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Thread: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

  1. #3061
    See me ride out of the sunset... Turbo Mopar Staff BadAssPerformance's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Yeah, incrementals... I've looked at those on runs the same day to see where its spinning, lets look at these runs, I'll highlight the best for each increment in BOLD. Keep in mind that it cut out on at least the 10.62 run.

    Oct 2011
    Run #2 - Used 2-step, spun a bit more on launch and into 2nd, granny 3, slightly open throttle 4, AGAIN cut out top end but was a new best run!

    R/T: .108
    60': 1.806 - 1.806
    330': 4.792 - 2.986
    1/8ET: 7.063 - 2.271
    1/8mph: 110.81
    1000'ET: 8.996 - 1.933
    1/4ET: 10.623 - 1.627
    1/4mph: 138.44


    26" tire with 3.50:1 A568 ~164 in 4th at 7k (152 @ 6500)

    SDAC-22 June 2012
    Run #1 - Right off the trailer, cold tires @ ~11psi, moderate burnout (was too far in water so not too hot), 2-step, spin in 1st then hook, granny shifted, no cut out! felt decent, new PB!

    R/T: 0.314
    60': 1.7050 - 1.705
    330': 4.6569 - 2.9519
    1/8ET: 6.9678 - 2.3109
    1/8mph: 108.74
    1000'ET: 8.9131 - 1.9453
    1000'mph: 127.04
    1/4ET: 10.5638 - 1.6507
    1/4mph: 136.85


    26" tire with 3.85:1 A568 ~149mph in 4th at 7k (138 @ 6500)

    October 2012
    Run #1. 2-step, spin

    R/T: 0.094
    60': 1.760 - 1.76
    330: 4.716 - 2.956
    1/8 ET: 7.022 - 2.306
    1/8 mph: 109.52
    1000': 8.972 - 1.95
    1/4 ET: 10.600 - 1.628
    1/4 mph:139.66


    24.5" tire with 3.85:1 A568 ~141mph in 4th at 7k (131 @ 6500)

    Today, October 20, 2013
    Run #2 No 2-step, hook for a second then spin 1st, spin and shake 2nd, 30psi

    R/T: 1.782
    60': 1.713 - 1.713
    330: 4.722 - 3.009
    1/8 ET: 7.008 - 2.286
    1/8 mph: 107.73
    1000': 8.945 - 1.937
    1/4 ET: 10.557 - 1.612
    1/4 mph:140.55

    Looks like traction helps the short times... and rpm helps the big end. Can't say I'm too shocked?

    Amazing how close the increments even are on these runs... maybe this car has a longer powerband than I thought?

    JT
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  2. #3062
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor Shadow's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Here's how I see it;(I don't use the 1000' just to simplify things)

    24.5/ 3.50FD

    60'....1.806
    .................................2.986
    330'...4.792
    .................................2.271
    1/8... 7.063(110.81)
    .................................3.56
    1/4... 10.623(138.44)


    26/ 3.50FD

    60'... .1.705
    ...................................2.9519
    330'...4.6569
    ...................................2.3109
    1/8....6.9678(108.74)
    ...................................3.596
    1/4....10.5638(136.85)


    26/3.85FD

    60'.....1.76
    ..................................2.956
    330'...4.716
    ..................................2.306
    1/8....7.022(109.52)
    ..................................3.578
    1/4... 10.60(139.66)


    24.5/ 3.85FD

    60'.....1.782
    ...................................2.94
    330'...4.722
    ...................................2.286
    1/8....7.008(107.73)
    ...................................3.542
    1/4....10.55(140.55)


    Gonna look at this from the back-half first, just because it looks easier that way.

    Now I'm assuming by how high in RPM's your shifting that every one of these tire/ FD combo's has you in 4th gear Before the 1/8th, correct? (cause that would obviously make it harder to compare)

    That being said, when you look at the back half runs, from the 1/8th on it's Exactly what you would expect to see. The more gear the faster you are accelerating down the track. So the 24.5/ 3.85 combo is gaining you a Full .02 hun over any other combo. It is also gaining you .054 (half a tenth) over the worst gear combo.

    When you compare the 330' to 1/8th mile it Almost plays out the same way except for the 24.5/ 3.50FD combo having a slightly faster 2.271 vs the 24.5/ 3.85FD 2.286. Now, also notice that for whatever reason (shifting, break-up ect) the 24.5/ 3.50FD also has the Highest 1/8th MPH And the 24.5/ 3.85FD just happens to have the Lowest 1/8th MPH. That's a little strange, so something went on there.

