if you are going that far, you might as well do a cage. It wouldn't be that much more work and you can put swing-out's in it to help ease entry.

The under-car bracing HAD to do something. Look at Mustangs and the like...they ALL have subframe connectors available for them and they ALL see an appreciable increase in unibody rigidity. It might not be as much as a superstructure style bracing, but it is still enough to make a large difference.

As far as the re-design of the J-body convertible structure, I believe that happened in '90. They basically copied the TC's design where the rocker panels were reinforced to more effectively take on the torsional load of the chassis. Because the strength was increased farther away from the moment of inertia, the unibody now acted more like an "I"-beam and became more resistant to both twisting and longitudinal flex.

[J&H Ryan]

Why do you say lower? He said ideally you'd have bar going from the a pillar to the B pillar (would there be one) area. You just couldn't get in the car. He said the Sebring has taller sills as well as like an S2000 for the reason of the body wanting to fold up in that area. Will likely still do some sort of under car bracing (see the bar at the bottom in the pic) but it wont be as extensive or thick as originally thought. Also doing a strut tower bar.

I don't want to do a cage because it'll look like a Wrangler. Ever since the PT convertible I don't like the basket handle hoop either.

[Reaper1]

The only reason I brought up "lower" is because the way I was looking at the drawing it makes it look like the top bar will be around elbow height. That would mak getting in and out of the car...shall we say....fun?

[J&H Ryan]

I haven't been in my car in awhile, but the top of the bar will be 6" above the top of the sill, so it shouldn't be a factor at all once in the car and ingress and egress, while hampered somewhat, is a trade off I'm willing to make. Decided to keep the idea of subframe connectors, but no X brace. Could always add something to the subframe connectors, but I doubt it will be needed.

[J&H Ryan]

[Reaper1]

Looking good!

[J&H Ryan]

[Reaper1]

That's kinda neat to see! I like the bird! LOL

[J&H Ryan]

[Lotashelbys]

Heres some more paint progress pics of Ryans car


Final sanded primer before sealer






Sealed


Some loser attempting to spray basecoat


Still trying


Wetsanded and buffed pass side


Hi


Even sanded and buffed the top of door jams....


Rear bumper cover sanded and buffed


Nice and shinny all the way down to the pinch weld.

[Reaper1]

That car got the awesome paint install kit!

When are you gonna do mine!?

[tommyturbo]

I'm curious, you detrimmed it so thoroughly but left the rear bumper cover on? why?

[Lotashelbys]

I'm curious, you detrimmed it so thoroughly but left the rear bumper cover on? why?

That has alot to do with this car being a Northern rust belt car. Everytime I have taken a rear bumper cover off a car like that EVERY single mounting stud has broken off. That would mean to fix it right it would take quite a bit of time to make re-make the stud bar and especially the one riveted to the cover. It looked like another 8 hour project and I already have close to 50 in the bodywork and painting so far and thats just the chassis part that is pictured.

If it was a car from,say the L.A. area it would come off with your fingers and would have been almost too easy lol. The rear bumper cover is the one thing that really make much of a difference painted on or off....

[phantomrt]

Looking good. If only I had the time to do something like that....

But, just for kicks, here's some other stuff that somewhat relates:



This is Turbokid's Lebaron convertible right next to mine. Lets just say that I will question Chrysler's production numbers of 1992 Turbo / 5spd convertibles. I've stumbled upon so many over the years, but perhaps it is just possible that the majority of them ended up in the Twin Cities area somehow. I've seen at least a half dozen, and I wasn't even looking for them.



When I went to pick up TurboKid's car, it was at a newer house that was significantly beat up for a house of its age. In the living room there was only a couch and a coffee table, which was full of pill bottles. No other furniture or working heat or water heater (propane probably ran out.) If it wasn't my "home turf", I probably would've bailed. but it was inner city pill poppers in the country--I could probably hold my own.



Here is a feature you won't see often. I always had dreams of doing this, and I was able to do it the easy way. At a "beer for parts" junk yard, I found yet another 1992 Lebaron GTC Convertible with the 2.5 T-1 and 5spd that had the EVIC system in it. I raped the entire car for the wiring harness. For reference, literally the entire interior of the car has to come apart in order to get this to be fully functional. I came to the junk yard with a case of beer, set it on the counter and asked, "Can I go pull some parts?" at which point he promptly directed me directly to the yard. For $40 and the beer, I got the transmission, entire wiring harness, EVIC system, door panels.... so much stuff that I had a tough time loading it up to take it home. They also have a factory radio amplifier in the trunk when you have a car loaded as such.

