A few simple tuning questions...

[smdandb2]

I have been trolling for months just reading things here and there, and it seems like over the years things have changed so I am not sure what is what anymore.

Long story short, my SL is finally running long enough to actually dedicate some time to the tune.

I am using the latest turbonator as well as the latest MPTune. The cals have always been pretty good once scaled properly, but I've always had tip in issues. I have never touched the PumpEff table, and I think thats probably where most of my problems are. Like most impatient people I went right for the Map/Full throttle table, lol.

So for the PumpEff I have a real stupid question. I know it's best to adjust it at load with zero boost, so that means dragging the brakes. I am assuming this is full throttle, but I could be wrong. Is the goal to aim for stoich, or richer than that?

I don't have a scanner, so my ability to judge knock is based on the CEL illuminating. As it sits now I see random knock at about 4000-4200 in 4th and 5th... but ONLY if I smash the throttle while in those gears. If I am doing a WOT burst from say 2nd to 5th... I don't see knock. Its only when I am cruising at say 3000rpm in 4th and nail it will I see knock at 4000-4200. I am assuming MBT is around that point. I am more or less just curious as to what kind of timing people running 21psi+ are running. I have been pulling my timing back more and more trying to eliminate knock... but for all I know its not real knock (I need to check the plugs).

Ok, one last stupid question. The car always goes rich on decel, and it annoys me. It was even worse on the FWDP S5 tune. Where do I fix that at? Will that problem go away once I get the PumpEff dialed in?

I guess a mod list might help too... I did buy this car modded already. I did have to put a new motor in it though, which is why it has forged parts now. Some mods are obvious to me, some I didnt even think to check (like the porting of the manifolds or the throttle body). Anything in "" is what I was told it had but I havent personally verified. I would suspect they are there though, I completely trust the guy I bought it from.

87 SL 623
CB 2.5 w/ Venolias and forged rods
782 Head
Adjustable Cam Gear (set at 0 right now)
"Ported" 2 Piece Intake
"Ported" Exhaust Manifold
"52mm TB"
3bar Map
Turblownetics 50trim
Grimmspeed MBC (G-Valve wasnt having it above 17psi)
2.5" Mandrel Bent exhaust w/ cat and bullet style muffler
NEW 550cc Injectors (550cc at 43.5psi... which is where I run my fuel pressure)
FWDP Billet Rail
AFPR
Junkbro 255 (Its holding together, guess I cant complain too much)
Whatever you guys call 2 stock ICs welded together (it's getting replaced soon enough)
PLX OLED Wideband

I think that is all that matters. Well, I guess I should say in the end I would like to see 22-24psi on pump, more if I can eek it out of it. Eventually (in the next 2 months) I want to toss in a nasty cam and meth injection. Right now it needs tires, so that takes away from the mods for a little bit.

Thanks guys.

[turbovanman²]

I would leave the spark tables alone, have a friend drive while you adjust, so set the boost controller for 5 psi, WOT it and adjust PE for 11-11.5:1, or get fairly close, now move to 10 psi, do it again, and so on, until its fairly close, then you can tweak the part and full throttle tables to get you on the money. Now if your using MPtune, use the AFR table and it gets you pretty damn close.

For knock, you can get a stethoscope and run some line up front and listen for it.

I like the definition of your turbo, :eyebrows:

[ShelGame]

For tip-in, the PEFTBL is not where you want to look.

Try this... http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?62392-Lean-on-Tip-in&p=863172&viewfull=1#post863172

With the bigger TB, I'd start with the TPS pump-shot values...

[smdandb2]

Thank you sirs, both of you! I'll give it a shot this weekend.

[1BADVAN]

I am not positive but I think there are very few if any people running 22 psi on pump gas. They are not like the new cars EVOs and WRXs that do it all the time.

If people do run over 20 on pump gas with these old TDs I would love to know what they are doing. With my G-head low compression motor i ran 19 on the street, but even that knocked if it was warm out.



EDIT: I know some people do run over 20 PSI, but i have never seen someone run over 20 psi on pump AND actually lay down a decent number on the dyno or track.

