Megasquirt help !

[R/Tony]

Hello folks

I need some help, heres my setup:

2.5L common block, Holset turbo
Megasquirt MSnExtra 29y3, MSI V3 board. 4bar MAP
36-1 trigger wheel.
Ford Escort 92 crank sensor.
Neon SRT-4 coil and spark wires.
CLT, IAT from GM
Neon Stage 2 High-z Injectors (683CC)

the car can not keep running by itself, once I crank the engine it fires up without major problem, but I have to be moving the gas pedal and acelerating it because it dies if i dont keep it accelerating... actually it dies also when I acelerate the engine (say 4000 or 5000rpms) and left the gas pedal like that (accel) ... I need to be moving the gas so it can be alive ...

What could be wrong? ... the engine sound is great, the motor is a fresh rebuild, so mechanically is perfect, I think this is a electrical, configuration problem, but Im not sure whats wrong...

The TPS readings are ok in the Megatune.

I have already moved the potenciometers inside the ECU in order to try to clean the crank signal, but didnt have much luck.
Please help me this error is driving me crazy.

I will post the MSQ as soon as I pull it from my laptop, heres a pic of the crank sensor:


the engine is in TDC.


Thanks,.

[R/Tony]

nobody ?

is somebody using 36-1 wheel, ford crank sensor, MSI v3 on a 2.5 ? to see the msq and see whats wrong with this.

[crazymadbastard]

I read up on the 36-1 setup and yours is right. I would check the tps voltage and map values both in the megasquirt and with a voltmeter.
I am just learning about megasquirt, I have the ecu and a 2.4l ready to go.

[shadow88]

I'm a megasquirt noob, but I'll offer the little help that I can.

Megasquirt MSnExtra 29y3, MSI V3 board <-----I don't know what the heck that is. Do you run idle air control? I've learned how to get them to idle without it. Am I correct in assuming you ONLY have an idle problem?

[R/Tony]

I'm a megasquirt noob, but I'll offer the little help that I can.

Megasquirt MSnExtra 29y3, MSI V3 board <-----I don't know what the heck that is. Do you run idle air control? I've learned how to get them to idle without it. Am I correct in assuming you ONLY have an idle problem?

Well.. MsnExtra 29y3 is the firmware code inside the ECU, MSI stands for Megasquirt 1 (older chip), V3 is the version of the board.

And Im not running idle control, this issue is something similar when you acelerate you'r engine to 4000 or 5000 rpms and then sudenly you disconect your fuel pump and the engine dies because it doesnt have fuel, but here is diferent because i do have fuel pressure (60psi in the fuel rail always).

Thanks

[shadow88]

ok, so it doesn't "catch" and idle? We got my buddies' neon to idle using ignition timing adjustments and the idle stop screw.

If I'm not on the right track, and have completely misunderstood your problem, stop reading and try to explain the problem better, maybe a video would help.

We found adjusting the lower rpm ignition timing very advanced (25-30 deg) under 800 rpms. This will help the engine from stalling. Also adjusting the minimum idle stop screw just a touch more open was all it took for us. It took a little messing around, but it was a fairly simple fix. Also richening the mixture slightly below 800 rpm (13:1) helped too.

[R/Tony]

ok, so it doesn't "catch" and idle? We got my buddies' neon to idle using ignition timing adjustments and the idle stop screw.

If I'm not on the right track, and have completely misunderstood your problem, stop reading and try to explain the problem better, maybe a video would help.

We found adjusting the lower rpm ignition timing very advanced (25-30 deg) under 800 rpms. This will help the engine from stalling. Also adjusting the minimum idle stop screw just a touch more open was all it took for us. It took a little messing around, but it was a fairly simple fix. Also richening the mixture slightly below 800 rpm (13:1) helped too.

Yea i will try ... I been thinking in a video, I will try this weekend to record the behaviour so you can give me another advice.
Thanks.

[shadow88]

Feel free to talk everyone through the problem even though your own voice sounds weird to you.

[R/Tony]

Feel free to talk everyone through the problem even though your own voice sounds weird to you.

haha .. I will need to make the video in english and in spanish for some friends also here...

[Tony Hanna]

Hello folks

I need some help, heres my setup:

2.5L common block, Holset turbo
Megasquirt MSnExtra 29y3, MSI V3 board. 4bar MAP
36-1 trigger wheel.
Ford Escort 92 crank sensor.
Neon SRT-4 coil and spark wires.
CLT, IAT from GM
Neon Stage 2 High-z Injectors (683CC)

the car can not keep running by itself, once I crank the engine it fires up without major problem, but I have to be moving the gas pedal and acelerating it because it dies if i dont keep it accelerating... actually it dies also when I acelerate the engine (say 4000 or 5000rpms) and left the gas pedal like that (accel) ... I need to be moving the gas so it can be alive ...

