My car is not low enough (sort of)

[francois]

I finally finished my big swap and I just added the wheel and put her down and notice that it could be 1" lower in the front. The rear, no problem. I could put those wheels in the quarter if I want.

In the front, I have G-Body Koni modified to accept Ground Control sleeve with Eibach ERS coils. '89 Shelby 11" front brake.
I'm at the lowest setting in the front. Mind you, the lca is pretty much parallel with the ball joint but jeez, still have that much of a wheel gap...:mecry::banghead:

I'm wondering what I could do to bring that lower.

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090236_zpse9945b43.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090236_zpse9945b43.jpg.html)

[tryingbe]

Bigger tire to fill the wheel gap.

[168glhs1986]

Is the yellow koni strut shorter than the orange?

[francois]

Car has 195 at the moment so yes, when the alignment be done, the 205 will fill the room more but still!

But I am far from those 2 cars...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v466/dart165/bombni/bomni2.jpg

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd91/vntned/002-3.jpg


Not sure about the black car but the red one had GC on Koni.

[2.216VTurbo]

Francois, both those cars are too low IMO, makes me think drive by shooting or rice, which one do you aspire to? I can think of a few negatives to a set up like those:

1) Reduced travel
2) Bottoms out over big bumps
3) Spoiler scrapes on everything
4) Rides like ish
5) Rubbing issues

Tell me about the positive aspects of a ride that low, maybe I'm too old or missed something or?? Lets see a pic of what you achieved:nod:

[francois]

Yes, I agree, bot of theses 2 are too low!

Like I said, the pivot point of the lca is pretty much parallel with the lower ball joint so that is preferable. I just spent time and money and would have like a bit more adjustment if I wanted to bring it lower.
I'll put the car out tomorrow and take a quick snap.

When I bought the car, the front end was way up vs the rear. I wanted to bring more close to the fender like a M-B or a BMW....I just feel that it didn't came much lower.
Anyhow, there is not much travel I must say so lower and I would ride on the bump stop!

[Ondonti]

Could you explain more about the sourcing for the top parts (bearing etc). Ground control makes a lot of stuff. I wanted to do something that involved getting away from our stock top parts.

[francois]

Top part (camber/caster plate) are from Rbryant.
The sleeve, the top plate and the coils came from Ground-Control.
Be aware that their kit need a lot of adjustments to make it fit perfectly. Here's a brief description of what I had to do.

Front part.

Lower seat cut and machined.
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090224_zpsae5ef91d.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090224_zpsae5ef91d.jpg.html)

Added a bottom ring
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090225_zpse3c4ef21.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090225_zpse3c4ef21.jpg.html)

Modified parts I had to do
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/bff6b036-f3b4-443e-a5df-03934e7c738f_zps811d100a.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/bff6b036-f3b4-443e-a5df-03934e7c738f_zps811d100a.jpg.html)

Tolerance were pretty on the loose side I must say!
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090232_zps035bc5d0.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090232_zps035bc5d0.jpg.html)

Better now
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090233_zps284293fa.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090233_zps284293fa.jpg.html)

Camber plate added
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090235_zps218fec86.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090235_zps218fec86.jpg.html)

Finally installed on the car
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090302_zps3450d66f.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090302_zps3450d66f.jpg.html)

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090301_zps85886d32.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090301_zps85886d32.jpg.html)

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090300_zps999c1fbc.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090300_zps999c1fbc.jpg.html)

- - - Updated - - -

The rear part.

The sleeve as they come.
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090204_zps85e2ec67.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090204_zps85e2ec67.jpg.html)

Their solutions!
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090209_zps700f8d44.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090209_zps700f8d44.jpg.html)

My solution!
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090202_zps27feb1b1.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090202_zps27feb1b1.jpg.html)

Once installed.
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090203_zps228f61f9.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090203_zps228f61f9.jpg.html)

There you go.
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090206_zps9d887bb3.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090206_zps9d887bb3.jpg.html)

Final product.
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090213_zpsd3defe32.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090213_zpsd3defe32.jpg.html)

Installed on the car.
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090282_zps970a0fe9.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090282_zps970a0fe9.jpg.html)

[GLHNSLHT2]

you need some helper springs to take up the gap between the springs and the top hats or you're just going to damage them the 1st time the suspension unloads a bit.

[francois]

For the back you means?
I know but then, I don't plan to do the jump that the Duke's guy used to do...
It's in my plan so does 2 new top plate in the front to accept a trust bearing.

[GLHNSLHT2]

For the front and the back. Jumping is not the only way to unload the suspension. A fast corner will do the same thing.

[intercooled]

Looking sweet

[intercooled]

The yellow konis are shorter

[francois]

I know what you mean.
I am not planning to go crazy for now until I remedy that. I learned the hard way since this isn't written or very little.

I figured the yellow are shorter but instead of being shorter it's probably the seating area that it's lower then my G-body strut.

I took a picture but keep in mind that the back was done when the car was running on fumes when I adjusted the suspension. I figure that when I installed the nozzle in at the gas station. I'm like...hummm, car might lean in the back now that I add fuel?!?!

