GLH Accident

[91dodgespiritrt]

Guys,

I've posted some pictures of my mishap while driving my GLH this morning. I foolishly took an exit ramp - evidently - too fast while on the way to work and - much to my surprise - my car started to fish tail into a exit ramp curb as I began to brake. I don't know if my brakes locked up and caused the sliding. Up until now the car hung in every turn like a champ. I can't figure out what exactly happened but it was a sudden "slow" slide that I could not steer out of. At first I started to blame my "Eagle GT IIs for not sticking as they should but they are about 11 years old with only about 5k miles on them. I do blame my lack of "stick shift" driving savvy skills as part of the cause for my mishap.
I was having a great morning drive up to that point. I experienced no other damages - at least no body damages - but I don't know if the "Swiss Cheese" aluminum wheel, control arm or axle can be repaired. I'm hoping someone with some expertise or previous experience (driving an L body like a Porsche) can provide some insight on getting these repairs or about getting these parts replaced. Perhaps someone here has a few spare GLH or Shelby parts - 5 lug Swiss cheese, control arm or axle to sell - or knows someone who is parting out a GLH or Shelby.
I will also need a (short) bumper nerf for a 4 door L body with bumperettes, as one of mine fell off.
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s480x480/526838_3971641372778_1743993852_n.jpghttp://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s480x480/315853_3971646212899_355149094_n.jpghttp://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s480x480/61903_3971654373103_1152057422_n.jpg


Also, I am wondering how much a body shop may charge to repair the damages. Can these parts be straighted out? If so, is it a good idea to have the parts repaired or replaced?

Thanks,
Mike

[Tempted]

Best bet is to replace the parts, not try and save them. I did this to a 91 R/T, bent the arm, ruined the snowflake and punched a hole in the oil pan. Unfortunately that car went to the crusher after it was stripped.

[85boostbox]

If the drums were not damaged or the strut wasn't bent you can use any L body rear axle and just put the strut and drums on there. And I think poly bushings sells a custom rear l body anti sway bar. That is what I would do.

[black86glhs]

Where are you located?

[Turbo3Iroc]

Its hard to say what caused it but the old tires may have been a factor. The low miles on them plays less of a factor than the age.

[shayne]

simon has a shelby charger (a '85 iirc) he's parting out soon, just sayin.

[Tempted]

simon has a shelby charger (a '85 iirc) he's parting out soon, just sayin.

That could be your answer. I still hate seeing these cars get disbanded though.

[tryingbe]

At first I started to blame my "Eagle GT IIs for not sticking as they should but they are about 11 years old with only about 5k miles on them. I do blame my lack of "stick shift" driving savvy skills as part of the cause for my mishap.


11 years old tires are junk.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngIK4dmTGic


Oh yeah, check this out too.

http://biertijd.com/mediaplayer/?itemid=38069

[thedon809]

You are driving on 11 year old tires? You sir, are a brave individual.

[roachjuice]

Ive got some 8 year old tires I'm driving on right now. I'm a little iffy about em. Gonna replace them this spring with some kdw's.
Sucks about the GLH. Id just replace the parts that are messed up.

[GLHNSLHT2]

For Future reference: FWD handles like 911 Porsche, When rear end slips due to lift throttle oversteer you FLOOR IT and steer where you want to go. If you are spinning around so fast that a 180 degree turn of the wheel won't catch it wait till you are going to have a straight section in front of you and lock all 4 tires to straighten your trajectory even though you might be doing 360's. These have saved my --- numerous times. The lock all four tires thing kept me from balling up the car in front of 6 lanes of L.A. traffic in the rain. I lost it coming through a puddle (rain in L.A. is like black ice up north) down an on-ramp from the 134 west to the I5 south. 180 degree turn of the steering wheel couldn't save it so I locked all 4. Stayed just about in the right lane the whole time, left rear corner slightly rubbed the gaurd rail as I was looking at 6 lanes of headlights coming at me. Car continued around, sometime through the spin I went from 5th to 3rd, car was pointing in the right direction. I let off the brakes, blipped the throttle, disengaged the clutch and took off down the freeway like nothing happened.


