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99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Got an 99 Oldsmobile alero my gf has and I have had to deal with but I'm trying to fix her up to unload it on someone haha. It runs ok but the head gaskets are seeping coolant. Got the oil changed once and the guy said its a common problem. Said it used stretch bolts like the Vw I had and also leaked fluids. From my previous deal with the Vw I took the head sent it to the machine shop thinking it had been overheated and warped but this wasn't the case at all. The head gasket didn't even have any problems with it either. So I'm thinking I could buy new stupid stretch bolts and torq them and be just fine. Anyone have any input or experience with the 3.4l v6 in this alero
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Have you had the intake gaskets done yet? I worked for GM and rarely saw head gaskets unless it had been badly overheated or never changed the coolant. The intake gaskets are far more common.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Same engine as the 2.8 V6 from over the years, nothing special about it and IIRC, bolts aren't TTY either. Its a common problem due to the aluminum head and iron block, and alot of people overheat them all the time, especially because the intakes leak like a sieve. Some heads crack but mostly new gaskets, resurface and done.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
turbovanman
Same engine as the 2.8 V6 from over the years, nothing special about it and IIRC, bolts are TTY either. Its a common problem due to the aluminum head and iron block, and alot of people overheat them all the time, especially because the intakes leak like a sieve. Some heads crack but mostly new gaskets, resurface and done.
Exactly why I asked if the intake gaskets are leaking.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
black86glhs
Have you had the intake gaskets done yet? I worked for GM and rarely saw head gaskets unless it had been badly overheated or never changed the coolant. The intake gaskets are far more common.
Since we have had the car no they have not. And the way the car was kept. Before we got it I highly doubt it. It was overheated once due to the previous owner not putting bolts back on one of the coolant tubes but didn't start leaking till many thousand miles after that. I honestly cannot tell if it's the intake. Will have to pressure wash it and see from there. Trying not to put much time or money into it. Wasn't there to look at the car when they bought it was the first problem.
Bolts arnt tty?
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Torque to yield he means.
Its a 3400 so 10-1 its the intake gaskets. Ive done enough of them God knows. Look on either side of the engine down in the galley, thats a pretty common spot
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Orangetona
Torque to yield he means.
Its a 3400 so 10-1 its the intake gaskets. Ive done enough of them God knows. Look on either side of the engine down in the galley, thats a pretty common spot
I thought they were a stretch bolt setup. Forget where I heard that from tho. Could be wrong. Have been before. I'll take a look at it after work tomorrow. I'll be workin on my cars all night it seems. It needs a ac compressor also. Leaking out the front seal. Yay
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
I don't recall them being TTY. I've never replaced them doing head gaskets.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Honestly, idk how much merit it carries, but our system says its strongly recommended that they are changed. If you've done it without replacing them then i'd say its pretty safe.
If this is your first go around with the 3400, you'll be there longer than tonight. Make sure you keep the pushrods in order. They are different lengths.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
They are torque to yeild... They also came out with revised torque specs after +03 (along with metal gaskets) to stop the LIM gasket issue on the 3.4's
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Orangetona
Honestly, idk how much merit it carries, but our system says its strongly recommended that they are changed. If you've done it without replacing them then i'd say its pretty safe.
If this is your first go around with the 3400, you'll be there longer than tonight. Make sure you keep the pushrods in order. They are different lengths.
Definitely good to know. I am unsure how into this I want to get honestly. If its the intake gasket I'll do it but I'm not sure if i want to go thru all the trouble of pulling the heads
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
I'd call it an opportunity to see if later heads and intake make it faster :D
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bgbmxer
Definitely good to know. I am unsure how into this I want to get honestly. If its the intake gasket I'll do it but I'm not sure if i want to go thru all the trouble of pulling the heads
Its not that bad.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Young Gun
They are torque to yeild... They also came out with revised torque specs after +03 (along with metal gaskets) to stop the LIM gasket issue on the 3.4's
Which still didn't help that much. Just a crap design mainly.
