Reverse Rotation Distributor - Any issues?

[ShelGame]

Does anyone have any issues running the distributor off the end of the cam in reverse rotation? I'm reading Dave Bohrer's instructions and looking at the Chrysler patents for the 2-HEP distributor and I'm not so sure that the distributor can be run backwards at all without causing ignition issues.

But, I know several people have done it this way - on both 2.0/2.4 and the Lotus head conversions.

My concerns:

1) Running it reverse rotation will make the sync pickup 'off' by several degress, even after reversing the pickup order by swapping plugs. Maybe this is not a problem as the sync is used ONLY for sync. As long as the SMEC/SBEC still sync, I guess this could be OK. One of the sync flags has only 11msec to read the hole in the vane to set sync. With reverse rotation, it seems like this could result in an occasional loss of sync - especially at high RPM - due to the timing change between the main and sync pickups.

2) Dwell - If the window is not correctly re-positioned relative to the rotor, it could affect the dwell period negatively. The cap and rotor must have electrical contact for the entire dwell period, otherwise you will get a weak spark. If the window isn't re-drilled correctly, that could happen.

So, I'd like to hear from guys that have run the distributor in reverse rotation and how it worked out. Any ignition or fuel issues?

[contraption22]

I think some modifications to the distributor need to be made. Rich Bryant offers the modified distributors, but I don't know what he does to them.

[ShelGame]

I think some modifications to the distributor need to be made. Rich Bryant offers the modified distributors, but I don't know what he does to them.

Yes, that's correct - the shutter wheel needs to be redrilled and moved, and the HEP connectors have to be swapped. I've seen that the HEP plate needs to turn 180*, but I don't see the point of that.

My point is, even WITH those mods, the timing chart for the 2 HEP's and the ignition point will not match the stock distributor rotation and that could cause some ignition issues.

[PunKid]

I recently just pulled apart my 85 Distributor to re shim it and I noticed that there is a lightly threaded area on the top of the shaft that I think is to hold a little grease and or prevent the grease/oil from flowing up into the cap area. If the 86 and up distributors have this too I think reversing it would turn that thread the wrong way and oil and grease might flow up into the cap easier. Just a thought

[contraption22]

This any help?

http://files.turbo-mopar.com/ (http://files.turbo-mopar.com/)

[ShelGame]

This any help?

http://files.turbo-mopar.com/ (http://files.turbo-mopar.com/)

No. I already have that. What I'm saying is, even doing those mods isn't going to result in the correct distributor operation. I'm curious if it actually causes problems or not...

[ShelGame]

Anyone?

[Omniboy]

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?22307-Gauging-interest-on-TIII-distributor-plates-and-machined-cam-ends!/page2

---------- Post added at 09:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:19 AM ----------

I did mine in reverse rotation on my T3 in the minivan several years ago. You need to grind off the shutter wheel and rotate it and swap the trigger wires. Read through the thread and my posts.

[turbo2point2]

I ran my setup for 5+ seasons up to 7500 rpm without any issues of misfire/trouble. Hope this helps!

[ShelGame]

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?22307-Gauging-interest-on-TIII-distributor-plates-and-machined-cam-ends!/page2

---------- Post added at 09:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:19 AM ----------

I did mine in reverse rotation on my T3 in the minivan several years ago. You need to grind off the shutter wheel and rotate it and swap the trigger wires. Read through the thread and my posts.

Thanks, but I HAVE THE INSTRUCTIONS!!!!

Sorry if that wasn't clear in the first post.

My point is this - even following the instrucitons will not result in the same-as-stock operation. I'll try to make a picture later to illustrate.

My question was simple - to those who have done the mods, did you have any ignition issues?

---------- Post added at 11:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:20 AM ----------


I ran my setup for 5+ seasons up to 7500 rpm without any issues of misfire/trouble. Hope this helps!

Thanks, that's the type of feedback I was hoping for...

[1BADVAN]

maybe my rich bryant about some of these questions as he builds them he probably would be a good source for feedback from his customers and what he does to avoid the problems you brought up

[ShelGame]

OK, I looked at the timing chart again and I understand now that swapping the pickups does in fact give the same pulse signals as stock.

What I was concerned about was the 11ms window below for the window to hit the HEP and set the sync bit. I thought there would be a time-shift in the sync pulse, but I see that swapping the HEP connectors is what fixes that.

