Chrysler Voyager 2.5 Turbo Intercooled Diesel

[bamman]

I've been thinking of random builds that many people may not know exist, such as 2.6 L engines or the Cosworth head for the 2.2, but I thought of something that I've not seen mentioned online anywhere.

In 1992, perhaps as early as 1991, Chrysler put a VM 425 2.5L Turbo Intercooled Diesel in European minivans and in US fleets only. What is interesting is the fact that I'm pretty sure they paired it to the A568 getrag. The problem is I can't find much information of this engine online. There are few pictures and the 1992+ Chrysler parts manuals are the only good reference points that I have.

Anybody have any links to any good web pages online about this engine?

The interesting part is the fact that one could probably get this engine, pair it to the Mexican a604 transmission for the 2.5L, and put it in an AWD minivan. That'd be interesting.

[Rrider]

Be nice to have one even without the original diesel motor, just for the smog check benefits. Anybody ever seen one though? I wonder how many were made that way.

[turbovanman²]

Since I have a 2000 TDI Jetta, I really want to put that engine in a 1st or 2nd Gen Minivan.

[INVUJerry]

I remember reading about this, would totally love one myself. If it was a touch faster than my TBI van I'd be totally happy.

[Rrider]

You can get AWD TD minivans from Japan. The federal 25 year rule.

[Reaper1]

Quick searching on Google turned up a few of the later model 5-speeds used behind the VM diesel in Europe. The T850 is the one most people know as that is the transmission that the SRT-4 uses. I've found different FD's that were available (3.52 and 3.77 so far). It does seem like the '91-'95 versions do list the A568 coupled to the diesel. I saw 1 picture that showed the crank sensor holes drilled in the bellhousing like a TIII, but there are quite a few others that don't have it. I don't know if that transmission continued past 1993 since all the ones I found so far have been '91-'93 (http://www.bildelsbasen.se/se-sv/Chrysler/CHRYSLER-VOYAGER/1991_1995/V%C3%A4xell%C3%A5da-&-Drivaxel-&-Mellanaxel/V%C3%A4xell%C3%A5da-5-Speed/Alla/ID-25505629/OEM-A568/). The next generation looks to use an A598 with a 3.88FD. It looks just like the A568 except it has no timing window (http://www.bildelsbasen.se/se-sv/Chrysler/CHRYSLER-VOYAGER/1996_2001/V%C3%A4xell%C3%A5da-&-Drivaxel-&-Mellanaxel/V%C3%A4xell%C3%A5da-5-Speed/Alla/ID-23315131/). I found a transmission used behind the 2.0 in those later years: A558 with a 4.08FD (http://www.bildelsbasen.se/se-sv/Chrysler/CHRYSLER-VOYAGER/1996_2001/V%C3%A4xell%C3%A5da-&-Drivaxel-&-Mellanaxel/V%C3%A4xell%C3%A5da-5-Speed/Alla/ID-23371268/).

It seems to me that maybe our gold mine for transmissions is Europe! I need to do some price conversions and see how much they cost, but it might be worth shipping a few over here to see what's up. I wonder if they have access to rebuild parts?

[Reaper1]

I found a service manual online for the A598(T750). It states that the major differences between it and the A523/A568 (and A543) are that the input shaft is supported by ball and roller bearings and the intermediate shaft is supported by taper roller bearings (sounds like they figured out about the pinion bearing race issues). I also noticed that the differential is a standard 2-spider gear unit. ftp://oskin.ru/pub/chrysler-dodge/manuals/Service%20Manuals/1997_GS_Town&Country_Caravan_Voyager/EGS_21A.PDF

[Reaper1]

I figured I'd post this up too. It's a bearing kit interchange from Midwest Truck and Auto Parts Inc. http://truckpartsetc.com/sales/PDFs/Midwest%20Truck%20&%20Auto/Midwest_BearingKits.pdf

[bamman]

It seems to me that maybe our gold mine for transmissions is Europe! I need to do some price conversions and see how much they cost, but it might be worth shipping a few over here to see what's up. I wonder if they have access to rebuild parts?

