'04 SRT-4 engine in an '88 Caravan build

[black86glhs]

Any drivability issues with it?

[A.J.]

Looks good I don't think it looks ugly. Who did the welding?????

When I said "hide the ugly" I meant the strip of left over runner that's supporting the new 2.5" pipe. I think it came out great, a lot better than I thought it would with welding a smooth pipe to a cast manifold. I am very happy with the results. AGP in Tempe AZ http://www.agpturbo.com/ did the welding. The welder Kyle was great to deal with. He wasn't exactly sure where to weld the bungs so he held off until I got there. I showed him where I wanted them and he did it while I waited.

Any drivability issues with it?

I'm going to guess the "it" is the new manifold because that's the latest topic. No drivability issues with the new manifold mod. Actually I don't feel any difference but I'm only running 15 lbs of boost right now. The problem is I won't know if it helped at all because I did so many mods before going back to the track.

[black86glhs]

When I said "hide the ugly" I meant the strip of left over runner that's supporting the new 2.5" pipe. I think it came out great, a lot better than I thought it would with welding a smooth pipe to a cast manifold. I am very happy with the results. AGP in Tempe AZ http://www.agpturbo.com/ did the welding. The welder Kyle was great to deal with. He wasn't exactly sure where to weld the bungs so he held off until I got there. I showed him where I wanted them and he did it while I waited.



I'm going to guess the "it" is the new manifold because that's the latest topic. No drivability issues with the new manifold mod. Actually I don't feel any difference but I'm only running 15 lbs of boost right now. The problem is I won't know if it helped at all because I did so many mods before going back to the track.

Yep, that was the "it." I have no idea if it would or not, hence why I asked. Bottom line, you haven't noticed anything, so for now it is fine. Good.

[acannell]

I got my intake done today.

This is neato frito.

[A.J.]

I finally located a plastic PT Cruiser turbo intake, for $37.50. I'm in the process of swapping it over and I have to build a new throttle body to intake adaptor and rework my t-stat housing. So I looked more closely at the plastic intake vs my modified aluminum intake and I'm not sure if I should make to swap to try and gain the extra 14 hp the plastic on is suppose to provide. The opening and the runner is definitely bigger than the unmodified aluminum intake but the runner is smaller than my modified intake. Also the plenum seems to be smaller on the plastic one. So because I have to modify the t-stat housing and have to build a new t-body/intake adaptor, I'm not sure it's worth the effort. So I need some opinions on this, all are welcome.

Pros
1) Possible hp increase
2) Smoother internal surfaces
3) Won't conduct heat like aluminum, cooler intake charge

Cons
1) Possible no hp increase over modified aluminum
2) Too much work for little to no reward

[Reaper1]

See how much water each will hold. That will give you an idea of the internal volume difference. The smaller neck might not be a bad thing...as long as it's not smaller than your throttle body.

[Vigo]

You keep saying you don't feel the need to go faster, so what's 14hp really worth to you? I'm curious to see it done only because of what you were told about the design of the elbow when you modified the aluminum one, but that's a selfish curiousity, and even if it does turn out to be better, are you going to go out and run it hard and get a new ET, or is it just for mental satisfaction? If i felt the way you say you feel about going faster, i wouldn't bother with the swap.

[A.J.]

See how much water each will hold. That will give you an idea of the internal volume difference. The smaller neck might not be a bad thing...as long as it's not smaller than your throttle body.

The tightest spot that I can measure in the elbow in the plastic intake is 2 1/8". My throttle body is a honed out 58mm that measures about 2 1/4" so yes, the plastic intake is smaller than my current throttle body.

You keep saying you don't feel the need to go faster, so what's 14hp really worth to you? I'm curious to see it done only because of what you were told about the design of the elbow when you modified the aluminum one, but that's a selfish curiousity, and even if it does turn out to be better, are you going to go out and run it hard and get a new ET, or is it just for mental satisfaction? If i felt the way you say you feel about going faster, i wouldn't bother with the swap.

I don't feel the need to go faster by building a new forged lower end at $1000-$2000 or more. If I can tweak a couple of things or add cheap bolt-ons that only costs me time (I like to tinker) then I don't mind messing around. The only thing/idea I don't like is having to go to the dyno to see if I'm getting better or hurting my progress at $100 an hour. I do plan on going to the track a couple of times this winter hoping to shave a 1/10 or two off my time and to embarrass a few Corvettes, Mustangs, and Camaros.

[GLHNSLHT2]

The opening at the TB plate looks a lot better and causes a lot less disturbance to the airflow so even thought it's smaller a hair it still might flow more. Not reading back to verify but I would of gone with the next half inch up or so so the pipe mates up to the TB flange and plenum nicer.