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Here is an item for the future. I have all the stuff necessary to install it, so it is pretty much a matter of pulling the dash again, splicing this into the harness, installing all of the actuators, and re-assemble.

The Phantomrt got the auto climate control unit with black buttons, not these which the old man luxury cars got.

[Reaper1]

I'm fairly sure you don't have to rip the entire interior apart to get the EVIC fully functional. I've seen the swap done many times over the years in G and J bodies. Some have gone and replaced the entire harness, while others put the proper wires and BCM in and all was gravy. I will admit that pulling the dash to do it does make a lot of sense considering that the wires that need to be put in are in the dash harness.

[phantomrt]

I know of only a couple others who have swapped in the EVIC system over the years, and in order to get it fully functional is not an easy task by any means and most who got close to doing it accumulated some of the parts but later chickened out or swapped in the body controller and the 6-button unit and maybe the node module and called it good. Who do you know that has done it? I'd like to talk to them. Surely it is possible to not have to tear the car completely apart, but not doing so isn't particularly practical for full functionality. The body computers which are part of the EVIC system have substantially more wires going to them. Things like the left and right door ajar switches are on their own separate circuit. Then there is the lamp outtage module. Then there is the brake fluid level sensor, the coolant level sensor (which BTW, I do not believe that I have ever seen one from the factory in a G/J body reservoir that wasn't a mexican car... but you can buy them at RockAuto.... go figure.) and the node module on the front bumper in which you have to find that does not have corroded connectors on it. Unless the car was already equipped, there is the courtesy lamps and associated switch in the door handle. THEN, the EVIC body computers are 1992 Lebaron specific. It talks on the later class II data bus AND controls the hideaway headlamps. With the exception of perhaps a body control module from an EVIC equipped 1992-1993 New Yorker / Imperial, you are down ---- creek poop chute without a paddle. Then if you have a V-6, they had the oil level sensor. The 1990-1991 parts are a bit more common, but beyond that, GOOD LUCK.

[Reaper1]

I know for fact it was done over on TD. All of the parts needed to do the swap can come from the donor car. Or, you can piece it together from different models. For instance: light outage module can be found on '90/'91- G/J with the EVIC, Y's and probably S's. Brake level sensor: '84-'86 G-body with the body function computer (might be able to use their lamp outage module too), '90/'91- G/J with the EVIC, Y's possibly, *maybe* T&C's with the digital dash. Coolant level sensor: '84-'86 G-body with the body function computer, maybe H bodies that are fully loaded with the 12 button navigator (?), '90/'91- G/J with the EVIC, Y's possibly, and T&C's with the digital dash. The node module can be found on any car that has the overhead console with the temperature and compass option. Door handles: '84-'86 G bodies that were pretty well equipt will have them; I *think* the Daytona Pacificas got it, and I wanna say that really high optioned J-bodies could get it too...through '90; 90-91 G/J w/EVIC (so it seems, probably if the car was optioned with the "Premium Lighting Group" it got it.); oil level sensor: IF the car still has it '84-'86 G-bodies with the body monitoring system (I think there was a TSB to take them out because they were leaking); again *possibly* '90/'91 G/J w/EVIC *might* have it (all the 3.0 oil pans have the hole for it in the front of the pan), and *maybe* Y's with the overhead trip computer and T&C's with the digital dash.

The best part is that most of the plugs and wires are already in the harness, you just have to find them. Yes, I know non-EVIC cars don't have the EVIC plug, nor all the wires to the BCM. That part can be tricky to do while the dash is in. Another cool thing is that you can source the "Premium" BCM from most parts places as a reman unit. So, if you weren't lucky enough to get one from a donor car, you can still find them.

The later stuff is a bit harder to source, so then it is best to have a complete donor car.

[phantomrt]

The one person I know that did it on TD went by the name of "turboSOB". He took it another step farther and got the auto climate controls and digital gauge cluster working into a 1991 G-Body.

I have yet to do a bit more research on this, but I have yet to determine the differences between the tail lights in various years. In 1992, only the GTC got the independent turn signals and the LX models got the old school common bulb setup (they are common bulb, right?). In 1993+, all J-bodies got the newer independent bulb style turn signals. Will this mess up with the lamp outage module function? I do not know. All the aftermarket wiring diagrams are incorrect, and I have no factory service wiring diagrams to go by to look at. It is entirely possible that for the lamp outage to work properly, the module has to come from an independent bulb setup car.

If a 1990+ G-body came with the EVIC system, it was like the adjustable suspension damping system. It existed, but yet it didn't.

Did I hear that right? They had oil LEVEL sensors on the 80's 4 cylinder engines? I will have to look into that.