[rbryant]

Sorry I missed the posts at first. I think you have it now though. :)

The mods are to change the shutter wheel orientation, flip the HEP 180, and then swap the HEP wiring.
I also drill a recess where the distributor base screw hole is so that the HEP key fits in it when flipped 180 degrees so there is no need to modify the actual HEP.

The wiring can be changed in the alternator/temperature sensor/AC/HEP engine harness by simply swapping the signal wires in the connector.

Feel free to reply or PM me if I can help.

Note that not all of the distributors have the pin in the same place so you can't base the shutter position on it. You have to do it relative to notch for the rotor on the shaft not the pin that holds the plastic to the shaft.

It should look like this:

Notice that the "arrow" points to the side of the windowed shutter.
32912

If you use screws then make sure they are low profile. I chose peel rivets so that they would be as tight to the shutter wheel as possible. I also don't drill the originals I just grind the tops off so that they also hold the wheel tight. BTW be careful because if you drop the shaft it will probably break the plastic.

The distributor mods are based on Dave Bohrer's instructions. My adapter is my own design because his used very non standard thicknesses on the components which would have made it more expensive to machine.

No big secrets here as it was Dave's idea I am just trying to enable people. :)

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

Gee, forget about me? :mecry:

Any, yes, there is a huge issue on the TIII, it leaks like a motherf*cker. I have an o-ring crammed in between the bushings, it works for a bit before the seal harden's up a tad. Trying to find some needle bearings with seals but not having much luck. Ignition problems, none.

Why does Rich have to reclock his, the 2.0/2.4 run off the intake cam so they are normal rotation.

[rbryant]

Why does Rich have to reclock his, the 2.0/2.4 run off the intake cam so they are normal rotation.

So your intake and exhaust cams run in opposite directions? That explains a lot. :)

The direction is set by the side of the engine, not which cam.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

So your intake and exhaust cams run in opposite directions? That explains a lot. :)

The direction is set by the side of the engine, not which cam.

-Rich

LOL. For some reason, I thought using the intake cam, nothing would need changing, :banghead:

[ShelGame]

Sorry I missed the posts at first. I think you have it now though. :)

The mods are to change the shutter wheel orientation, flip the HEP 180

This one I still don't understand. What difference does it make? You can always turn the whole distributor 180*, no? The HEP and distributor are tied to gether, so I see no reason to flip the HEP.



, and then swap the HEP wiring.
I also drill a recess where the distributor base screw hole is so that the HEP key fits in it when flipped 180 degrees so there is no need to modify the actual HEP.

The wiring can be changed in the alternator/temperature sensor/AC/HEP engine harness by simply swapping the signal wires in the connector.

Feel free to reply or PM me if I can help.

Note that not all of the distributors have the pin in the same place so you can't base the shutter position on it. You have to do it relative to notch for the rotor on the shaft not the pin that holds the plastic to the shaft.

It should look like this:

Notice that the "arrow" points to the side of the windowed shutter.
32912

If you use screws then make sure they are low profile. I chose peel rivets so that they would be as tight to the shutter wheel as possible. I also don't drill the originals I just grind the tops off so that they also hold the wheel tight. BTW be careful because if you drop the shaft it will probably break the plastic.

The distributor mods are based on Dave Bohrer's instructions. My adapter is my own design because his used very non standard thicknesses on the components which would have made it more expensive to machine.

No big secrets here as it was Dave's idea I am just trying to enable people. :)

-Rich

The whole reason I got into the instructions in deatil in the first place is because I'm going to run my 2.4 this way with the 'stock' SBEC. I thought maybe there was a way I could eliminate the process entirely by modifying the code. So, basically, T-SMEC and T-SBEC would have a flag to set and voila - reverse rotation distributor with no hardware changes. I'm still not sure if I can do that though. I needed to understand exactly how the SMEC/SBEC interpreted the timing signal and I do now. Since it really looks for the rising/falling edges, I don't think it can be done without modifying the hardware.

The other reason is, I want to make a VERY low profile distributor using the stock housing as a starting place. I need to get my cylinder head to finish my sketches and the put it all into CAD.