If the drums were not damaged or the strut wasn't bent you can use any L body rear axle and just put the strut and drums on there. And I think poly bushings sells a custom rear l body anti sway bar. That is what I would do.

I'd advise against just finding any old Lbody rear axle and putting on a PB bar. I put the 1 1/8" bar on my GLHT after cutting off the factory setup. Car was a tail happy mofo in the corners. You could drive around a parking lot at idle at full lock and lift a rear tire 8" off the ground. Even the 1" bar I believe is too much if you're corner carving above 30MPH. Best to keep the stock sway bars IMO. The aftermarket setup is an AutoX only thing. I lost it in basically the same manner as the OP, got on the throttle though, car went down to the INSIDE of the corner, through the ditch, around a light pole and back out onto the road. That rear bar setup was dangerous in corners at more than 40MPH. On an AutoX track though it'd be golden.

[ajakeski]

That wheel can be fixed.
Look for USA Wheel or Keystone. Both restore aluminum wheels.

http://www.usawheels.net/

Here's a new post of someone parting out a Shelby Charger:

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?69117-Parting-out-1987-Shelby-Charger


That rear axle will work on your GLH.

[5sp. mini]

first move the bad wheel to front then have to wheel alinment check to see if there is any alingment promblems they run shims back there so the hub will have to come loose.

[BadAssPerformance]

When rear end slips due to lift throttle oversteer you FLOOR IT and steer where you want to go.

Yep... and old tires and such magnify how loose the rear can get while turning off throttle and even moreso turning under breaking. Had old bald ties on the rear of my first 87 CSX, and new tires on front (its a FWD, does it even need rear tires? LOL) and spun it 360° on the highway cuz my natural instinct (and seeing traffic ahead) when the car out of shape, I tapped the break... insta spin... luckily came out me and car both OK.

Sounds like its not too bad, all fixable, glad it is and you are OK :thumb: chalk it up to lesson learned :nod:

[91dodgespiritrt]

My rear axle is 5 lug.

---------- Post added at 03:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:16 PM ----------

How can I get in touch with Simon? Can he possibly get in touch with me on here?

[BadAssPerformance]

Simon = turbovanman on here

[cordes]

11 years old tires are junk.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngIK4dmTGic


Oh yeah, check this out too.

http://biertijd.com/mediaplayer/?itemid=38069

I'm still waiting for empirical evidence stating that tires have a shelf life of xx years. It's been a very long wait so I'm not holding out for it to come about soon.

[supercrackerbox]

I'm still waiting for empirical evidence stating that tires have a shelf life of xx years. It's been a very long wait so I'm not holding out for it to come about soon.

How they're stored has more to do with it than how long they're stored. Sun and weather will take their toll on rubber in very short order compared to tires that are wrapped in plastic and stored in a climate controlled shop. But the simple fact is that rubber does harden and deteriorate with time. Then there's also the fact that the technology put into tires these days is growing nearly as fast as what's put into the rest of the car.


Ive got some 8 year old tires I'm driving on right now. I'm a little iffy about em. Gonna replace them this spring with some kdw's.

Dude, you can do so much better than KDWs.

[shadow88]

I'm still waiting for empirical evidence stating that tires have a shelf life of xx years. It's been a very long wait so I'm not holding out for it to come about soon.

Totally agree!!!

OIne thing than may work against us and our cars is that the tire sizes we use are damn near obselete and you're stuck with old tires (not proven to be bad yet) or Chineese tires (you should know what you're getting there).

[jckrieger]

I'm still waiting for empirical evidence stating that tires have a shelf life of xx years. It's been a very long wait so I'm not holding out for it to come about soon.

I have first hand auto-x evidence that aged tires with full tread on a car stored indoors are scary! I was skeptical as well so I replaced the rear tires on my GTS and left the full tread 2004 manufacture date Dunlops on the front. The car understeered so badly it was nearly undriveable at the auto-x. I replaced the front tires and the car immediately handled as expected.