The brake fluid level sensors aren't horribly rare. The New Yorkers / imperials came with them commonly enough, and those cars are also a good source for node modules.

Then there is this data bus format blitz that happened in 1992. Among my piles of spare parts, I have a spare 6-button traveler that doesn't want to function. I do not know if it has gone bad or whatnot, but it could be because it came from a 1990 or 1991 car. For awhile, I was thinking that the difference in data bus was only between the body control module and engine controller. Again, i am fuzzy on this. Reason I say all of this is because I had a 6-button unit from what I thought was a 1991 car that I plugged in and it worked in my 1992. But I may have mistaken that one for the one that I do have and does not work. I have to clean up my memory on the class II data bus stuff with the CCD bus. Assuming all the data bus stuff changed. I need to find someone with a 1991 EVIC car to play with.

The G, J, P, ZJ, XJ, Dakota, and minivan overhead consoles, for example, all have the compass electronics in the console itself and also have a separate temperature sensor and no node module to speak of. The rest, I am not entirely sure of.

The coolant level sensors are nothing special. I think they are the same as the washer fluid level ones with a long extension to get the float towards the bottom of the reservoir and that is what makes them special... but that is nothing that some ingenuity and JB weld can't accommodate. The 1991+ radiators and reservoirs are different than the 80's cars, so the 80's cars are not a direct swap. So, as to why the coolant level sensor I need is even available for purchase is beyond my comprehension. I've never seen one in a car. Even my donor car had the harness to it all wrapped up factory style and tucked away. Currently, I am using an Imperial coolant level sensor, and overfilled the reservoir to make it work... somewhat anyway.

Let me know about where to buy the reman "premium" body control modules. They must be all out of cores because I have yet to find a place that I don't have to ship mine somewhere in order to get it back.

The coolant level and brake level harnesses aren't in the cars. Easily added and wired to the node module, but most of the time I haven't seen them. The J-bodies have the EVIC plug behind the dash--its the same plug and goes to the same place as the non-EVIC cars. The difference in usage is that the EVICs utilize the pink "hot all the time" wire and the 2-button travelers utilize ignition power feed instead.

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Back to the subject of 1992 Turbo / 568 GTC convertibles, here is another:



Like I said, it is that either Chrysler's production numbers are wrong, or 95% of these cars with this drivetrain configuration ended up in the Twin Cities area. Not that they do not exist, but I have not seen a 1992 Lebaron convertible with a turbo and automatic. I think I've seen a couple coupes in my lifetime with this drivetrain in this year. But with convertibles, 5spd, T-1, I've just come across so many.

This car will need a lot of work. I'm not sure if it is going to end up getting fixed or used as parts. Its just good enough to be able to save.

[Khajjathefang]

You might think it's ugly, and the headlight's can be difficult/$$ to locate, but the 93+ upper nose with the exposed headlights is significantly lighter than the old flip style. Also not having the motor and rods in in the center behind the grill leaves plenty of room for a big front mount.

or you can mount h body headlight buckets in the old style nose...

[Reaper1]

I remember that Daytona. It was a red Shelby and the guy was trying to option it with every gizmo that could be had between the J/G body cars. He also did the 2nd to 3rd gen tail light swap (I beat him to it by something like 6 months). He was having issues getting the speedometer to work in the digital dash until he figured out he needed the "Premium" BCM.

Even if the lamp outage module wants to see one or the other type of taillight assembly, that's nothing a little wiring can't take care of.

No 1990 G-body would have ever gotten EVIC...the center stack and center consoles were higher and stopped at the radio. As for G-bodies getting EVIC at all...I've never seen one or heard anybody ever mention it in that body-style. To my knowledge it wasn't an option on G-bodies at all (unlike the VDS, but that was 1990 only).

I know 1984 cars that were equipped with the body monitoring system (the 24 function one) originally had an oil level sensor. They had problems leaking and there was a TSB to remove it and put a plug in the oil pan hole. I don't remember when that happened, so it could have been available through '86. This would only be found in G-bodies. I can't remember any other car at that time that had that system.

The CCD bus will interact with almost all of the electronics that have anything to do with running the engine, monitoring the engine, or taking care of body functions/monitoring. If the bus changed, so did all of the electronics that interact with it.

Also don't forget that the 1990 radiators are unique as well. Those still use the 80's style overflow.

When I looked into it maybe about 2 years ago, Auto Zone listed the BCM's in their system as being available. They did have a core, but it didn't say anything at the time about needed to send the old one in. That might have changed. The company that would be doing the reman would be Dorman. You might also look around for shops that specialize in refurbishing electronic dashes. I can't remember the name of the company, but I stumbled across one about 2 months ago that did all that stuff.