    Now let's look at the 60' to 330' and this is where things get interesting. The 26/ 3.50FD combo easily gave you your best 60' by a long shot and you would expect that to continue through 2nd gear to give the best 60' to 330' interval, but it doesn't.

    This was what I was commenting on in the times thread were I said from the 60' on, the 24.5/ 3.85FD combo is actually accelerating the fastest. 2.94 vs 2.9519, so you accelerated from the 60' to the 330' a Full .01 hund Faster with the 24.5/ 3.85FD combo.

    Do you know if the 24.5/ 3.85FD combo has you shifting the 1-2 before the 60' and the 26/ 3.50FD After the 60'? This would be the simplest explanation.

    So over-all, to me at least, it looks like your driving + rpm shift points + vehicle = favours the 24.5/ 3.85FD the most, as it gives (other than the 330'-1/8th anomaly) the greatest acceleration down the track and surprisingly does Not loose very much down low.

    The fact that your axles are happier is a huge added bonus! It does make me wonder, however, just how much Better the car is running now vs the 26' combo's when I seem to remember it always suffering "break-up" problems?

    Robert Mclellan
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  3. #3063
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow View Post
    Here's how I see it;(I don't use the 1000' just to simplify things)

    24.5/ 3.50FD

    60'....1.806
    .................................2.986
    330'...4.792
    .................................2.271
    1/8... 7.063(110.81)
    .................................3.56
    1/4... 10.623(138.44)


    26/ 3.50FD

    60'... .1.705
    ...................................2.9519
    330'...4.6569
    ...................................2.3109
    1/8....6.9678(108.74)
    ...................................3.596
    1/4....10.5638(136.85)


    26/3.85FD

    60'.....1.76
    ..................................2.956
    330'...4.716
    ..................................2.306
    1/8....7.022(109.52)
    ..................................3.578
    1/4... 10.60(139.66)


    24.5/ 3.85FD

    60'.....1.782
    ...................................2.94
    330'...4.722
    ...................................2.286
    1/8....7.008(107.73)
    ...................................3.542
    1/4....10.55(140.55)
    I sat at the tree for a bit on the 10.55, so the R/T looks like a 60'... not sure if you saw my last post, but I corrected it below in your format:

    24.5/ 3.85FD

    60'.....1.713
    ...................................3.009
    330'...4.722
    ...................................2.286
    1/8....7.008(107.73)
    ...................................3.542
    1/4....10.55(140.55)

    So it appears that it likes the 3.50 gear in the 330-1/8 and the 3.85 gear after that?

    Good question on where the 24.5/3.85 1-2 shift was, I think after the 60' or the 60' would have suffered?

    Maybe this is due to a couple reasons, one is possibly traction, and the other is better 3-4 shift on the 3.85 run, but in reality they are so close and there are so many other variables... yes, not breaking up is a major plus!

    JT
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  4. #3064
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor Shadow's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Ah, see I thought the 1.713 was the "missprint" and the 1.782 was the actual 60'. (someone quoted it in the times thread and showed the 60' as 1.782) The 1.713 makes more sense since your spinning so bad through second gear, but you Should be able to correct that with boost by gear. If you can cut a 1.71 60' on the 24.5's, you should certainly be able to get the 3.009 (60' to 330') down to at least 2.96-2.97. So real close to a 10.50

    Just an FYI, your top end charge from the 1/8th on is pretty well on par with the Charger when it ran 10.28 @ 139mph So lack of hook and/or weight difference is costing you 2-3 tenths, really Not that bad when you weigh the difference in axle breakage ect.

    Robert Mclellan
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wambNdfnu5M
    10.04 @ 143.28mph (144.82 highest mph)
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  5. #3065
    Supporting Member II Turbo Mopar Contributor Shadow's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by BadAssPerformance View Post

    So it appears that it likes the 3.50 gear in the 330-1/8 and the 3.85 gear after that?
    I don't think so, that doesn't make sense to me. It likes the 3.50 gears Before the 330', but by the time you shift into third the car is already moving with enough momentum that the 3.85FD Should be taking over.