---------- Post added at 09:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:53 PM ----------


Gee, forget about me? :mecry:

Any, yes, there is a huge issue on the TIII, it leaks like a motherf*cker. I have an o-ring crammed in between the bushings, it works for a bit before the seal harden's up a tad. Trying to find some needle bearings with seals but not having much luck. Ignition problems, none.

Why does Rich have to reclock his, the 2.0/2.4 run off the intake cam so they are normal rotation.

I thought you ran the distributor in the stock T1/T2 location?

[rbryant]

This one I still don't understand. What difference does it make? You can always turn the whole distributor 180*, no? The HEP and distributor are tied to gether, so I see no reason to flip the HEP.

The whole reason I got into the instructions in deatil in the first place is because I'm going to run my 2.4 this way with the 'stock' SBEC. I thought maybe there was a way I could eliminate the process entirely by modifying the code. So, basically, T-SMEC and T-SBEC would have a flag to set and voila - reverse rotation distributor with no hardware changes. I'm still not sure if I can do that though. I needed to understand exactly how the SMEC/SBEC interpreted the timing signal and I do now. Since it really looks for the rising/falling edges, I don't think it can be done without modifying the hardware.

The other reason is, I want to make a VERY low profile distributor using the stock housing as a starting place. I need to get my cylinder head to finish my sketches and the put it all into


But the shutter also has to be in the right orientation relative to the HEP. The HEP sensors aren't at 180 degrees apart (one is not 90 from the hold down screws) so I think that might have something to do with it.

The SW approach is a cool idea. I think you might end up with a phase problem due to the angles of the sensor though unless you atleast flip the HEP.

I would have to think about it a lot more. At one point I convinced myself that it would all work and everyone else has had good luck so I haven't thought about it again.

-Rich

[ShelGame]

But the shutter also has to be in the right orientation relative to the HEP. The HEP sensors aren't at 180 degrees apart (one is not 90 from the hold down screws) so I think that might have something to do with it.

The SW approach is a cool idea. I think you might end up with a phase problem due to the angles of the sensor though unless you atleast flip the HEP.

I would have to think about it a lot more. At one point I convinced myself that it would all work and everyone else has had good luck so I haven't thought about it again.

-Rich

Yeah, but there's no mechanical connection between the shutter and the distributor housing. I don't think the HEP needs to be touched other that swapping the wires. And, yes, you do have to move the shutter. I still think this needs to be more precise than maybe Dave's instructions make it. If the shutter is 'off' relative to the rotor, then the rotor will lose contact with the cap before the nend of the dwell period (basically a mechanical dwell limit) resulting in a loss of spark energy. Maybe this is only small, but it is possible if the shutter is not placed precisely.

I need to do some distributor drawings myself...

[turbovanman²]

This one I still don't understand. What difference does it make? You can always turn the whole distributor 180*, no? The HEP and distributor are tied to gether, so I see no reason to flip the HEP.




The whole reason I got into the instructions in deatil in the first place is because I'm going to run my 2.4 this way with the 'stock' SBEC. I thought maybe there was a way I could eliminate the process entirely by modifying the code. So, basically, T-SMEC and T-SBEC would have a flag to set and voila - reverse rotation distributor with no hardware changes. I'm still not sure if I can do that though. I needed to understand exactly how the SMEC/SBEC interpreted the timing signal and I do now. Since it really looks for the rising/falling edges, I don't think it can be done without modifying the hardware.

The other reason is, I want to make a VERY low profile distributor using the stock housing as a starting place. I need to get my cylinder head to finish my sketches and the put it all into CAD.

---------- Post added at 09:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:53 PM ----------



I thought you ran the distributor in the stock T1/T2 location?

I did at first then moved it, about a year later, I had a few threads about it. I didn't like the fact that you had to remove the intake to do any servicing of the cap, rotor or HEP.

Also, see my sig, :eyebrows:

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a228/turbovanman/TIII%20engine%20build%20and%20van%20pics/Sonywork110.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a228/turbovanman/TIII%20engine%20build%20and%20van%20pics/workcamera040.jpg



Yeah, but there's no mechanical connection between the shutter and the distributor housing. I don't think the HEP needs to be touched other that swapping the wires. And, yes, you do have to move the shutter. I still think this needs to be more precise than maybe Dave's instructions make it. If the shutter is 'off' relative to the rotor, then the rotor will lose contact with the cap before the nend of the dwell period (basically a mechanical dwell limit) resulting in a loss of spark energy. Maybe this is only small, but it is possible if the shutter is not placed precisely.