The gains aren't just in flow or maybe not flow at all but insulating the intake charge from the heat of the motor allowing less timing to be pulled and more power made.

In a van with a 2.4 I'd of gone down and gotten an n/a 2.4 VAN intake, chopped the runners down and welded on a big box plenum.

[fixit]

i have both an aluminum and plastic intake, is there flow numbers for each?
all things being equal, plastic seems better smoother -- less susceptible to heat soak

[A.J.]

The opening at the TB plate looks a lot better and causes a lot less disturbance to the airflow so even thought it's smaller a hair it still might flow more. Not reading back to verify but I would of gone with the next half inch up or so so the pipe mates up to the TB flange and plenum nicer.

My modified aluminum intake throttle body flange adaptor to intake is a pretty smooth transition. It looks like ---- in the picture I provided because I took the adaptor off. I can't use the stock flange because I'm using a t-body that has the 2.2/2.5/3.3/3.8 bolt pattern so I have to build an adapter plate.

Here's a picture from a previous post:

In a van with a 2.4 I'd of gone down and gotten an n/a 2.4 VAN intake, chopped the runners down and welded on a big box plenum.

I thought about that but the 2.4 N/A Caravan intake #1 cylinder and thermostat housing share a common wall which I don't like.

i have both an aluminum and plastic intake, is there flow numbers for each?
all things being equal, plastic seems better smoother -- less susceptible to heat soak

Comparing the stock aluminum vs the stock plastic intake, the plastic one is suppose to be a 14 hp increase but I'm not dealing with a stock aluminum intake, I modified mine so it has a larger elbow.

[Reaper1]

The tightest spot that I can measure in the elbow in the plastic intake is 2 1/8". My throttle body is a honed out 58mm that measures about 2 1/4" so yes, the plastic intake is smaller than my current throttle body.

How far in was that tight spot? Where is it in relation to the apex of the radius? Do you think it's possible to enlarge the plastic intake entrance to a size that would be compatible with your throttle body.

If the answer to the last question is "no", then I wouldn't really bother unless you got a throttle body that would work. You don't want that mismatch there. If the smallest cross sectional area of the turn is before the apex, that's fine and I wouldn't touch it! That actually HELPS flow. If it doesn't enlarge after the radius I would be a little more concerned. I think you still should try to compare the internal volume between the two as well.

[A.J.]

How far in was that tight spot? Where is it in relation to the apex of the radius? Do you think it's possible to enlarge the plastic intake entrance to a size that would be compatible with your throttle body.

If the answer to the last question is "no", then I wouldn't really bother unless you got a throttle body that would work. You don't want that mismatch there. If the smallest cross sectional area of the turn is before the apex, that's fine and I wouldn't touch it! That actually HELPS flow. If it doesn't enlarge after the radius I would be a little more concerned. I think you still should try to compare the internal volume between the two as well.

The tightest spot is about 1 1/2" in then it open up. I'm not going to grind on the plastic to try and open it up. I did use the throttle body adapter I made to be a smooth transition from the larger t-body opening to the smaller intake opening.

I made the throttle body adapter plate for the plastic intake (took 2 1/2 hours) and got the t-stat house rewelded so I'm going to give the plastic one a try. I like the possibility of keeping the heat out of the air charge. I'll dyno it and if it puts out more then "yay for me." If it doesn't, I'll put the modified aluminum one back on.

[Reaper1]

I think you might see an increase. Dunno how much, but it sounds plausible.

[A.J.]

I got the intake on.



I also bought a turbo blanket for the turbo to keep the heat away and from melting the plastic intake.







I also built a catch can for the vent side of the PCV system because I was getting some oil pre-turbo. I built it out of an AC oil injector that you hook up to a set of AC gauges.

[2.216VTurbo]

^ So how's the seat of the pants dyno result AJ?

[Force Fed Mopar]

Smaller runners might keep velocity up better, which is sometimes better than volume...

[wheming]

I know it makes it look better, but ditch the insulating plastic cover.
It was well regarded on PTCrew.com that it actually locked in heat. You are better off without it.

[A.J.]

^ So how's the seat of the pants dyno result AJ?

The butt dyno did not reveal any improvment. We'll see if the actual dyno does.

I know it makes it look better, but ditch the insulating plastic cover.
It was well regarded on PTCrew.com that it actually locked in heat. You are better off without it.

If anything, the insulator material between the intake and the cover can be removed but the I'm keeping the cover. It looks too nice.



So enjoying my new intake was short lived because I heard some grinding and growling coming from the transmission. Turns out I cracked another case. So welding has done nothing for longevity so I'm not welding the new one and also no more brake boosting. Once I get it back together I'm going to work on getting the launch control in MegaSquirt working.

[wheming]

Dang. That really sucks.
That damage is from brake boosting?