---------- Post added at 07:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:59 PM ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by
turbovanman
Its not that bad.
Depends on how mechanically inclined you are.
bgbmxer, let me put it this way. Essentially to do the head gaskets, all it requires over doing the LIM is taking the crossover pipe off, and unbolting the heads. You're literally RIGHT there. Simon is right though, its not bad, other than the power steering pump being a pita.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Orangetona
Which still didn't help that much. Just a crap design mainly.
Exactly, they still leak.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Orangetona
Depends on how mechanically inclined you are.
bgbmxer, let me put it this way. Essentially to do the head gaskets, all it requires over doing the LIM is taking the crossover pipe off, and unbolting the heads. You're literally RIGHT there. Simon is right though, its not bad, other than the power steering pump being a pita.
If you can fix a turbo mopar, you can fix the 3.4, :p
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
turbovanman
If you can fix a turbo mopar, you can fix the 3.4, :p
True true. Id rather work on an 8v TM all day though haha. Im kind of worn out from fixing 60* V6s lmao. I know I could say the same about TMs but they are way more fun.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Orangetona
True true. Id rather work on an 8v TM all day though haha. Im kind of worn out from fixing 60* V6s lmao. I know I could say the same about TMs but they are way more fun.
3.4's pay more, hehehe but agreed, the TURBO 2.2's and 2.5's are more fun to drive, :p
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Orangetona
True true. Id rather work on an 8v TM all day though haha. Im kind of worn out from fixing 60* V6s lmao.
What I hate about them is there only ever seems to be an inch clear space on 4 sides of whatever they put them in :mad:
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RoadWarrior222
I'd call it an opportunity to see if later heads and intake make it faster :D
It does. The 3500 heads flow a bit better. I remember reading the intake takes a bit of modification to fit. Also if you have a 99 3400 its quite a bit better. The 99 intake runners are a bit smaller than the 00+
I vote boost though :)
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RoadWarrior222
What I hate about them is there only ever seems to be an inch clear space on 4 sides of whatever they put them in :mad:
Not true, in the minivans, you drop the whole thing onto a dolly and voila, all the room you need, :p
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
turbovanman
Not true, in the minivans, you drop the whole thing onto a dolly and voila, all the room you need, :p
Wish we had an engine cradle dolly, I did head gaskets on a Pontiac Aztec and there was no room at all.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
shackwrrr
Wish we had an engine cradle dolly, I did head gaskets on a Pontiac Aztec and there was no room at all.
I snagged the Kent Moore cradle for the first gen U vans from a GM dealer that closed, I used it for everything, it rocks, even TM's, :nod:
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
So dump it on the floor and wheel the car back off it... drop it on a flat P-dolly... drop it on a pallet truck... drop it on a greased runner sledge made out of 2x4s... chain it to a tree and drive backwards...
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RoadWarrior222
So dump it on the floor and wheel the car back off it... drop it on a flat P-dolly... drop it on a pallet truck... drop it on a greased runner sledge made out of 2x4s... chain it to a tree and drive backwards...
Wait, thats not common knowledge? I thought everyone did that. Hmm....
:D
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Yah, it's just frigging strange wanting to use the correct tool when there's such a rich variety of alternatives.... :D
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
I did the head gaskets on a 3.4l in a Pontiac Montana for my neighbor. The real problem and what caused the head gasket issue was the coolant line for the heater that connects to the intake manifold. Those engines have a doomed to fail quick connect on the intake manifold that the heater hose plugs into. The little plastic piece inside fails and lets the hose move and leak. you may want to take a look and see if that is your leak. He bought from a used car lot and they had pulled the hose out and gooped silicone on it and stuffed it back in there. It will be on the tbody side of the car underneath a whole bunch of crap. I did the gaskets in the van and it was tight but not unbearable. He got another 40,000 miles out of it before it let go completely. I did use new bolts. Good luck.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
"it" meaning the heads, gaskets, the motor, or the coolant line???