Try to push your fingernail in an 8-10 year old tire, then try it on a new tire. The tires change a lot, and none of the results are good unless you like driving around on rocks. MY GLHS will need new tires even though the current tires only have about 1,000 miles on them. They look new but they're so hard I don't even think I'd call them rubber. The manufacture date is 2002 and they have probably seen less than 24 hours of sunlight in their entire life.

---------- Post added at 11:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:24 AM ----------

Go to any car forum that is not "value focused". Road course guys will say their tires aren't as good after just one event due to the thermal cycling. Auto-x guys say the tires aren't competitive after they've been used for about a season. Viper guys say throw your tires away after 4 years.

I don't believe driving to work or around town is unsafe with 10 year old tires, but I do believe you will probably crash your car if you try driving on the limit with old tires on a regular basis. The tires become unforgiving and really don't grip like they should. I also had a 12 year old auto-x tire come apart on the highway at 65 mph. If you're going to try and be a hero, make sure you're not doing it on old tires.

[RoadWarrior222]

IMO, if your tires are going shiny hard, you should attempt to burn/shave off the top layer, see if you can get down to some softer rubber... if not, you might wanna give up on them.

[shackwrrr]

Time for some burnouts, have fin with what tread is left.

[black86glhs]

I have first hand auto-x evidence that aged tires with full tread on a car stored indoors are scary! I was skeptical as well so I replaced the rear tires on my GTS and left the full tread 2004 manufacture date Dunlops on the front. The car understeered so badly it was nearly undriveable at the auto-x. I replaced the front tires and the car immediately handled as expected.

Try to push your fingernail in an 8-10 year old tire, then try it on a new tire. The tires change a lot, and none of the results are good unless you like driving around on rocks. MY GLHS will need new tires even though the current tires only have about 1,000 miles on them. They look new but they're so hard I don't even think I'd call them rubber. The manufacture date is 2002 and they have probably seen less than 24 hours of sunlight in their entire life.

---------- Post added at 11:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:24 AM ----------

Go to any car forum that is not "value focused". Road course guys will say their tires aren't as good after just one event due to the thermal cycling. Auto-x guys say the tires aren't competitive after they've been used for about a season. Viper guys say throw your tires away after 4 years.

I don't believe driving to work or around town is unsafe with 10 year old tires, but I do believe you will probably crash your car if you try driving on the limit with old tires on a regular basis. The tires become unforgiving and really don't grip like they should. I also had a 12 year old auto-x tire come apart on the highway at 65 mph. If you're going to try and be a hero, make sure you're not doing it on old tires.I agree for normal driving they should be fine. However the one time you have to do some extreme manuevering may show the tires weaknesses.

[cordes]

I don't disagree that the rubber changes over time.

However videos like the one above are not based on empirical evidence, moreover all peer reviewed studies I've seen seem to indicate that there isn't a great overall correlation between tire failure and age. Of course that makes total sense as a Michelin will be much different than a Wan Lee over it's lifetime as it was the day it rolled off the line. Even then there isn't much to go on even between manufacturers.

[black86glhs]

I believe age gets the blame in many cases where underinflation was the more likely culprit or contributed to a failure as much as aged rubber. People aren't going to tell you they never check the air pressure, especially after a tire comes apart. I walk by cars all the time with half flat tires and the people get in and drive away. I can usually feel when a tire is low, but even then it has to be 8-10 psi down. Thankfully I run them a little higher than stock, so I'm not 8-10 below recommended, usually 3-4.

[turbovanman²]

Where are you located, if your in the US, it would be better to get something there but if you can't, I can ship it.


That could be your answer. I still hate seeing these cars get disbanded though.

This car is beyond saving, its rusted so badly, the rear axle fell out, literally. Its just an L body too, nothing special, :bolt: :faint: :lol:


I'm still waiting for empirical evidence stating that tires have a shelf life of xx years. It's been a very long wait so I'm not holding out for it to come about soon.

