93 2.4l DOHC Shadow

[cordes]

I too am glad to hear that you made it home with front tires the only thing worse for wear.

[Aries_Turbo]

The lesson learned on this trip is when you don't have time to check your toe before you leave then be sure to find time while you're there. Otherwise 4000 miles later you won't have any tread left on your front tires....oops. I'm pretty sure that's the only reason cereal man beat me in the autocross.

i could have taking time off from eating ribs/socketing SBEC's and LM's/making cals to make you a toe gauge from aluminum bits, pop rivets, 3/4" conduit and EMT connectors, all you had to do is ask lol.

just kidding. i do have a pretty sweet toe gauge made from those things though at home.

Brian

[turbovanman²]

just kidding. i do have a pretty sweet toe gauge made from those things though at home.

Brian

[Mopar318]

Damn, another autocross missed and missed opportunity to prove how well the SC handles without the front swaybar.........the hurt just keeps piling up

Front sway bars don't help much for FWD anyways. especially over powered nose heavy cars. There is a great lakes divisional event next week....so you there?

[Shadow]

Front sway bars don't help much for FWD anyways. especially over powered nose heavy cars. There is a great lakes divisional event next week....so you there?

How far is Great Lakes from Winnipeg MB Canada? There's a local (2 hrs away) track here that I can try for 50.00 on any wknd that they run. (or so I'm told) A $200,000.00 300WHP N/A Honda holds all the records there, so I'd like to school him first, then cruise around the country showing off to everyone else

[Aries_Turbo]

ill try to remember.

[turboshad]

Front sway bars don't help much for FWD anyways. especially over powered nose heavy cars.

That is an extremely broad statement. The need for a front sway bar has to do with how the rest of the car is set up. If the rear end of your car is stiff enough on your over powered nose heavy FWD then and it is over steering then a front sway will do you good. I have both front and rear and am very happy with how generally neutral it felt. Once entered, while going around a corner if anything it would want to over steer just a touch but it was very predictable to feel when that was about to happen. On my car with how it is set up I wouldn't remove my front sway bar.

[turbovanman²]

Post 779?

[168glhs1986]

So sounds like u had toe out? That helps turn in / oversteer.

[turboshad]

Post 779?

Going downhill on the way there about 28-30. Going uphill with a head wind on the way home about 26. Still have the Holset in but picked up a couple WGs from Brian so one more step closer.

So sounds like u had toe out? That helps turn in / oversteer.

I don't know if I have toe out or in, I just know it's off enough to scrub a set of tires. It handled very similarly in MD but with a touch more over steer b/c I had the 1 1/8" front bar on. This year I put the 1 1/4" bar on and it felt better. I drove it last year without the bar and didn't like it at all as the front felt like it was moving too much for my tastes.

[Pat]

So sounds like u had toe out? That helps turn in / oversteer.

I've read that, but when I tried running with a bit of toe out and the car was extremely darty. It might be fine with a better front to back weight distribution and less torque, but in my car, it was a bit scary.

Since that little experiment, I've been running with a hair of toe in and it seems to work. The car is extremely stable, predictable and I've seen no negative turn in effects.

[shadow88]

Where are the tires worn? If you could snap a picture and indicate what position each tire was and what direction it was rolling, it could help, but not as much as putting the car on a proper alignment machine.

What settings would you want? There'e more opinions on how you should be set up than we can shake a stick at here.

[turbovanman²]

Going downhill on the way there about 28-30. Going uphill with a head wind on the way home about 26. Still have the Holset in but picked up a couple WGs from Brian so one more step closer.

Very nice. How fast?

[turboshad]

^^^Average is probably around 75mph so ~120kph.

I should probably clarify that the reason my toe is screwed is because I changed outer tie rod ends right before my trip to SDAC. I did the ol' they look to be about the same size but I'll check it if I have time. Well I didn't get the car done until 9:30 the morning I had to leave, I still needed to pack and I had a good 14hrs ahead of me for the day. Heck I didn't even know if my fuel gauge circuit would work since I didn't have time to even program that into the new display. Either way I had an SDAC to get to and there was no way I would miss it. I fully expected the toe not to be proper but it drove straight so I left it. My intention was to check it once in Detroit but you know how SDAC goes, before you know it you're on the road home. Needless to say it was out like I thought. The wear if fairly even but if anything there is more on the outside which I would think means too much toe in.

I have toe plates and have been doing my own toe/camber alignments for the past 3 years without issue. It's just a matter of making some time and setting it right which for me will be zero toe. Generally I would run a 1/16" toe out to accommodate for the bushing flex when accelerating but with the new control arms I run zero in or out.

[Mopar318]

That is an extremely broad statement. The need for a front sway bar has to do with how the rest of the car is set up. If the rear end of your car is stiff enough on your over powered nose heavy FWD then and it is over steering then a front sway will do you good. I have both front and rear and am very happy with how generally neutral it felt. Once entered, while going around a corner if anything it would want to over steer just a touch but it was very predictable to feel when that was about to happen. On my car with how it is set up I wouldn't remove my front sway bar.

Sense the sarcasm?.....guess not, haha.

You wont catch me without a front sway bar thats for sure!

I run "large" front ACR bar and ST 22mm rear bar. Car is extremely balanced.

[168glhs1986]

I've read that, but when I tried running with a bit of toe out and the car was extremely darty. It might be fine with a better front to back weight distribution and less torque, but in my car, it was a bit scary.

Since that little experiment, I've been running with a hair of toe in and it seems to work. The car is extremely stable, predictable and I've seen no negative turn in effects.

Darty at high speeds right? Your car serves double duty and from what I've read setting toe for autox and for high speed stability should oppose one another. 1/16 or so toe out for oversteer (help turn in) but not for high speed stability. 1/16 toe in for high speed stability but will understeer. They also say for FWD the toe become more "toe in" under acceleration which would also help for straight line stability. My toe is set at 1/16 out with a big bar in rear and stocker in front. It works fine for me. To help with a darting car, wouldn't a bigger bar up front help and/or stiffening the front struts?

[Mopar318]

Toe out will wear the outside edge. On my previous setup I was using up a bunch of the edge. This time around I gave it just a tiny bit of to out but more neg. camber.

[Mopar318]

Darty at high speeds right? Your car serves double duty and from what I've read setting toe for autox and for high speed stability should oppose one another. 1/16 or so toe out for oversteer (help turn in) but not for high speed stability. 1/16 toe in for high speed stability but will understeer. They also say for FWD the toe become more "toe in" under acceleration which would also help for straight line stability. My toe is set at 1/16 out with a big bar in rear and stocker in front. It works fine for me. To help with a darting car, wouldn't a bigger bar up front help and/or stiffening the front struts?

You will defiantly want either zero toe or a little toe out for autocrossing. Just watch your tire wear, since toe will really eat up your tires. With my new expensive wheel/tires I went with just a tad bit of toe out. Turn in was decreased from what I can tell but I am running more negative camber so I am getting more contact through the corner.

[Turbo3Iroc]

Well I didn't get the car done until 9:30 the morning I had to leave, I still needed to pack and I had a good 14hrs ahead of me for the day....

In classic DJ fashion!

[BadAssPerformance]

In classic DJ fashion!

No doubt!