It has been known (to some) that Europe is a gold mine for the A568 (and diesel turbos). For instance, lets go to ebay.co.uk:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111282752874
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111282753637
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111352920597

What is interesting though, is the fact that their A568 transmissions got 240mm clutches while we in the states got 232mm clutches:
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php?carcode=187631&parttype=1993

[Reaper1]

Seeing the abundance of these transmissions and knowing that they probably weren't beat all to hell because they were in minivans, I think it needs to be more widely known about the availability of them in Europe.

[tryingbe]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rover-A568-T650-Manual-Gearbox-Overhaul-Manual-/150808251221?pt=UK_CarParts_Vehicles_Manuals_Litte rature_ET&hash=item231cdf4b55


That looks awful familiar.

[Vigo]

Hmm, i am interested in this idea of importing an AWD diesel caravan from Japan. They've got to be basically worthless over there... anyone have a link or a good idea how to find such a thing?

[shackwrrr]

Here is a diagram for the a598 showing straight roller bearings on the input shaft and tapered roller bearings on the intermediate shaft.

http://www.factorychryslerparts.com/showAssembly.aspx?ukey_assembly=530437

[Reaper1]

Well, I was able to find the part numbers as well as a post on a French forum that has Timken interchange part numbers. I tried to look them up in the Timken and SKF Master Interchange catalogs, but it seems these are MOPAR specific.

A598
Front Intermediate Shaft Bearing:
MOPAR 04797336
Timken NP692885
size 31.75x65x19 (mm)

Front Intermediate Shaft Bearing Cup (race)
MOPAR 04797325
Timken NP848363

Front Oil Slinger
MOPAR 04797324

Rear Intermediate Shaft Bearin
MOPAR 04797335
Timken NP270973
size 31x65x18.25

Rear Intermediate Shaft Bearing Cup (race)
MOPAR 04856271
Timken NP372938

These all have prices that are very close to what these parts cost of the A568, so there is no money savings. Availability seems good, though.

[Johnny]

You can get AWD TD minivans from Japan.

But right hand drive!

[Rrider]

Yeah that RHD is the downside. Vigo I meant non-Chrysler turbo diesel minivans for Japan. From what I saw on wiki only Europe got the Chrysler ones.

I've seen a few RHD Diesel 4x4 minvans in the local classifieds. I don't know if its technically legit to sell them because of state emissions laws, but peeps are.

[Vigo]

Oh, well thats definitely not as cool. :p

[RoadWarrior222]

Hmmm, youse guys is onto something, I think it's 14 years or something up here though, my gut feeling is go for Spanish ones, IDK why, shorter ship route, good dry weather, (not very snowy there) good pricing, LHD...

http://www.milanuncios.com/chrysler-de-segunda-mano/chrysler-voyager-2-5-td-7-plazas-137247867.htm
http://www.milanuncios.com/chrysler-de-segunda-mano/chrysler-voyager-136581459.htm

edit: derp, you left coast guys might be better off with Japan, I was thinking Eastern.

[Johnny]

I've seen a few RHD Diesel 4x4 minvans in the local classifieds. I don't know if its technically legit to sell them because of state emissions laws, but peeps are.

mopar ones?

[RoadWarrior222]

The mini-minivans, Kei sized, Suzukis etc, fit on an ATV trailer, and down ATV trails and can be used as a cushy offroader, so there's a few around that are sold for offroad. However, up in BC there's some importers of those that can make them road legal for Canada.

[Rrider]

No not mopar! Was going off topic.. One of my cousin overseas has a Toyota 4x4 turbo diesel minivan, manual trans too.

[shackwrrr]

I tried checking availability of the intermediate shaft bearings at work and there is no way to order export parts.