Take a new tire, push your fingernail thru the thread, now try that with old/older tires, they solid with no give, now get driving and push on wet roads, they simply don't grip. I worked on a Corvette last year, had been sitting for 8 years inside a garage with brand new rubber, that car was damn scary, even in the dry, the tires were rock hard.

[Tempted]

I drove from Houston to Atlanta, while towing a car and had all my stuff loaded up(moved) on some uber ancient(as in 20 years old) BFG A/Ts.


They haven't used this tread design and sidewall since the early 90s.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh15/wvxvxvxvw/HPIM0193.jpg


I admit that it wasn't entirely smart, but I was broke and moving half way across the country on about a thousand bucks.

[cordes]

I believe age gets the blame in many cases where underinflation was the more likely culprit or contributed to a failure as much as aged rubber. People aren't going to tell you they never check the air pressure, especially after a tire comes apart. I walk by cars all the time with half flat tires and the people get in and drive away. I can usually feel when a tire is low, but even then it has to be 8-10 psi down. Thankfully I run them a little higher than stock, so I'm not 8-10 below recommended, usually 3-4.

That nail's head has never been hit harder.

[Tempted]

TPMS systems wouldn't be manditory on new vehicles if people just checked their tires at each fill up. Instead we all have to suffer the consequences that the lazy car owners bring.

[cordes]

TPMS systems wouldn't be manditory on new vehicles if people just checked their tires at each fill up. Instead we all have to suffer the consequences that the lazy car owners bring.

And not to mention the weight of them. Yet another thing killing my mileage if I upgrade to a newer vehicle.

[shadow88]

You could just remove the system. I sure would.

Simon, the agruement Cordes was making (i think) wasn't if an aged tire has worse grip, but rather that an aged tire is going to fail. It's well documented that the grip is decreased over time, milage and use.

[Tempted]

And not to mention the weight of them. Yet another thing killing my mileage if I upgrade to a newer vehicle.

Plus the fact that none of them work right after 50k miles. Heck half the time they don't work right brand new. Up until 2010 or so Ford were using the most retarded design ever. I did a bunch of Super Snake GT500 conversions, and they use 20" Alcoa forged wheels instead of the stock 18s or 19s. In order to change the sensors over you have to cut the giant hose clamp that holds the sensor in place, then chisel the double sided sticky tape away so you can remove it from the old wheel. After that you re-apply the tape, measure the length of the new hose clamp(the old ones, being designed for 18s, won't stretch all the way around the 20s) and cut it. Then thread it on the sensor, position the sensor at the valve stem, remove the backing from the sticky tape and press it down, then finally re-tighten the new hose clamp. After that, if you're lucky, the sensor won't be ripped lose by the tire you are mounting on it. Since these tires are usually 255-35-20 front and 285 to 305-30-20 rear the sidewalls are like iron so getting them over the sensors without pulling them loose takes some practice. Just stupid, stupid designs. Almost as bad as Ford's 3v 5.4 Triton spark plug design.

---------- Post added at 03:35 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:31 AM ----------


You could just remove the system. I sure would.

Not if you want the car to pass inspection ever again. The one dash light that I can't disable with SCT Advantage III(or any other software for that matter) is the TPMS system. Yeah, you can remove the LED or tape over it but it still beeps and reads on the DIC every time you start the car.

[85boostbox]

Plus the fact that none of them work right after 50k miles. Heck half the time they don't work right brand new. Up until 2010 or so Ford were using the most retarded design ever. I did a bunch of Super Snake GT500 conversions, and they use 20" Alcoa forged wheels instead of the stock 18s or 19s. In order to change the sensors over you have to cut the giant hose clamp that holds the sensor in place, then chisel the double sided sticky tape away so you can remove it from the old wheel. After that you re-apply the tape, measure the length of the new hose clamp(the old ones, being designed for 18s, won't stretch all the way around the 20s) and cut it. Then thread it on the sensor, position the sensor at the valve stem, remove the backing from the sticky tape and press it down, then finally re-tighten the new hose clamp. After that, if you're lucky, the sensor won't be ripped lose by the tire you are mounting on it. Since these tires are usually 255-35-20 front and 285 to 305-30-20 rear the sidewalls are like iron so getting them over the sensors without pulling them loose takes some practice. Just stupid, stupid designs. Almost as bad as Ford's 3v 5.4 Triton spark plug design.