I need to do some distributor drawings myself...

The HEP needs to be rotated 180 because the firing order is altered and the one PU is the injector syn, so if you don't rotate the HEP, it won't know when to sync. That's what I was told, haven't tried to run it without moving the HEP, maybe I should try.

I simply broke off the tabs on the harness connectors so you can swap them without modding anything and ground off the locator on the HEP.

[ShelGame]

I did at first then moved it, about a year later, I had a few threads about it. I didn't like the fact that you had to remove the intake to do any servicing of the cap, rotor or HEP.

Also, see my sig, :eyebrows:

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a228/turbovanman/TIII%20engine%20build%20and%20van%20pics/Sonywork110.jpg

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a228/turbovanman/TIII%20engine%20build%20and%20van%20pics/workcamera040.jpg




The HEP needs to be rotated 180 because the firing order is altered and the one PU is the injector syn, so if you don't rotate the HEP, it won't know when to sync. That's what I was told, haven't tried to run it without moving the HEP, maybe I should try.

I simply broke off the tabs on the harness connectors so you can swap them without modding anything and ground off the locator on the HEP.

Hmm, nope not buyin' it. Think about it. What is the difference between rotating the HEP and rotating the whole distributor housing? None. Nada. Nichts. Swapping the HEP connectors changes the 'old' ref picjup to the 'new' sync pickup; and vice-versa. You have to move plug wires around anyway, so I don't see that being any reason to rotate the HEP.

Anyway, I'll post the sketches of my low-profile distributor build when I get then done. And pics once I start building it.

if I have to move the HEP 180*, I'll eat my words...

[rbryant]

Hmm, nope not buyin' it. Think about it. What is the difference between rotating the HEP and rotating the whole distributor housing? None. Nada. Nichts. Swapping the HEP connectors changes the 'old' ref picjup to the 'new' sync pickup; and vice-versa. You have to move plug wires around anyway, so I don't see that being any reason to rotate the HEP.

Anyway, I'll post the sketches of my low-profile distributor build when I get then done. And pics once I start building it.

if I have to move the HEP 180*, I'll eat my words...

Look at the HEP its self.

The HEP sensors aren't 180 degrees apart from each other. That means that it is different when not turned 180.

If you don't flip it over and you run it then everything will be off by some degree (probably 10-15 but I didn't measure and this is from memory). Perhaps you can fix that in SW but for guys running stock electronics it would be a problem.

-Rich

---------- Post added at 09:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 AM ----------



And, yes, you do have to move the shutter. I still think this needs to be more precise than maybe Dave's instructions make it. If the shutter is 'off' relative to the rotor, then the rotor will lose contact with the cap before the nend of the dwell period (basically a mechanical dwell limit) resulting in a loss of spark energy. Maybe this is only small, but it is possible if the shutter is not placed precisely.


If you look closely at my picture you can see why it is accurate. It doesn't show well but the shutter holes that don't have rivets in them still slide over the original tabs that I ground the tops off from.

I just grind the tops off from the plastic rivets it leaves 4 tabs on the plastic piece. There are 8 holes in the shutter wheel so you just turn it and push it on over the 4 tabs. Then to hold I drill out the plastic for the other 4 wheels. It is very tight and accurate and is simply turned by 45 degrees or something..

A worn stock distributor where the plastic is loose is much less accurate than my (or other people's) modified ones.

-Rich

[ShelGame]

Look at the HEP its self.

The HEP sensors aren't 180 degrees apart from each other. That means that it is different when not flipped over.

If you don't flip it over and you run it then everything will be off by some degree (probably 10-15 but I didn't measure and this is from memory). Perhaps you can fix that in SW but for guys running stock electronics it would be a problem.

-Rich

---------- Post added at 09:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 AM ----------



If you look closely at my picture you can see why it is accurate. It doesn't show well but the shutter holes that don't have rivets in them still slide over the original tabs that I ground the tops off from.