    One other thing I want to add when weighing all these variables;

    Your all time best hook was the 26/ 3.50FD combo going 1.705 60', but more importantly 4.6569 to the 330'. That is 0.0651 (6 1/2 hun, or over 1/2 a tenth) faster than the 24.5/ 3.85FD's 4.722 330'.

    But! look at the rest of the run. From the 330' on, the 24.5/ 3.85FD combo takes back 0.0249 to the 1/8th and then another 0.054 from 1/8th to the 1/4.

    So you take back a total of 0.0789 past the 330', overcoming the gain from the traction of the 26/ 3.50FD combo by 0.0138!

    So as far as I can see, the 24.5/ 3.85FD combo is still working Best for you. + the added bonus of it being the easiest on your axles

    make sense?
    Last edited by Shadow; 11-06-2013 at 11:11 AM.

    Robert Mclellan
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wambNdfnu5M
    10.04 @ 143.28mph (144.82 highest mph)
    Worlds fastest 8v MTX Shelby Charger
    Manitoba's Fastest 4cyl!
    8 valve, No Nitrous!
    New clutch combo is the SH!T!

  6. #3066
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Rob, nice to catch up at SDAC-24, wish we had more time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow View Post
    So as far as I can see, the 24.5/ 3.85FD combo is still working Best for you. + the added bonus of it being the easiest on your axles
    Yeah, they all seem so close to each other.... Well its the combo I have now so I'm going to play with lower boost and if I can get it to work!

    JT
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  7. #3067
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    OK, I just typed an EPIC recap of all runs this year so far... and accidentally closed the damn window so I'm taking a break from the PC.... I'll just post this hear for now... anyone see plugs crack like these before?

    Pics are upside down, Cylinders 4-3-2-1

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    JT
    SDAC Director
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  8. #3068
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by BadAssPerformance View Post
    OK, I just typed an EPIC recap of all runs this year so far... and accidentally closed the damn window so I'm taking a break from the PC.... I'll just post this hear for now... anyone see plugs crack like these before?

    Pics are upside down, Cylinders 4-3-2-1

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    JT, that is carbon tracking. It is not uncommon. One of the easiest ways to find a misfire. You should change plug wires too. Quite often, when this happens, if you reuse the wires it will happen to the new plugs too.
    That is what I have seen. Others mileage may vary.
    Bryan
    86 GLHS #161, 2016 Impala
    SDAC National Member, SDAC Buckeye Chapter Member

    A man has got to know his limitations.....

  9. #3069
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by black86glhs View Post
    JT, that is carbon tracking. It is not uncommon. One of the easiest ways to find a misfire. You should change plug wires too. Quite often, when this happens, if you reuse the wires it will happen to the new plugs too.
    That is what I have seen. Others mileage may vary.
    Thanks man, never heard of that one before. I'll take another look at the wires too, didn't see anything the first time but wasn't sure what to look for. I looked up pics of carbon tracking and they typically look quite a bit different than mine do, just an observation. Also, one set that misfired had no trace of cracking on it

    JT
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  10. #3070
    See me ride out of the sunset... Turbo Mopar Staff BadAssPerformance's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    OK, freshly re-typed the log of runs so far in 2014. Only things changed since last year are as follows:

    -new master cylinder to fix brakes
    -new spark plugs, same NGK's as before
    -Changed oil

    SDAC-24 Runs

    Q8 Qualifier 1 - No 2-step, spun 1+2, cutout 3+4

    R/T: .716
    60': 1.838
    330': 4.992
    1/8ET: 7.408
    1/8mph: 103.01
    1000'ET: 9.494
    1/4ET: 11.243
    1/4mph: 129.10

    Somewhat unsure at this point why it was cutting out. I had flashbacks from last year at SDAC-23 with the cam sensor issues and decided to zip-tie the wires better to keep from possibly contacting something to cause interference. It was a different kind of braking up tho. I just put new plugs in, so those should be good? Maybe the coil I put on last year when miss-diagnosing the cam sensor issue? Damnit I forgot that coil at home. I brought the old plugs that came out but #3 had cracked porcelain so I didn't want to put them in. Let me close the plug gap a little...

    Q8 Qualifier 2 - No 2-step, spun 1+2, miss 3rd - cutout in 3+4

    R/T: .358
    60': 1.802
    330': 5.071
    1/8ET: 8.017
    1/8mph: 89.14
    1000'ET: 10.363
    1/4ET: 12.364
    1/4mph: 107.29

    Still cutout but a little better. Not sure why it was doing that when it never did before. No time to try anything else, just will run it how it is....

