Dad + turbo wagon + race track = a teenager again

[A.J.]

We took my Dad's '85 Chrysler Town & Country wagon to the track last night. It's got an '88 Turbo I engine with an '88 SMEC and an automatic trans. The build page is here: http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?40225-My-parents-85-Chrysler-T-amp-C-turbo-wagon-build&highlight=. It was an okay night because it was crowded. He was having problems with the column shifter. It's not as smooth as my van. He'd miss second and go into drive. We want to get a floor shifter but are having a hard time finding tan bucket seats. We were running drag radials and it was pulling hard. He was nervous and the adrenaline was pumping. After a few more times and some practice, the wagon should be in the 14's. I raced it twice, just to show him the ropes and my fastest time was 15.9. His fastest time was 15.5 but he red lighted. He's got the time slips. I'll post them later.

http://youtu.be/x8cwguFuwtw

http://youtu.be/fTgjbAcZNxA

A.J.

[bakes]

you found the fountain of youth!!!!

[blk86trbo]

That was fun watching you guys race the Camaro!

[A.J.]

That was fun watching you guys race the Camaro!

89 Shelby CSX racing the same Camaro. http://youtu.be/UDEqz3FQn70 and an SRT-4 Caliber http://youtu.be/R8-DL6otKYI.

A.J.

[blk86trbo]

Hey I watched all your other video's and I'm pretty sure I can hear your Father talking...sounds like he's having a great time, that's so awesome :thumb:

[froggy1944]

A.J. built me a fine little car. I have so much fun with it. The drags were great, I was nervous as hell though. Red lighted a few times, but I'm getting the hang of it. I just didn't want to leave I just wanted to race more. Damn this just gets into your blood. But down the road with a few improvements I think I'll do allright.
A.J.'s Dad

[cordes]

A.J. built me a fine little car. I have so much fun with it. The drags were great, I was nervous as hell though. Red lighted a few times, but I'm getting the hang of it. I just didn't want to leave I just wanted to race more. Damn this just gets into your blood. But down the road with a few improvements I think I'll do allright.
A.J.'s Dad

That's great to hear. Compliments to your grammar teacher too. Nice work.

[R/T]

A.J. built me a fine little car. I have so much fun with it. The drags were great, I was nervous as hell though. Red lighted a few times, but I'm getting the hang of it. I just didn't want to leave I just wanted to race more. Damn this just gets into your blood. But down the road with a few improvements I think I'll do allright.
A.J.'s Dad

"Drag racing is like a drug they don't sell" - Danny Sullivan, Indy Car Champ

The last time I raced my 85 T&C turbo I beat a Z28 AND an SVT Mustang, I hope their friends are still laughing at them....

[1BADVAN]

Awesome I love the look of the wagon going down the track!

[2.216VTurbo]

Great looking launch:thumb: More rear spring would probably help the short times some but it wouldn't look nearly as cool;)

[vntned]

Whats the specs on the CSX?

[A.J.]

Great looking launch:thumb: More rear spring would probably help the short times some but it wouldn't look nearly as cool;)

I have the same problem with my van. I'm thinking air shocks for both. We're not there to look cool. Otherwise we wouldn't be driving station wagons and mini-vans.


Whats the specs on the CSX?

It's a stock '89 VNT except for drag radials and the exhaust is cut off behind the cat. Cutting the exhaust gained 2 p.s.i. of boost and .4 off his previous time giving him 14.1.

A.J.

[vntned]

Wow, thats an impressive VNT! I was curious how to he was getting outta the hole that quick!

[A.J.]

The CSX beating a Nissan 350Z.

http://youtu.be/tcLVvsMp9zo

A.J.

[Vigo]

Looks like the car did pretty well.

Mitsu turbo, right?

What was the boost level?

[A.J.]

Looks like the car did pretty well.

Mitsu turbo, right?

What was the boost level?

Yes it has a Mitsu turbo. It has a TU 3" exhaust and the boost spikes to 15 then settles down to 13. When I was adjusting the fuel cut out eliminator, it felt really good at 17 p.s.i., the couple of times it hit it. I want to put a 3 bar map sensor on it so I can get it back to that. I don't want to put a Garret on there because I'm afraid it's going to lag to much with the automatic transmission. Besides, for the limited track time it's going to see, I think my Dad's going to be happier with the quick spool of the small Mitsu on the street than the better track time, cooler boost, but more lag of the Garret.