[smdandb2]

I am not positive but I think there are very few if any people running 22 psi on pump gas. They are not like the new cars EVOs and WRXs that do it all the time.

If people do run over 20 on pump gas with these old TDs I would love to know what they are doing. With my G-head low compression motor i ran 19 on the street, but even that knocked if it was warm out.



EDIT: I know some people do run over 20 PSI, but i have never seen someone run over 20 psi on pump AND actually lay down a decent number on the dyno or track.

Well if I figure something out I'll let you know. I am in the SLC area as well.

I am at 1.4 bar right now, I just want MOAR! I think it has it in it.

[turbovanman²]

8 valves aka Aaron Miller is the only one I know of.

[wowzer]

how are you burning the chips? if you already are set up with a flash module then you should have the correct wiring to use mpscan to log. all you need is an ftdi ttl/usb cable and you should be able to scan.

[smdandb2]

I am using an Ostrich in my LM.

[wowzer]

i'ld still look at buying the ftdi cable and using it to scan.

so are you using mptune to flash the ostrich? if so have you also tried the real time table update feature? just curious how/if it works ok.

[smdandb2]

I am actually using the EMUtility to monitor the file for changes and then upload. I like working with the tpl files rather than the bin files. The extra organization goes a long ways.

[turbovanman²]

how are you burning the chips? if you already are set up with a flash module then you should have the correct wiring to use mpscan to log. all you need is an ftdi ttl/usb cable and you should be able to scan.

Is there more info on this? I am sure there is but never paid attention until now.



I am actually using the EMUtility to monitor the file for changes and then upload. I like working with the tpl files rather than the bin files. The extra organization goes a long ways.

If using MP tune, you don't need emutility anymore, I was stuck in old school too but now with Morris's updates, it makes changes and burning a snap.

[wowzer]

if you buy the ftdi usb cable, there are only really a couple things you need to do. 1) program the ftdi cable to invert the logic pins and 2) connect the ftdi rx,tx and ground to your diagnostic connector by the ecu. rob sells a cable already setup to plug right into the sci port, otherwise you will just need to tap the lines yourself.

then you can scan away using mpscan.

also, with the flash module (i believe) you can also easily program the chip using the same cable plus a wire to get the ecu into boot mode. its not quite as slick as the ostrich but it's a bit cheaper route. i do like the real time updates you can do with the ostrich tho. i need to test running the ostrich at the same time as i'm running mpscan and see if they play nicely together. that way you could make table adjustments on the fly and immediately see the impact on vehicle.

[ShelGame]

also, with the flash module (i believe) you can also easily program the chip using the same cable plus a wire to get the ecu into boot mode. its not quite as slick as the ostrich but it's a bit cheaper route. i do like the real time updates you can do with the ostrich tho. i need to test running the ostrich at the same time as i'm running mpscan and see if they play nicely together. that way you could make table adjustments on the fly and immediately see the impact on vehicle.

You need a modified computer to flash in-car, and even then that only works on the SMEC and SBEC/SBECII. There are instrucitons for making the LM flashable in-car, but it can't currently be done using MP Tuner (the boot loader has to be pre-programmed onto the memory chip, the LM doesn't have enough RAM for it).

[smdandb2]

I replaced my TPS sensor and power module and that actually cleared a majority of my issues up. I actually had it running pretty good yesteday when I decided it would be a good idea to journey out of my comfort zone and take the car on I80 west to chase a severe thunder/lightning storm. Of course in the middle of the storm with rain/hail/lightning/thunder the damndest thing happend. The 90 degree elbow from the intake to the vacuum block sheared right off. So after getting drenched on the side of I80 trying to figure it out I had to limp it home. No power assist on the brakes sucks more than anything else, lol.

I have no idea what size those fittings are, but I am hoping Home Depot has what I need today.

[1BADVAN]

that sucks, good luck with finding what you need.

[smdandb2]

I got some Earls/Russells fittings ordered yesterday. Should be back up and running in no time.