Cosworth turbo outlet same as TIII?

[Turbo3Iroc]

Came across this in Reeves' thread and didn't want to hijak. I noticed the "Special Cosworth" housing and couldn't help but notice how much it resembled a stock TIII turbo outlet. If it fits it would be a nice easy upgrade for stock turbos. Anyone seen this before or know if there is a difference?

http://www.atpturbo.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/Catalog%20Images/Turbochargers/ATP-HSG-075_450-1.jpg

http://www.atpturbo.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=GRT-TBO-032&Category_Code=GRT

http://www.atpturbo.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=TP&Product_Code=ATP-HSG-075&Category_Code=

[turbovanman²]

I think we've covered this before and it should work but looking at the fitment, it says GT30R and 35R, those have special backing plates, not the same as T3/T4's.

[Turbo3Iroc]

I haven't seen this housing before no less posted here. It clearly says that it is for 30/35R, I don't know where the T3/T4 reference came from.

[turbovanman²]

I haven't seen this housing before no less posted here. It clearly says that it is for 30/35R, I don't know where the T3/T4 reference came from.

Well you said an upgrade, so if one was to upgrade the stock turbo, one would need an outlet for a T3 turbo, correct?

tryingbe and I talked about this housing years ago due to me looking at options when but that's as far as it got.

[tryingbe]

TIII style turbine housing is used in UK for Ford's Escort Cosworth and other cars. A/r .48 and a/r .63 were both use, although a/r .48 is most common.

http://www.modified.com/features/0106_sccp_1994_ford_escort_rs_cosworth/photo_07.html

TIII style turbo is also used on Lotus Esprit, not sure which a/r.

http://www.lotusespritturbo.com/Lotus_Esprit_Turbo_910_Engine.htm

Lastly, the TIII style housing is also used on XJ220, except XJ220 used two of them, not sure which a/r.

http://www.evo.co.uk/front_website/gallery.php?id=306920


I'm also a fan of that turbine housing, having one in my GLH and the other is going onto my Volvo.


Feeling exotic yet?

[Turbo3Iroc]

Thanks Harry, so a stock TIII O2 housing will bolt to this?

[tryingbe]

I'd ask ATP for spec drawing.

[turbovanman²]

Volvo has something similar but its very small.

Check out the engine drawings in this link, the cams look familiar, the head looks like a Quad 4, the cam carriers look like they are from a Chevette, :lol:

http://www.lotusespritturbo.com/Lotus_Esprit_Turbo_910_Engine.htm

[iTurbo]

Just thought I would give this thread a bump to see if anyone else has tried this Cosworth housing....

A local friend of mine recently purchased a new turbocharger from ATP. It is a 50-trim/stg III, with the optional .72 A/R 'Cosworth' turbine housing from ATP Turbo. Should be here soon...I will post pics of it versus the stock .48 TIII turbine housing. We are hoping to use the stock TIII exhaust outlet (o2 housing) *and* that this will allow the use of the stock-type down pipe (3" mandrel bent from FWDP).

[iTurbo]

My friend (tman1999) got the 50-trim/stg3 turbocharger in today with the optional .72 A/R Cosworth turbine housing. I stopped by his workplace to check out the turbo and also brought a TIII 02 housing with me to check fitment. It looks like the O2 housing will fit perfectly and allow for the stock downpipe to be used. As far as I can tell, this is as close as it gets to having a real bolt-on hybrid for TIII. So far it does not look like anything will have to be modified/changed, except for the wastegate actuator bracket.

[turbovanman²]

Interesting.

[Turbo3Iroc]

Very interesting, thanks for checking into this.

[iTurbo]

I will post pics and more info when I can. I have only seen the ATP Cosworth housing once and put the TIII O2 housing onto it to see if the bolt holes lined up and downpipe donut angle certainly *looked* really good..

The ATP Cosworth housing did not come with any attachement studs for the O2 housing, so I will have to order the correct studs from McMaster-Carr next.

[iTurbo]

Last night I got first hand experience driving a Spirit R/T (my old car) which is now equipped with a Garrett T04E 50-trim/Stg3 turbocharger with the ATP "Cosworth" .78 A/R turbine housing. Surprisingly the lag wasn't so bad at all! The car was plenty driveable and there was a noticeable increase in lag over the stock T3 turbocharger. It would go right into boost when you floored it (at a reasonable RPM of course). Boosting from 0-10psi was noticeably slower, but once it got to about 10psi it really took off at hit full boost which is currently set to 15-16psi with a grainger valve MBC. I think once the new owner of the car and I get some more things ironed out it will be even better.

We did a quick roll-on race with the new owner of the car driving the R/T and me driving Buick Regal GS, which has a few mods (3" down pipe, 4" intake, smaller S/C pulley, ZZP PCM) and the Regal got walked all over.

[rx2mazda]

Sweet! Why did he go with the .78 ? Does he need that much turbine?!

[iTurbo]

Sweet! Why did he go with the .78 ? Does he need that much turbine?!

The ATP 'Cosworth' housing is only available in .78 A/R. I was a little hesitant to suggest to the new owner of the car that he try it, since increased lag might take some of the fun factor out of the car and as far as I know, nobody else has tried this housing on a TIII yet. Lag doesn't seem to be an issue though, and didn't have to do anything to the downpipe at all to bolt it up since it is still using the stock TIII O2 housing. Primary reason for choosing this turbine housing was ease of install.

[tazaroo]

Keep us informed after you play with it some more. This sounds good so far.

[iTurbo]

Just thought I would correct myself.... The ATP 'Cosworth' turbine housing is .72 A/R.

[iTurbo]

I've had the car at my house for the last couple days in order to track down some bugs and iron out some details. One of the first things I noticed was that the wastegate rod was really loose on the swingvalve; not even holding it shut! Even though I thought spoolup was acceptable before, it looks like there is definitely room for more improvement.