(This are why I like buying, "selling because X broke" cars or trade ins... get to fix it up right yourself, don't have 20 bodges waiting to come undone... that and I just don't trust cheaper lots to get a "real" safety inspection. )
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
wallace
I did the head gaskets on a 3.4l in a Pontiac Montana for my neighbor. The real problem and what caused the head gasket issue was the coolant line for the heater that connects to the intake manifold. Those engines have a doomed to fail quick connect on the intake manifold that the heater hose plugs into. The little plastic piece inside fails and lets the hose move and leak. you may want to take a look and see if that is your leak. He bought from a used car lot and they had pulled the hose out and gooped silicone on it and stuffed it back in there. It will be on the tbody side of the car underneath a whole bunch of crap. I did the gaskets in the van and it was tight but not unbearable. He got another 40,000 miles out of it before it let go completely. I did use new bolts. Good luck.
Correction......only if someone has performed work that required the removal of the heater pipe that did not know how to remove it. They aren't doomed unless it is messed with. They make replacements for them too.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
black86glhs
Correction......only if someone has performed work that required the removal of the heater pipe that did not know how to remove it. They aren't doomed unless it is messed with. They make replacements for them too.
I agree, almost never do they break on their own. All 90s GMs have those quick connects too. 4.3L, 5.0L, 5.7L...everything. Not just a 3.4L
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
black86glhs
Correction......only if someone has performed work that required the removal of the heater pipe that did not know how to remove it. They aren't doomed unless it is messed with. They make replacements for them too.
I had one fail on my 99 suburban in WV. Was surprised the dealer had 6 of them in stock. The guy at the counter said it was a common failure. The plastic POS they use gets brittle over time from the heat and fails eventually. I think its one of those engineered parts that guarantees the General does a brisk business in head gaskets and those little heater hose gizmos.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
wallace
I had one fail on my 99 suburban in WV. Was surprised the dealer had 6 of them in stock. The guy at the counter said it was a common failure. The plastic POS they use gets brittle over time from the heat and fails eventually. I think its one of those engineered parts that guarantees the General does a brisk business in head gaskets and those little heater hose gizmos.
It is a common failure, but its usually because of them being disturbed. But it does happen. I get people in here all the time wanting them.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
wallace
I had one fail on my 99 suburban in WV. Was surprised the dealer had 6 of them in stock. The guy at the counter said it was a common failure. The plastic POS they use gets brittle over time from the heat and fails eventually. I think its one of those engineered parts that guarantees the General does a brisk business in head gaskets and those little heater hose gizmos.
Believe me I know about them. I have been with GM since 1988 until I left the auto biz in 2005. My point, as Mike said, was that the plastic usually doesn't just fail. It usually gets chewed up trying to get the pipe out. I know because it happens on anything with more than 60k miles when you have to remove the pipe....LOL. It wouldn't surprise me if they changed the type of plastic to something thinner and more prone to breaking in the later models, though.:mad:
Stupid cars companies and their evil been counters!!!:p
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Ok guys it seems to be getting coolant in the oil so it's due time. Can someone help me with a parts list for doin the head gaskets and such so I don't forget anything. And are head bolts needed?
Here's what I know I need
Head gaskets 2
Intake mani gasket
Exhaust mani gaskets 2
Valve cover gaskets. 2
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
die grinder, ball cutter, cone cutter, sanding rolls... ... ...
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bgbmxer
Ok guys it seems to be getting coolant in the oil so it's due time. Can someone help me with a parts list for doin the head gaskets and such so I don't forget anything. And are head bolts needed?
Here's what I know I need
Head gaskets 2
Intake mani gasket
Exhaust mani gaskets 2
Valve cover gaskets. 2
The heater pipe adapter (the one we were talking about above), upper to lower plenum gaskets (they usually tear or break during removal, get some injector O-rings too. Pull the upper plenum with the throttle body if you can, much faster. Some you can and others you can't. I think on the Alero you can.