What I want to see is how the bearing cup is held in the end plate.

[bamman]

My main question is what is the A-598 transmission? Starting with the third gen minivans, they went from the A-568 to the A-598. Is it any better to the 568?

[shackwrrr]

My main question is what is the A-598 transmission? Starting with the third gen minivans, they went from the A-568 to the A-598. Is it any better to the 568?

Looking at the diagram it seems they addressed some of the bearing issues with the 568 by running tapered bearings on the intermediate shaft. Other than that it seems to be the same or similar. I'm unsure of final drive or individual gear ratios though.

[RoadWarrior222]

Rock Auto has Euro parts, dunno if they'd have the tranny bearings though.

[bamman]

Here is the A-598 FSM:
ftp://oskin.ru/pub/chrysler-dodge/manuals/Service%20Manuals/1997_GS_Town&Country_Caravan_Voyager/EGS_21A.PDF

GEAR RATIOS
Gear ratios for the 2.4L gasoline engine and 2.5L
Turbo Diesel MTX are as follows:
1st—3.36
2nd—1.90
3rd—1.28
4th—0.92
5th—0.71
Reverse—3.17

Final drive ratio of 3.88 was selected for maximum
performance. All forward gears are synchronized.
Gear ratios for the 2.0L GAS MTX are as follows:
1st—3.69
2nd—2.24
3rd—1.45
4th—0.1.03
5th—0.81
Reverse—3.17
Final drive ratio of 4.08 was selected for maximum
performance. All forward gears are synchronized

[bamman]

In the FSM, it also refers to this transmission as the NV T750. Here is one on eBay.co.uk:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111282735724

[Reaper1]

The A588 and A598 are very similar to the A568. It seems from pictures that the A588 has the same type of shifting setup as the A568, but the case is missing the timing window on the bellhousing. The A598 is the T750. At least that's what I have been able to put together so far from pictures and what are supposed to be factual stories.

I *think* the A588 was for the 2.4 gas engine and the A598 (T750) was for the diesel engine that uses our bellhousing.

[85boostbox]

I just looked it up. Cindy was selling a a588 trans.

[Reaper1]

Oh that's right. Well, that shoots my idea in the foot.

[135sohc]

So our beloved obsolete dinosaur transmissions lived on with chrysler europe long after they decided they were yesterdays junk over here?

[85boostbox]

Looks that way

[RoadWarrior222]

Sure, they don't like automatics. Flip auto/man sales numbers and it's like that, only weak old ladies and the disabled drive them.

[135sohc]

I tried checking availability of the intermediate shaft bearings at work and there is no way to order export parts.

What I want to see is how the bearing cup is held in the end plate.

The service manual shows it being pressed into the bearing bulkhead plate and then its got a shim and the backup plate to set the pre-load. The differential must be removed before the guts of the case are able to be removed because the bearing cone couldn't make it past the ring gear.

The very first paragraph of the service manual says "These units are very similar the A523 and A568" They use bronze shifting forks as well...

If it was possible to locate a bearing cone and cup setup for both ends of the shaft I don't see why we couldn't replicate the same thing and fix the problem once and for all.

[Ondonti]

Anyone wanna....obtain some manual pages for the community good?

[RoadWarrior222]

There was some Russian site with a lot of Euro FSMs etc on. Having trouble finding it again though.

[Dr. Johny Dodge]

I just looked it up. Cindy was selling a a588 trans.

key word , was

it's sitting on my dineing room table right now where it's been for a few months already

now after finding this thread I wanna rip into it to see what's up with the inner guts

to bad I'm stuck haveing to pack to move or I would but that will sadly have to wait a few months at least

... ? tapered bearings on the secondary shaft ??

THIS I wanna see most of all if true - but why would they switch the input shaft bearings ?

- that sounds like a typo without yet haveing had the time to read through the links above
- which I'll take a better look at now

nice to know there should be more 408 fd parts out there though