I just grind the tops off from the plastic rivets it leaves 4 tabs on the plastic piece. There are 8 holes in the shutter wheel so you just turn it and push it on over the 4 tabs. Then to hold I drill out the plastic for the other 4 wheels. It is very tight and accurate and is simply turned by 45 degrees or something..

A worn stock distributor where the plastic is loose is much less accurate than my (or other people's) modified ones.

-Rich

Oh, wait - is it actually FLIPPED over? As in top to bottom? I though he was just turning it 180* in the distributor housing. Hmm, I'll have to look at it again. I don't think the HEP needs to be both flipped and have the connectors swapped. Either one should suffice, I think. How do you actually flip it over? Do you dis-assemble the plastic pieces?

As far as the accuracy, it's the '45 degrees or something..' that I think needs to be more accurate. If it's 45* or 50*, it can make a difference in the actual dwell time. Or, conversely, it can possibly causing arcing if the rotor is not in contact when the coil is powered on. I want to calculate what the actual angle should be and what the limits are. It might be OK per Dave's instructions, but I want to confirm for myself.

[bakes]

There is only one other draw back , when making a cam timing change you have to reset the dis timing again . This got Simon and me at the track one night.

[Juggy]

Oh, wait - is it actually FLIPPED over? As in top to bottom? I though he was just turning it 180* in the distributor housing. Hmm, I'll have to look at it again. I don't think the HEP needs to be both flipped and have the connectors swapped. Either one should suffice, I think. How do you actually flip it over? Do you dis-assemble the plastic pieces?

As far as the accuracy, it's the '45 degrees or something..' that I think needs to be more accurate. If it's 45* or 50*, it can make a difference in the actual dwell time. Or, conversely, it can possibly causing arcing if the rotor is not in contact when the coil is powered on. I want to calculate what the actual angle should be and what the limits are. It might be OK per Dave's instructions, but I want to confirm for myself.


you dont flip the hep over. you rotate it 180 degrees. what rich is trying to tell you, is that the pickups on the HEP, ARE NOT 180 DEGREES APART and THEREFORE you have to move the pickup window and flip the connectors.

if you get a hep and take a look at it, you will see for yourself.....example the fuel and spark are approx 150 degrees apart. if you ran the distributor backwards they will now be 210 degrees apart (360 degree full circle...yada yada....)

hope that makes sense

[rbryant]

you dont flip the hep over. you rotate it 180 degrees. what rich is trying to tell you, is that the pickups on the HEP, ARE NOT 180 DEGREES APART and THEREFORE you have to move the pickup window and flip the connectors.

if you get a hep and take a look at it, you will see for yourself.....example the fuel and spark are approx 150 degrees apart. if you ran the distributor backwards they will now be 210 degrees apart (360 degree full circle...yada yada....)

hope that makes sense

Yes that is what I meant. Flipped was a bad choice of words on my part. I just ninja edited it to replace that with "turned 180." Is there a strikethrough font option anywhere on this so I can edit but still show my original word that I wanted to change?

-Rich

[ShelGame]

you dont flip the hep over. you rotate it 180 degrees. what rich is trying to tell you, is that the pickups on the HEP, ARE NOT 180 DEGREES APART and THEREFORE you have to move the pickup window and flip the connectors.

if you get a hep and take a look at it, you will see for yourself.....example the fuel and spark are approx 150 degrees apart. if you ran the distributor backwards they will now be 210 degrees apart (360 degree full circle...yada yada....)

hope that makes sense

I understand that there is an angle difference between the 2 pickups on the plate. What I'm saying is, it doesn't matter if you turn the HEP or the whole freakin' distributor. Plus the cap, they're the only parts that are mechanically connected to each other. The only difference that makes is which plug wire goes into which hole - which is all f'd up for the reverse rotation anyway.

Swapping the connectors is what makes them in the correct sequence again.



---------- Post added at 02:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:28 PM ----------


Yes that is what I meant. Flipped was a bad choice of words on my part. I just ninja edited it to replace that with "turned 180." Is there a strikethrough font option anywhere on this so I can edit but still show my original word that I wanted to change?

-Rich

I wish, couldn't tell you how many times I've needed to take back what I typed...

[rbryant]

I understand that there is an angle difference between the 2 pickups on the plate. What I'm saying is, it doesn't matter if you turn the HEP or the whole freakin' distributor. Plus the cap, they're the only parts that are mechanically connected to each other. The only difference that makes is which plug wire goes into which hole - which is all f'd up for the reverse rotation anyway.