What could be wrong? ... the engine sound is great, the motor is a fresh rebuild, so mechanically is perfect, I think this is a electrical, configuration problem, but Im not sure whats wrong...

The TPS readings are ok in the Megatune.

I have already moved the potenciometers inside the ECU in order to try to clean the crank signal, but didnt have much luck.
Please help me this error is driving me crazy.

I will post the MSQ as soon as I pull it from my laptop, heres a pic of the crank sensor:


the engine is in TDC.


Thanks,.

Ok, I have no MS experience at all but I'll try to help.

What I'm getting from your description is that you have to keep constantly moving the gas pedal to keep the engine running right? Sort of like a carburetor with nothing working but the accelerator pump?

If that's the case then it sounds to me like it's just not getting enough fuel to run without the extra fuel that's provided during throttle transitions. I'm not sure how the tuning software works, but is there any way that you can add fuel? Maybe start with idle and see if you can add enough fuel so that it will stay running at idle and then work from there?
Sorry I can't be more help.

Tony

[Kevin]

Sounds like you've got a problem with the accel enrichment settings.

As to what that problem is... not sure.

PM me when you post up a log of the car doing it as I probably won't remember to check this thread. I can take a look and see if I notice anything crazy but I'm still working some bugs out of my own MS setup so take my advice with a grain of salt.

[shelbydave]

How are you getting power to the Megasquirt? Are you running a separate relay board, or is it hooked straight off the ignition? A friend of mine had a slew of similar problems with the power running off the Ignition switch. We checked with an OScope, and there was a large amount of noise in the fuel injector signal. After he added a separate relay so the MS could get power straight off the battery, his problems cleared up.

[cododgeneon]

to me it sounds like a tuning issue.

You need to set warm up enichments then start tuning the VE table.

Best thing to do is get it pig rich and then lean it out over time to get the warm up enrichments correct.

[R/Tony]

How are you getting power to the Megasquirt? Are you running a separate relay board, or is it hooked straight off the ignition? A friend of mine had a slew of similar problems with the power running off the Ignition switch. We checked with an OScope, and there was a large amount of noise in the fuel injector signal. After he added a separate relay so the MS could get power straight off the battery, his problems cleared up.

I am running the MS directly without the relay board, where did you check with the OScope? directly the signal of the injector ?

to me it sounds like a tuning issue.

You need to set warm up enichments then start tuning the VE table.

Best thing to do is get it pig rich and then lean it out over time to get the warm up enrichments correct.

Im starting to think on that posibility, because I was moving a litle bit the VE table and seems like the car needs more gas, but sometimes I am getting a lot of explosions due to excesive gas, and black smoke....

I need time to jump into the issue for at least 3 or 4 hours...

[shelbydave]

I am running the MS directly without the relay board, where did you check with the OScope? directly the signal of the injector ?

We checked the signal directly on the injector. It was unbelieveable the difference in the signal after running it through a relay board directly to the battery.

[R/Tony]

We checked the signal directly on the injector. It was unbelieveable the difference in the signal after running it through a relay board directly to the battery.

well.. I am running a relay only for the injectors... but not using the native relay board of megasquirt.....

Almost everything is behind a relay (injectors, Fuel pump, the ECU, W/I, O2 sensor), they have their own relay... its the same?

[Kevin]

You could try reflashing the firmware on it.

Also I can send you a VE and timing table that are working for me right now... well sort of working that is. I can drive with it but anything beyond a little bit more throttle than 5% is really really lean.

By the end of the weekend I'll have something usable if you're not in a rush.

[R/Tony]

You could try reflashing the firmware on it.

Also I can send you a VE and timing table that are working for me right now... well sort of working that is. I can drive with it but anything beyond a little bit more throttle than 5% is really really lean.

By the end of the weekend I'll have something usable if you're not in a rush.

Yeah that could help me a lot... !!

Actually I can wait, no problem.

[Kevin]

PM me your email address and I can get that timing table sent out. It's not my original timing table it's from a member on another forum who went through the effort to make it from the factory values. I just took it and made some educated guesses to bring the values out to 400kPa and 7200rpm.

http://www3.sympatico.ca/d.larouche/ms/ that's his website where the original timing table is at if you just have use for it. It only goes to 250kpa though.

[shelbydave]

well.. I am running a relay only for the injectors... but not using the native relay board of megasquirt.....

Almost everything is behind a relay (injectors, Fuel pump, the ECU, W/I, O2 sensor), they have their own relay... its the same?

I'm talking about the power to the Megasquirt itself. He originally had it connected somewhere through the ignition switch so the MS would power when the key was turned on. His fix was to power a relay with the ignition switch, and run the MS power straight from the battery through the relay to the MS.

I don't believe he got the relay board, but just used a separate relay.