    Q8 Round 1 - 2-step, spun 1+2, cutout 3+4 - This was a fun race, we were side by side early on and barely edged Pat out

    _____JT_(W)______Pat_____
    R/T: .095 ---------- .246
    60': 1.964 --------- 1.708
    330': 5.113 -------- 5.060
    1/8ET: 7.566 ------ 7.790
    1/8mph: 102.15 -- 92.15
    1000'ET: 9.685 --- 10.112
    1/4ET: 11.457 ---- 12.048
    1/4mph: 127.10 -- 116.80

    Q8 Round 2 - 2-step, spun 1+2, cutout 3+4 - Another fun race, would have been very close if this car wasn't breaking up!

    _____JT_________Lengel_(W)_
    R/T: .183 ---------- .293
    60': 1.794 --------- 1.719
    330': 4.958 -------- 4.775
    1/8ET: 7.382 ------ 7.078
    1/8mph: 100.94 -- 109.46
    1000'ET: 9.493 --- 9.052
    1/4ET: 11.253 ---- 10.693 <== New PB run for Lengel, Congrats!
    1/4mph: 128.44 -- 138.12

    After SDAC-24 I haven't touched the car till today. MB and I went to Mopar Fest at Great Lakes Dragaway (same track we rented for SDAC-24) to make some test hits and try to figure this problem out.

    Run 1 - <<Same new plugs used at SDAC-24 to get a baseline>> No 2-step, spun 1+2, miss 3rd - cutout 3+4

    R/T: .466
    60': 1.940
    330': 5.241
    1/8ET: 7.856
    1/8mph: 97.65
    1000'ET: 10.041
    1/4ET: 11.865
    1/4mph: 124.74

    Run 2 - <<Old plugs from 2013 including #3 that had cracked porcelain>> No 2-step, spun 1+2, no cutout!!!

    R/T: .244
    60': 2.012
    330': 5.206
    1/8ET: 7.630
    1/8mph: 105.39
    1000'ET: 9.649
    1/4ET: 11.327
    1/4mph: 134.77

    After this run, both #2 and #3 were cracked (see pic)

    Run 3 - <<Brand new plugs set 2>> No 2-step, bog, spun 1+2 - cutout 3+4

    R/T: .083
    60': 1.861
    330': 5. 49
    1/8ET: 7.498
    1/8mph: 101.53
    1000'ET: 9.617
    1/4ET: 11.406
    1/4mph: 126.12

    After that run, was thinking about running the cracked ones again but I didn't think that was worth it and we packed up. The "new" plugs were OK looking but some white powder emitted from where the porcelain meets the metal body and #2 was cracked...

    Some thoughts...
    -All plugs same NGK part number R5671A-9 that I've always run in this car since it became a 2.4L

    -All plugs gapped at 0.034" (which is what I have always gapped these plugs at) except the "new set 1" used at SDAC-24 and first run today which was 0.030"
    -Both sets "new set 1" and "new set 2" were purchased at the same time from same store - Bad LOT?
    -Pics listed as "old" are the set used in run 2 today with no breakup (plugs in order 4-3-2-1)
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    -Pics listed as "new" are the new set that only used in Run 3 today and broke up and now has a crack in #2 (plugs in order 4-3-2-1)
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    -Magnecor wires used since the 2.4 went in several years ago but they still looked OK (will check for carbon track!)
    -Ignition uses MSD DIS2 Plus box and stock Mopar coil
    -Coil is waste spark setup and both 2 + 3 fire on the same coil

    Any thoughts? Ideas?

    JT
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  11. #3071
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor GLHS60's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Those aren't platinum are they, platinum can give grief on wasted spark ignitions due to half the plugs firing reverse polarity.
    Thanks
    Randy


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  12. #3072
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor turbo2point2's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Not sure what the cause of the splitting is, but change brands and see if it helps. The new set of plugs you put in look pretty dirty for such a short run time. How rich is the a/f going down the track? Could be contributing to the breaking up/ splitting.

    I would tighten the gap up also .034" is too wide IMO .022 would be a good start. My favorite plug is Autolite 3922, cheap and available most anywhere. I'm not very fond of magnacor's but if you see no signs of spark leaking, and they ohm out good, you might be ok there.