---------- Post added at 03:35 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:31 AM ----------



Not if you want the car to pass inspection ever again. The one dash light that I can't disable with SCT Advantage III(or any other software for that matter) is the TPMS system. Yeah, you can remove the LED or tape over it but it still beeps and reads on the DIC every time you start the car.

Haha haha the good ole ford tpms. I love when the band breaks on them and then you get them bouncing around inside the tire going down the road. I have done too too many of those.

[Tempted]

One of my guys got fired over a TPMS issue. We run cameras on the staging areas to monitor everything going on. A customer called us and said something was flopping around in the tire when he unboxed it. I pretty much knew what it was but had him take it to a Discount Tire to demount it and verify. I checked the work order to see who filled it, then went and watched the video. The guy mounted the tire but the band broke after the lip hit it. In the video you can see him clear as day stop, look at it, move it around with his hand, then proceed to finish mounting the tire knowing the band was broken. I honestly thing that if the bands are broken, it happened during mounting and balancing. It doesn't weigh enough to generate enough force to break the band if it was installed correctly. I think some are unintentional, but some go out knowing that the band is damaged.

[shadow88]

---------- Post added at 03:35 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:31 AM ----------

[/COLOR]

Not if you want the car to pass inspection ever again. The one dash light that I can't disable with SCT Advantage III(or any other software for that matter) is the TPMS system. Yeah, you can remove the LED or tape over it but it still beeps and reads on the DIC every time you start the car.

We don't have yearly inspection, nor are TPMS or ABS or air bag systems covered in a DOT inspection. When I say remove the system, I mean all of it.

[turbovanman²]

We don't have yearly inspection, nor are TPMS or ABS or air bag systems covered in a DOT inspection. When I say remove the system, I mean all of it.

When I do a Provincial inspection, I don't have to physically check the systems but the light must come on and go out, otherwise I have to fail it, :(

[RoadWarrior222]

This is why you're poor Simon, you're supposed to say "When someone's holding a fan of $20 bills in front of my face, I can't see or give a f**k what the TPMS light is doing..." :D


But you do of course have our respect for being honest.

[turbovanman²]

This is why you're poor Simon, you're supposed to say "When someone's holding a fan of $20 bills in front of my face, I can't see or give a f**k what the TPMS light is doing..." :D


But you do of course have our respect for being honest.

Thanks, I think, :confused: :lol:

[shadow88]

It's nice to see BC's standards higher than Ontario's. I think out safety book was last updated in 1983

[turbovanman²]

It's nice to see BC's standards higher than Ontario's. I think out safety book was last updated in 1983

Doesn't mean people follow it, :confused:

Cash is still king and still talks in spades.

[RoadWarrior222]

Ours is fine if followed, the gouging shops, and those on the take don't make it easy for the honest ones though. Where I go and send people to is straight, but I've had some of them come back to me saying they should have let bulging brake flexlines go, or their regular mechanic didn't think a fuel line seeping onto the exhaust was really a problem :confused:

Then also I've had rellys ignore my advice about good deals and turn up with an "it's got a safety" cheap car, that I end up doing brake and suspension work on very shortly... but for cars and computers my rule now is "If you didn't/wouldn't take my advice in teh first place, then f**k you" haven't got the time to fix everyone elses willful mistakes.

[Tempted]

I've had to get friends to pass my cars before........ Tough to get a CARBURETED 1997 GMC Sierra through emissions. I did have a cat... though. Even had a catch can.

[86Shelby]

I do enjoy that the rules are pretty lax around here. The only time we have a problem with emissions is when you come across something like a 2000 Camaro equipped with an aggressive bumpstick, heads, headers with no mufflers, TH350, and a Holley carb running on E85; they usually get noise tickets only.

[Tempted]

The county I live in now has no emissions, inspection or anything.