A.J.

[vntned]

Garretts arent laggy! 50 Trims are laggy!

[A.J.]

I had the same drivetrain that's in that wagon with an automatic in my van but with a stock Chrysler T-II Garret and it lagged for daaaaaaaaaaaaaays. I hated it. Maybe it was a combination of the weight of the van with the automatic transmission that made it so bad. That same Garret on a 2.5 is awesome. I'm not taking the chance of putting a Garret on the 2.2 and having it lag. I don't have the time to experiment swapping turbos when the Mistu is perfect for the street.

A.J.

[shadow88]

Garretts arent laggy! 50 Trims are laggy!

Depends on the exhaust housing / wheel combo.

[vntned]

I'll agree that the mitsu makes for a nice DD. Almost instant boost(not quite as good as a VNT). Ive always thought a light Lbody with a VNTor mitsu would be hard to keep up with in town. I know my 40trim T04E(Stage1, .68AR) is a bit laggy compared to my buddys Garrett T1, which in turn has a litlle more lag than a mitsu. However my little 40trim hits hella harder than a mitsu!

[Vigo]

I agree with your reasoning about the Mitsu. I also think a garrett 2.2/auto is too laggy.

But, a word of warning. Apparently if you overspin the mitsu (17psi) the rpms get high enough that the turbine fins bend out from centrifugal force and touch the housing, grinding little bits off until the mitsu cant make that 17psi anymore. ShelGame talked about this at some point. He got his mitsu/auto car into the 13s so he'd be one to ask about whether you should run the mitsu that high.

[A.J.]

I'll agree that the mitsu makes for a nice DD. Almost instant boost(not quite as good as a VNT). Ive always thought a light Lbody with a VNTor mitsu would be hard to keep up with in town. I know my 40trim T04E(Stage1, .68AR) is a bit laggy compared to my buddys Garrett T1, which in turn has a litlle more lag than a mitsu. However my little 40trim hits hella harder than a mitsu!

The T-I suck through Garret set-up doesn't have the lag because of the tiny throttle body. A small throttle body is going to give you more low end torque for taking off.


I agree with your reasoning about the Mitsu. I also think a garrett 2.2/auto is too laggy.

But, a word of warning. Apparently if you overspin the mitsu (17psi) the rpms get high enough that the turbine fins bend out from centrifugal force and touch the housing, grinding little bits off until the mitsu cant make that 17psi anymore. ShelGame talked about this at some point. He got his mitsu/auto car into the 13s so he'd be one to ask about whether you should run the mitsu that high.

I was under the impression that you could safely get 20 p.s.i. out of the Mitsu if it's intercooled. If that's not the case, I may set the Granger valve to 15 p.s.i. I can let the boost spike to 17-18 and then settle back down to 15. I'll ask Rob about his findings.

A.J.

[Vigo]

Well, safe for the engine and safe for the turbo are two different things, i suppose. Mitsus are considered disposable and most people just want to get the most out of them that they can until they have an excuse to upgrade (like if the turbo fails...). Since you actually want to keep the mitsu on that motor i think it's more important for you to not break it than it is for most people who cant wait to be rid of it.

Hopefully ShelGame will come in here and elaborate, since i have no idea where i saw him say that stuff and dont know how to search it...

[cordes]

I'm pretty sure we leave the map quickly with the mitsu turbos. I know a lot of folks don't give much credence to them, but it tells me something when I'm half again higher than they printed on there.

[tazaroo]

my 87 auto lebaron has the stock t2 setup garret turbo with 3 inch exhaust and ported exhaust manifold. It does drive well like this but there is still some lack of initial torque causing only a slight bit of lag before boost hits.
Mitsu turbo probably would spoil without lag at all. I am onlly boosting 13lbs or so anyway. Since mine has the garret, I am thinking that adjustable cam gears may get rid of the little lag I have if I can advance the cam timing slightly to lower the power band. Don't know if porting the two piece intake would help any with moderate boost. Since were talking about auto transmission turbo cars in this thread, I don't think we have to worry too much about running out of breath on the top end for a dd since it wouldn't be revved past 5k anyway and lowering the power band should be a good thing in a heavy 2.2 auto. Anyone else have experience with an auto garret.