    -Brian Slowe
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  13. #3073
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Randy, good point. These are not platinum though

    Quote Originally Posted by turbo2point2 View Post
    Not sure what the cause of the splitting is, but change brands and see if it helps. The new set of plugs you put in look pretty dirty for such a short run time. How rich is the a/f going down the track? Could be contributing to the breaking up/ splitting.

    I would tighten the gap up also .034" is too wide IMO .022 would be a good start. My favorite plug is Autolite 3922, cheap and available most anywhere. I'm not very fond of magnacor's but if you see no signs of spark leaking, and they ohm out good, you might be ok there.
    Thanks for the response good stuff!

    What is odd is that I've run these for years without issue, why are they doing this now? And only to new ones when the old ones ran ok?

    I need to take another look at them to see if they are cracks like I thought or carbon tracking? What causes carbon tracking?

    I thought they were fouled too for only one pass on the new set they are pretty bad. When it runs clean the AFR is 11.5:1 when it's breaking up it's actually not too far from that. I'll look at the logs again

    I've thought about closing the gap up too. Just curious why it was ok for years at .034"? Would a wide gap cause cracking or tracking or too much heat?

    I was thinking about changing plug brands, especially if NGK changed their plugs somehow? Thanks for the tip!

    The Magnecor wires worked well for years but will check for carbon and ohms. If it looks like I need new wires I'm open to brand, any suggestions?

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  14. #3074
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    The way i was told as a young lad , carbon tracking is cause by gas leakage past the body to the insulator ( look for gases staining the base on a old plug ) , this very hot gasses pushing past the wire boot seal and making it way to the spark plug tip when there is enough gases to make a path of lest resistance BAM you get a carbon track the more miss fires you have the more / bigger the tracks . I have also notice that carbon tracking is amplified with plugs located down tube .

  15. #3075
    Supporting Member Turbo Mopar Contributor turbo2point2's Avatar
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    [QUOTE=BadAssPerformance;1049480]Randy, good point. These are not platinum though



    Quote Originally Posted by BadAssPerformance View Post
    Thanks for the response good stuff!

    What is odd is that I've run these for years without issue, why are they doing this now? And only to new ones when the old ones ran ok?
    Possibility of more than one issue could be contributing. Component breakdown(plugs,wires,coil,etc), tune, or possibly load. The car has gotten quicker/faster over the years. More boost=more load, more traction=more load.

    Quote Originally Posted by BadAssPerformance View Post
    I need to take another look at them to see if they are cracks like I thought or carbon tracking? What causes carbon tracking?
    High cylinder pressures, weak ignition components are the most common causes from what I've seen.

    Quote Originally Posted by BadAssPerformance View Post
    I thought they were fouled too for only one pass on the new set they are pretty bad. When it runs clean the AFR is 11.5:1 when it's breaking up it's actually not too far from that. I'll look at the logs again

    I've thought about closing the gap up too. Just curious why it was ok for years at .034"? Would a wide gap cause cracking or tracking or too much heat?

    I was thinking about changing plug brands, especially if NGK changed their plugs somehow? Thanks for the tip!

    The Magnecor wires worked well for years but will check for carbon and ohms. If it looks like I need new wires I'm open to brand, any suggestions?
    The breaking up may be causing the plug to look so bad. As for the gap see above, more load, component breakdown.

    I am a huge fan of Firecore50.

    Rick had a custom wire set to my door in under a week. Great pricing too!

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  16. #3076
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Possible that you just got a bad set of plugs this time. Maybe get another set and see if it happens again?
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  17. #3077
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    JT, I with a problem like this I would drastically drop plug gap to .020 or even lower if you want to see if you can force your car to make a clean pull. I have had friends run teenage gaps on much milder setups. The downside is street driving/cold running which is not something you have to worry about.

    If you get the car to make a clean pull then work backwards to find what allows you to open up your gap. You are not going to find much in the way of power gains running bigger gaps, just better non racing characteristics.