How much preload should I put on the swing valve with this combo? It's using a new ATP wastegate actuator, which I'm pretty sure is their "14 psi" version. I was thinking of setting it so that the rod had to be pulled out about 1/8" before sliding it over the swingvalve arm. Thoughts?

[rx2mazda]

I would start with just enough to hold it shut tight and adjust from there.

[GLHNSLHT2]

well stock for these cars is 5-7psi with a straight line to the actuator.

[iTurbo]

Just thought I'd bump this thread now that my old Spirit R/T has been running the 'Cosworth' .72 A/R turbine housing from ATP for a few months now. It is on a T3/T4 hybrid, 50-trim with stg III turbine. Spool up is awesome on the car and the exhaust fit just like it did with the stock turbo since it uses the factory O2 housing. When it comes time to get a different turbo for my other Spirit R/T, I'm going to go this route. The ATP waste gate actuator and bracket worked great for this combo as well.

[GLHNSLHT2]

Thanks for the update jeremy, I was wondering about this just the other day even though I'm not a t3 fan.

[iTurbo]

Built right, they can be a lot of fun Jay. Compared to the price of admission of Masi 16v, you might be missing out.

For my 'other' white Spirit R/T (the epic road trip from Des Moines one), I'm going to build it similar to this car except with 2.5L short block. Might even go a bit bigger on the turbo considering what the old red R/T is doing with the 50-trim/stgIII.

[iTurbo]

I just sent an email to ATP Turbo regarding the range of turbine wheels that can be used with the .72 A/R Cosworth style turbine housing. Will report back if I get an answer.

My friend (tman1999) had originally ordered it with the stg II turbine wheel, but ATP later contacted him because that turbine wheel was unavailable. They gave him a 'free' upgrade to the stg III turbine. I'm glad it worked out that way now because it seems to work great on the car.

[4 l-bodies]

I just sent an email to ATP Turbo regarding the range of turbine wheels that can be used with the .72 A/R Cosworth style turbine housing. Will report back if I get an answer.

My friend (tman1999) had originally ordered it with the stg II turbine wheel, but ATP later contacted him because that turbine wheel was unavailable. They gave him a 'free' upgrade to the stg III turbine. I'm glad it worked out that way now because it seems to work great on the car.
My guess is stage III and GT 60mm (GT3076) turbine and perhaps stage I but I kind of doubt it. So you are using the stock III cast down-turn with this? I can't really call it a swingvalve as it doesn't have a puck in it (lol). Seems like that would be sort of small with that high of flowing turbo. Sure is a better design than TII and Masi 16V, but isn't it still 2.5 outlet? Is this the down-turn your using, or does ATP or someone make something bigger?
Todd

[iTurbo]

Yes, that appears to be a stock TIII 'o2 housing', which is what I call it because it doesn't have the swing valve puck integrated into it. This is what we are using on the red Spirit R/T with the Cosworth housing. I know it isn't the best design, but it is working really well so far. The exhaust system on the car is 3" FWDPerformance kit, but still uses the stock donut and about 2" of the stock 2.5" diameter pipe so that it still bolts up just like stock. So far I haven't been able to find a better aftermarket 02 housing that will work for this, so we are still using the factory TIII piece.

I do have a prototype version of this piece though. It is also cast, but appears to still be 2.5" and uses a different exhaust connection than the donut we are all used to seeing. I got it with the prototype TIII motor I bought last year. It would also work with the Cosworth type turbine housing if I recall correctly.

[GLHNSLHT2]

they have it for the Stage 3, GT30 and GT35 turbos.

[4 l-bodies]

Yes, that appears to be a stock TIII 'o2 housing', which is what I call it because it doesn't have the swing valve puck integrated into it. This is what we are using on the red Spirit R/T with the Cosworth housing. I know it isn't the best design, but it is working really well so far. The exhaust system on the car is 3" FWDPerformance kit, but still uses the stock donut and about 2" of the stock 2.5" diameter pipe so that it still bolts up just like stock. So far I haven't been able to find a better aftermarket 02 housing that will work for this, so we are still using the factory TIII piece.

I do have a prototype version of this piece though. It is also cast, but appears to still be 2.5" and uses a different exhaust connection than the donut we are all used to seeing. I got it with the prototype TIII motor I bought last year. It would also work with the Cosworth type turbine housing if I recall correctly.

Can't remember what application but for some reason a Caddy motor comes to mind that used the 3" downpipe gasket. Perhaps NorthStar V-8? Figure that out and then find that motor in salvage yard and buy exhaust manifold. Do a little cutting and welding and have a nice 3" TIII o2 housing. I think Rob (Shadow) machined 2.5 swingvalve outlets into 3" when he makes his 3" swingvalves for the SOHC 8V. I've had a couple of those in my hands and he does a very nice job on them.
I hear you on putting 3" gaskets on 2.5" outlets, it works but not ideal. I don't like doing it either. I'm sure your friends R/T runs great with this combo. Has to be a huge upgrade from stock!
Todd

[iTurbo]

Thanks for the info Todd!! I do love junk yarding!

[iTurbo]

I got an email back from ATP tech support today and they say that the Cosworth style housing is available for stg III turbines for journal bearing turbos and also available for the GT3071R and GT3076R ball bearing turbos. Sounds like that is the off-the-shelf availability anyways.

[tryingbe]

.

I do have a prototype version of this piece though. It is also cast, but appears to still be 2.5" and uses a different exhaust connection than the donut we are all used to seeing. I got it with the prototype TIII motor I bought last year. It would also work with the Cosworth type turbine housing if I recall correctly.

Bump, do you have the photos of this prototype?