3/4 full, yes, indeed!:yuck::censored:
I didn't remember that I was that low...
Anyhow, front end at the lowest setting.

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/Francois666/P1090324_zps0bac70c1.jpg (http://s851.photobucket.com/user/Francois666/media/P1090324_zps0bac70c1.jpg.html)

[Rrider]

What bad things will happen when he unloads a tire? I ran a koni GC setup like that for years with no problems.. It unloads it makes a little noise then everything settles back in where it should be.

[francois]

Coils could not go back in it's place.
But can that be worst then someone would runs chopped coils?

I still have to jack a lot to unload the coil to clear the lip on the top plate. At that point, if that ever happen, I would probably flip the car.

But I know what he means and will fix that.
I have no idea what I am gonna do. I just might go FWD yellow swap or just get the one I have revalve and shortened so I could weld a lower seat on the front.
No idea as of now. I will move to my new place first and go from there.
I have my eye on something else...no GTP!:p

[Vigo]

Well, i feel sort of bad for saying this, but if you wanted to really go low you put a lot of effort into using a strut that is too long to do it. The stock K and L body front struts are too long to get a K or L really low and still have any compression travel left.

Also, if you want to go really low your LCA will be pointed up and your roll center will be theoretically screwed up unless you run a ball joint spacer or extended ball joint. BUT, there's not that much ROOM to space the ball joint down if you stick with a 15" wheel. So, if you want to go lower you're going to run into these compromises.

Personally, what i would have done in your case if you wanted to go really low, is get some 1g neon front Koni STRT shocks and modify those for coilovers. They aren't adjustable, but if you're putting a bunch of effort into your setup to get it to handle you dont really need to have adjustability in the strut to get it to handle right. As long as it properly damps the given spring rate and weight of car that's sitting on it, fiddling with the adjustment is just a bandaid for some other undiscovered or unacknowledged deficiency. IF you didnt particularly care about handling you could also use some Raceland VW caddy front coilovers and modify the spindles to fit them. Raceland is also working on a 1g neon coilover set that would literally bolt into the front of an L-body but i don't think it's available yet.

I also dont get too worked up about the roll center thing because it's just one part of the equation. One thing to keep in mind is 'any suspension will work if you don't let it'. In other words, the stiffer the spring and sway bar, the less the roll, the less the roll center matters. A car with 300 lb/in springs and a messed up roll center is still going to roll less than a car with 120 lb/in springs and a good roll center. Most of us are not shooting for the moon so keeping the oil pans and airdams off the ground and looking good while handling 'good enough' is MUCH more important than having an ugly stance in the name of ultimate handling ability that you/we probably cant drive well enough to use anyway.

For the record, my Dynasty is lower than that and has no issues dragging anything on the ground or bottoming out over reasonable dips and bumps. If you want to go lower, i say go for it!! But unfortunately you won't really be able to do it with those struts. :(

[GLHNSLHT2]

My Omni would lift a rear tire just getting off the freeway. If the spring falls off the perch then comes back in contact with that stiff steel spring is going to mess up the aluminum hat. Run it if you want, but I wouldn't IMO.

[francois]

As much as I did research, I wasn't able to find everything on the INTERNET.
I knew it was easier to get a G-body strut when using '89 'Tona Shelby brake and the knuckle instead of modifying either the strut or the knuckle if I would have kept my L-body one.

When everything is bolted to the car, I can see a lot of things that wasn't explained or pictured. I am not blaming. It's a fact.
I am disappointed but not mad.
I can see that there isn't much travel on the shocks and I wouldn't consider it low. Lower then what it was but far from what I had in mind.
I love going into the exit or on ramp to the limit I feel that is safe for everyone. I plan to go back on a track soon. That was the whole point of that modification I have done so far.

Car is not scrapping at all so no worries there and I feel I could have gone a bit higher. I am running 500F and 400R.
The rear sway bar is amazing!
I just need to get better tires but then, I'm learning how the car is reacting. It's not too far from what I was used to, when I had modified Honda cars :p

[Vigo]

With a 500 lb/in spring rate in the front you should never have to worry about bottoming out, that's for sure!

[Tbird232ci]

Could you machine the top spring perch to let it sit a bit lower on the strut shaft? May lower the car some and you can keep the same amount of bump travel in the strut.

[minigts]

Get the helper springs, if for nothing else to keep the gap closed when jacking the car up and down for maintenance. I got them for mine and it was a good idea. GC sells them for like $100 a set. Kinda pricey for what it does, but what else are you gonna do? Looks good though.

[Jetmugg]

1st Gen Neon struts are shorter, and will bolt up to a K-car spindle. That's what I'm using, along with an Ebay coilover kit, custom made lower mount, and camber/caster plates. This thing could be a little lower, but not much.... It's less than 1-1/2" to the crossmember and the oil pan.

http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr44/Jetmugg/Dodge%20Rampage/DSC_1869_zpsddc3da4e.jpg (http://s468.photobucket.com/user/Jetmugg/media/Dodge%20Rampage/DSC_1869_zpsddc3da4e.jpg.html)