First start up issues. Suggestions?

[krut]

Hi. I recently rebuilt my motor in my 89 Daytona 2.5 t1, and attempted to start it up yesterday.
When turning key on, engine off, it seems anything related to the red (or was it grey?) instrument cluster connector does not function.
At either rate, this is the connector with the check engine light, brake light, air bag, battery, etc. lights.

The fuel pump primes, and runs while cranking. I get 12v to the coil when cranking.
However, I do not get fuel injector pulse or any spark.

Is there anything I should look at?
I inspected the ASD relay and it seems to be functioning correctly.
The HEP gets 9 volts to each pickup power wire.
Also, could the lights not coming on in the gauge cluster indicate a problem with why the car isn't starting?

Any tips or suggestions for where to look would be appreciated. I'm trying to get any idea of where to look for this coming Saturday.
Thanks a bunch!
Kurt

[Shadowjake]

Hmmm. Did you check the fuel injector harness? Make sure there is continuity between the injector plug and the pin on the computer. Not sure what car your running this in but if it has a SBEC the injector grounds are pins 13-16 (working from cylinder 4 to 1) on the 60 pin connector. Did you remember to connect the ground to the fuel rail bolt? Injectors won't fire without it.

Not sure on the no spark. if the fuel pump primes, your ASD should be working. You can test it (or test by bypassing it) by grounding the corner connector on the diagnostic port under the hood. I think it's blue with a yellow strip. But it the connector makes an L and if you ground the one in the corner and key on, it will activate the pump constantly, provide voltage to the coil, and give + voltage to the green/black wire on the injector harness. (common positive). By grounding the pins (13-16 I think) on the SBEC, it will fire the respective injectors.

Hope this helps a little . . . Post more info on the car. A video maybe if you can. Let us see what it's doing. Good luck.

[krut]

It's an 89 Daytona. We've tried putting a jumper wire on the asd relay, and with that we still weren't getting spark.
The fuel injector harness is grounded. I had to make a new harness for it since age got to it, and it's definitely bolted down. I'll check my wiring there tonight.
Do you mean to ground the drb port, and not bypassing the asd relay?

I'll see if I can post a video.
This is starting to get frustrating, hehe. I actually had the car putter once, as if one cylinder fired. Then nothing happened :(

Thanks!
Kurt

[89ShelbyGuy]

make SURE the HEP connectos are good you might be getting voltage to them but the pins might have a bad connection....after i rebuilt my motor in my shelby...after it sat a month the HEP connectors develped corrision...and when i went to put the car back together it would just crank but not start....i had to clean all the pins of the HEP...pluged it back in and wala...it started right up..

[krut]

We pushed the pins in so it'll fit nice and tight. I'll check for corrosion and clean the pins at the HEP and see if that makes a difference tonight.
Do you think the lack of CEL, air bag light, etc could be related?
(I need to go over all connections again tonight just to be double sure I haven't forgot anything...)

[RoadWarrior222]

Yeah, use the Nintendo trick, unplug everything one by one, huff on it, and plug it back in again. (Some stuff might not have snapped right into contact, or started shoving the contacts out the back of the shelll in which case you might need to fluff up the spring clips on the terminal with a jewellers screwdriver and shove them back in again.)

[89ShelbyGuy]

I am hoping you did this..but did you check all the fuses in the fuse block..?

And as for the nintendo trick...i usually just huffed into it...and if that didn't work...start hitting the top of it....lol...that always seems to work well...haha!

[krut]

I'll double check fuses tonight. I did redo all the fusible links. I have the splice list at home though. Nothing has blown on the outside, but I'll double check inside ones tonight.

I'm going to go over all connectors with cleaner on the steering column and under the dash, and outside tonight.
When I get home I'll let you all know how it goes!

[89ShelbyGuy]

Its most likley something you messed with when removing the motor...i would check the resistance between the fusiable links.

[krut]

Its most likley something you messed with when removing the motor...i would check the resistance between the fusiable links.

I had to rewire the fusible links. Too many of them were bad. They are all now in line ato fuses and maxi fuses.
I'll investigate anyways. What resistances should I look for where? Thanks a bunch!

[krut]

I looked at it today. I'm missing the ground from the motor mount to the frame rail, but I doubt that'd cause this many problems.I can't find a good photograph on where it mounts from to where, though.
I think I can get ahold of when on wednesday at any rate for testing if it comes down to it.