    Its a waste of effort to slowly drop gaps since its not going to be hurting power in any way you will notice. Hopefully it helps power. I was reading last week about a car running gaps as small as .011 or so. That probably sucks to drive and fouls in/out while cold/street driving.
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  18. #3078
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by bakes View Post
    The way i was told as a young lad , carbon tracking is cause by gas leakage past the body to the insulator ( look for gases staining the base on a old plug ) , this very hot gasses pushing past the wire boot seal and making it way to the spark plug tip when there is enough gases to make a path of lest resistance BAM you get a carbon track the more miss fires you have the more / bigger the tracks . I have also notice that carbon tracking is amplified with plugs located down tube .
    So you mean combustion gas getting past the steel plug body and porcelain? I could believe that, especially if it was a bad batch of plugs. What is weird tho is the ones with all the carbon on them are the only ones that ran well! Also, I do recall seeing some white powder at the base of the porcelain on the new (breaking up) set, maybe they are not sealing well and that's what pushed out???

    Quote Originally Posted by turbo2point2 View Post
    Possibility of more than one issue could be contributing. Component breakdown(plugs,wires,coil,etc), tune, or possibly load. The car has gotten quicker/faster over the years. More boost=more load, more traction=more load.
    Good points and that makes sense. I haven't changed the tune or boost level in ~2+ years though. I would have guessed the 26" tires would have made this worse too... Hmmm... got me thinking now

    High cylinder pressures, weak ignition components are the most common causes from what I've seen.
    Makes sense! Thanks!

    The breaking up may be causing the plug to look so bad. As for the gap see above, more load, component breakdown.
    Yeah, I can see that. I really don't recall why I started running the gap at that anyways, just started there and never had a problem so never closed it. Maybe they were just good plugs and now either the manufacturing quality is not as good or something else in the ignition system, worn wires is the culprit...

    I am a huge fan of Firecore50.

    Rick had a custom wire set to my door in under a week. Great pricing too!
    I checked their wires out at the Mopar Nats last year, they were one of the Sponsors for the Stick Shift Class. Rick, is that the owner? I met a guy, didn't get his name tho. They didn't have anything for our cars at the time... I'll check to see what they stock for a stock DOHC Neon.

    Quote Originally Posted by black86glhs View Post
    Possible that you just got a bad set of plugs this time. Maybe get another set and see if it happens again?
    Was thinking that too, but I got two bad sets, bought at the same time, so guessing the whole production LOT, or their new manufacturing process is like that? ...or its a combo with the wires (too be reviewed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ondonti View Post
    JT, I with a problem like this I would drastically drop plug gap to .020 or even lower if you want to see if you can force your car to make a clean pull. I have had friends run teenage gaps on much milder setups. The downside is street driving/cold running which is not something you have to worry about.

    If you get the car to make a clean pull then work backwards to find what allows you to open up your gap. You are not going to find much in the way of power gains running bigger gaps, just better non racing characteristics.

    Its a waste of effort to slowly drop gaps since its not going to be hurting power in any way you will notice. Hopefully it helps power. I was reading last week about a car running gaps as small as .011 or so. That probably sucks to drive and fouls in/out while cold/street driving.
    Ya know, last year MB cracked a plug at the DSM shootout and we closed the gap to .020 and they have been fine since. 20/20 hindsight I should have tried to go that low yesterday, but was not even thinking in that direction with the cracked/carbon/whatever shity plugs running fine at .034"

    JT
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  19. #3079
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    JT:
    I'd close up the gap. 0.034 is pretty big even with the ignition upgrade. I had a similar issue with my plugs gapped at .030, Everything was fine until I got to the strip, turned up the boost and it would break up. I closed the gap to .025 and it went great. I'm also not a big fan of using V groove plugs. In fact, I believe my Crane ignition box recommended not to use V groove type plugs.

    Also had a break up issue with the race snowmobile engine when I got out about 300', closed the gap from .018 to .013 and ran perfectly. Won the North eastern Nationals in Maine in it's class.

  20. #3080
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    Re: BadAss SRT-Z - 2.4L / A568 - Update!!!

    JT, do you use dielectric grease on your plug boots? If not, I'd give that a try.

    It is totally possible to get bad batches of plugs. I've seen it happen a few times (Champions every time). I don't know how the store that sells the plugs you get receives their inventory, but if it's anything like AZ they come in crates packed with other stuff and who knows what was dropped, bounced, slammed on them.

    The white powder coming out from around the body of the plug and the porcelain sounds like there was something that happened to the plugs. I'd try getting the same plugs from a different store. I also agree that the gap is pretty darn big. I've had break-up problems in the past and simply gapping the plugs down got rid of the problem.

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