Set the power steering pump to the side and just remove the alternator. Pull the coil bracket out and the alternator bracket and the rest is easy to figure out.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
So I got it tore down to the the point where the intake and all is off. Got a few questions. Can I tell if a Headgsskets blown by a simple compression test? The lower intake gaskets are harder then a wedding dick and the one looks like it was seeping by and has buildup like the stop leak stuff that was in it. How often do these things warp heads and also use said the pushrods were different lengths and to keep track of them do the rockers need to be adjusted on these things or no.
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...r/db7eae89.jpg
http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/j...r/a3bf21ae.jpg
---------- Post added at 03:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:59 PM ----------
My other question is can I do a simple compression test and see if I have to pull the heads or not. It's weird because I only have water in the oil not the other way around like I think a head gasket would be.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Coolant in oil can come from a straight leak to inside the cylinder, where there's enough to get by the rings, instead of all being burned/evaporated off. Also oil pressure drops almost immediately you stop the motor, whereas coolant pressure declines slowly as it cools... ergo you can then have 15psi coolant pressure squirting into a normally 30psi oil passage...
There's also nothing that says it can't leak to the oil returns.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
RoadWarrior222
Coolant in oil can come from a straight leak to inside the cylinder, where there's enough to get by the rings, instead of all being burned/evaporated off. Also oil pressure drops almost immediately you stop the motor, whereas coolant pressure declines slowly as it cools... ergo you can then have 15psi coolant pressure squirting into a normally 30psi oil passage...
There's also nothing that says it can't leak to the oil returns.
Both intake gaskets have huge cracks right next to the oil return passages on the head and the compression is the same across the board. It doesn't actually idle rough either
---------- Post added at 04:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:44 PM ----------
My main question is are the rockers adjustable since the way the gaskets are setup you have to remove the pushrods. Is there an easier way.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
The intake gaskets are most likely your problem. I bet the seeping you saw at the head gasket was the coolant running down the head from the intake. Common misdiagnoses.
The rockers get torqued to 14 ft lbs and another 30*.
Intake bolts are 115 in lbs.
NO on the rockers. You have to pull the pushrods and keep them in order or you will be pulling the heads to fix bent valves.
Water in the oil is the same for both head gaskets and intake gaskets on these. A block with a crack in the oil passage next to a coolant passage will net you oil in the coolant or a leaky oil cooler inside the radiator.
If it did not run bad prior, the head gaskets may be fine. Unfortunately, without hearing it run, I can't say. If the numbers are good (135-145 psi) between them all, I would lean towards the intakes causing the leaks and milkshake. Those are my thoughts.
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Re: 99 Oldsmobile alero head gaskets leaking help
Quote:
Originally Posted by
black86glhs
The intake gaskets are most likely your problem. I bet the seeping you saw at the head gasket was the coolant running down the head from the intake. Common misdiagnoses.
The rockers get torqued to 14 ft lbs and another 30*.
Intake bolts are 115 in lbs.
NO on the rockers. You have to pull the pushrods and keep them in order or you will be pulling the heads to fix bent valves.
Water in the oil is the same for both head gaskets and intake gaskets on these. A block with a crack in the oil passage next to a coolant passage will net you oil in the coolant or a leaky oil cooler inside the radiator.
If it did not run bad prior, the head gaskets may be fine. Unfortunately, without hearing it run, I can't say. If the numbers are good (135-145 psi) between them all, I would lean towards the intakes causing the leaks and milkshake. Those are my thoughts.
The numbers were in the 140 range all across so I'm hoping this is it. The intake gaskets were horribly cracked in multiple places so im guessing that's what's wrong. Id rather not pull the heads if I don't have to that always snowballs into more money.
So they made pushrods to length and all I gotta do is pull them out and put them back in The same order torque and put it all back together