Swapping the connectors is what makes them in the correct sequence again.



Ok I see what you are saying. If you turn the base 180 it is the same thing as turning the plate 180. The base and HEP do however control which cylinder is connected to which spot on the cap because the HEP has a key in it for the cap .

If you don't turn the plate then the #1 on the cap would not be #1 anymore and you could rename the opposite connections on the cap. This could be confusing to some people because many caps only have the #1 labeled and then it would be wrong.

The firing order is 1-3-4-2 so...

In Dave B's setup you rename the cap from:

Stock:

1 3
2 4

to

David B Reverse Rotation:

1 2
3 4



If you didn't turn the HEP and cap it would be:

Stock:

1 3
2 4

to

ShelGame non turned HEP reverse rotation:

4 3
2 1

And of course to run you would have to turn the base 180 degrees instead of the HEP/cap (which is easy to see in the way I numbered them).

So in Software if you just switched pickup #1 and pickup #2 and rearranged the spark plug wires then it should work.

If you got more radical you could also change the firing order to 1-2-4-3 and maintain the stock number on the cap but it might really mess with the balance of the engine given that it wasn't designed for it. This is not an area that I have studied up on. :)

-Rich

[ShelGame]

Ok I see what you are saying. If you turn the base 180 it is the same thing as turning the plate 180. The base and HEP do however control which cylinder is connected to which spot on the cap because the HEP has a key in it for the cap .

If you don't turn the plate then the #1 on the cap would not be #1 anymore and you could rename the opposite connections on the cap. This could be confusing to some people because many caps only have the #1 labeled and then it would be wrong.

The firing order is 1-3-4-2 so...

In Dave B's setup you rename the cap from:

Stock:

1 3
2 4

to

David B Reverse Rotation:

1 2
3 4



If you didn't turn the HEP and cap it would be:

Stock:

1 3
2 4

to

ShelGame non turned HEP reverse rotation:

4 3
2 1

And of course to run you would have to turn the base 180 degrees instead of the HEP/cap (which is easy to see in the way I numbered them).

So in Software if you just switched pickup #1 and pickup #2 and rearranged the spark plug wires then it should work.

If you got more radical you could also change the firing order to 1-2-4-3 and maintain the stock number on the cap but it might really mess with the balance of the engine given that it wasn't designed for it. This is not an area that I have studied up on. :)

-Rich

Right. I guess I don't care if i have to re-number each position on the cap. Most of the caps I've seen have all 4 numbered anyway. I was planning to just grind the numbers off and mark it myself.

Actually, swapping the pickups in the code shouldn't be too hard at all. They each have a dedicated interrupt, I just have to switch the interrupt vectors and it would be the same as swapping wires.

The Shutter and Rotor would still need to be re-oriented correctly, though. No way around that one with code.

[ShelGame]

Nevermind what I said about the dwell. The rotor position won't affect dwell. But, if it's out of position by too much, it could affect the total spark duration and cause arcing under the cap. I guess it's not as big a deal as I originally thought it might be.

So, on to figuring out how to re-code the SBEC to swap the ref and sync HEP signals...

[rbryant]

The rotor position won't affect dwell. But, if it's out of position by too much, it could affect the total spark duration and cause arcing under the cap. I guess it's not as big a deal as I originally thought it might be.



The rotor tip and terminals are much wider than required so they should be fine even if slightly off when they need to fire. The shutter can also only be moved at 45 degree angles (it has 8 holes in it) so that should also be very accurate.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

Nevermind what I said about the dwell. The rotor position won't affect dwell. But, if it's out of position by too much, it could affect the total spark duration and cause arcing under the cap. I guess it's not as big a deal as I originally thought it might be.

So, on to figuring out how to re-code the SBEC to swap the ref and sync HEP signals...

Your a busy guy, so why bother? Its a 20 sec job to mod the connectors, :p

[ShelGame]

Your a busy guy, so why bother? Its a 20 sec job to mod the connectors, :p

More fun to tweak the code. Besides, I like confusing you with new source code releases :p

[turbovanman²]

More fun to tweak the code. Besides, I like confusing you with new source code releases :p

Gee, thanks, :rolleyes: :p