Everything on the grey connector still isn't on. I cleaned all the terminals on the steering column, the gauge cluster, and inside the engine bay.
I cleaned the smec connectors, etc.

I rewired the fusible links as per the guide on minimopar, and I have interior lights, ignition voltage, power to the ASD relay, etc. I get 12v to the green ribbon to the information center where the CEL is.

I still don't get spark. I do get fuel now, though. Found a crappy ground. The ASD is working. The pump primes, and I still get 12v to the coil when cranking.

Could it be the HEP? - The one I'm using has been inside the past 7 months, and was functional before removal of the engine.
This still doesnt fix the CEL. (I am hoping to get this on so I can see what's going wrong.)
** Edit ** - Tried a reman distributor / hep. Still no dice.

Unfortunately I don't know anyone I can get into contact with to test the ECM's I have for the car.
Now I just need to figure out why the lights aren't working, and why I'm not getting fire!
I'm so close, yet rather frustrated (;

Thanks

[89ShelbyGuy]

How are you testing for spark?

Have you tried a different coil?

Also, when your cranking, the rotor underneath the cap rotates right?

Go on ebay and get your self the set of FSMs for the 89 cars....(service manuals)

[krut]

I have borrowed a FSM set. I teSt for spark by removing the wire from the distributor cap and leave it roughly .25" away from the alternator case while cranking. The rotor does rotate. I have tried another coil.

[89ShelbyGuy]

Well, if i were in your shoes, i would trace out all the wires from the injector and hep harness and check the resistance between the harness connector and the connector that plugs into the smec. And make sure all the grounds in the harness have a good ground. Resistance should be between .02-.08 on your tester....basicly set the tester to 20k ohms and touch the red and black together and remember that reading...that should be very close when you connect them to the ends of your harness wires. If you have a infinate loop, trace the wire out and check for breaks, or just replace the wire and then move on.

You have a electrical gremlin....usually when i have those, i make sure i have a 12 pack of beer...a stoggie...and then start.

And you said you tryed a different hep...was this a KNOWN working one..or just one from the store and assumed to work? Also, the shutter wheel underneath the hep...thats nice and tight...no melting or loose feeling?

[krut]

The original shutter wheel was sloppy. I have two good dists now. the HEP is assumed good. I have a buddy with a similar car but he's on his honeymoon so I can't verify if they're good or not. Ill check the connections tonight. maybe that's what the issue is with the CEL as well.
Ill get back to you, and ill let you all know what the problem is if I find it (;
Thanks!

[RoadWarrior222]

i make sure i have a 12 pack of beer...a stoggie...and then start.

Good plan, those gremlins are sneaky, always trying to outwit you, if you start out completely witless, it lulls them into a false sense of security and you can catch them napping out of sheer blind luck. :thumb: :D

[krut]

Or I can make it a party. beer, friends, and electrical issues! A friends coworker who loves wiring seems to be interested in the problem and seems they will be swinging by. when all is done hopefully I can just drink the beer without a DVM or test light next to me.:eyebrows:

[krut]

Got the car to start tonight around 9pm. It sure was nice to hear the motor run after spending 7 months out of the car and working on bits and pieces a few hours a night after work!
It turns out it was a loose pin on the 60 pin connector. It was pin 26, the distributor sync wire. The wire seemed tight, but after taking the connector apart my friend noticed that pin was slightly out of round.

Now on to the check engine light, air bag light, brake light, etc. Not coming on and my seat motors not working! :eyebrows:
I can't thank you guys enough for giving me ideas of where to look. The tips helped me find problems that needed to be fixed anyhow.

[RoadWarrior222]

Well done, that was a tough find.. next stage, I guess I'd attack firewall connector, column and dash grounds, and cross my fingers.. might have to go digging in the cluster. Seat motor may not be related, could have got stuck so give it a turn manually, then see if it's getting juice etc etc.

[krut]

Gotta investigate that later. I have a job interview soon! :)
Thanks all

[RoadWarrior222]

Good luck!

[89ShelbyGuy]

For the seat motor....

Do you have any type of rust by the EM brake on the floor pan...when my seat motor didn't work i found out that corrosin started eatting away at the wire loom above that floor pan...spliced in all new wires as there was about 10 of them...took care of the motor problem.

[krut]

I'll check the seat motors once there is a break in the weather.
Interview went well. I was offered a follow up interview, then got called the following day to be informed that they offered the job to someone else. I feel gipped. Oh well.
I'll let you know if I find what was wrong with the seat motors when I get to it. I'll let you all know!