[A.J.]

Dad's best time as last night.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e301/thebest4/sc00435b9d.jpg

http://youtu.be/mv8Nn05Fa70

I have more videos but it's 2:00 in the morning, four hours past my bedtime.

A.J.

[Vigo]

Good times. What was the boost on those runs?

[A.J.]

Good times. What was the boost on those runs?

13ish psi. It's got a Mitsubishi turbo and a TU 3" exhaust. The boost spikes to 15 psi and settles to 13 psi. I have a cut out eliminator on it. I want to put a 3 bar MAP sensor on it (with the appropriate cal), eliminate the cut out eliminator and raise the boost to 15. It'll spike to 17ish and then settle to 15.

A.J.

[A.J.]

Some more videos from last night.

89 CSX Vs Subaru

http://youtu.be/-zN1N1yW0eY

87 CSX Vs 89 CSX

http://youtu.be/L9FijY9XeU4

85 T&C Vs Infiniti

http://youtu.be/u4UvecCB92s

85 Chrysler wagon Vs Subaru

http://youtu.be/tkAUNt4Tk9Q

86 Omni Vs Infiniti

http://youtu.be/09d-ONS46mI

89 CSX Vs 86 Omni

http://youtu.be/nps31Bo3jVM

A.J.

[2.216VTurbo]

Good night of racing, props to the camera person too:clap: It looked like the T&C had enough on the top to get around the Infinity, then I guess the old aerodynamic as a brick wall physics took over;)

[A.J.]

It was a good night other than the fact the '87 CSX kept spitting out rocker arms. It's a good thing I brought some tools for just in case and a fellow TM'r lives close by to replace the one lifter that came apart. We did get free breakfast out of being Johnny-on-the-spot with the awesomeness.

A.J.

[turbovanman²]

That's awesome, don't know how I missed this thread but full of win, :partywoot:



Yes it has a Mitsu turbo. It has a TU 3" exhaust and the boost spikes to 15 then settles down to 13. When I was adjusting the fuel cut out eliminator, it felt really good at 17 p.s.i., the couple of times it hit it. I want to put a 3 bar map sensor on it so I can get it back to that. I don't want to put a Garret on there because I'm afraid it's going to lag to much with the automatic transmission. Besides, for the limited track time it's going to see, I think my Dad's going to be happier with the quick spool of the small Mitsu on the street than the better track time, cooler boost, but more lag of the Garret.

A.J.

When he gets bored and wants to go faster, you might have too, :eyebrows:



I was under the impression that you could safely get 20 p.s.i. out of the Mitsu if it's intercooled. If that's not the case, I may set the Granger valve to 15 p.s.i. I can let the boost spike to 17-18 and then settle back down to 15. I'll ask Rob about his findings.

A.J.

I don't think you can get 20 psi out of a mitsu.

[A.J.]

I don't think you can get 20 psi out of a mitsu.

I'm not going to push it. I'm going to try for 15 psi. With the small turbo and the large exhaust, the most it'll see is 17 when it spikes, but it doesn't see it for long. If I smoke the turbo I have another.

A.J.

[tryingbe]

How long is the vacuum line from the source to the g-valve to the turbo?

[turbovanman²]

my 87 auto lebaron has the stock t2 setup garret turbo with 3 inch exhaust and ported exhaust manifold. It does drive well like this but there is still some lack of initial torque causing only a slight bit of lag before boost hits.
Mitsu turbo probably would spoil without lag at all. I am onlly boosting 13lbs or so anyway. Since mine has the garret, I am thinking that adjustable cam gears may get rid of the little lag I have if I can advance the cam timing slightly to lower the power band. Don't know if porting the two piece intake would help any with moderate boost. Since were talking about auto transmission turbo cars in this thread, I don't think we have to worry too much about running out of breath on the top end for a dd since it wouldn't be revved past 5k anyway and lowering the power band should be a good thing in a heavy 2.2 auto. Anyone else have experience with an auto garret.

Yes, advancing the cam will help with spool and bottom end if you need more. I put a Garrett on an auto 2.5L van, didn't notice any lag, :nod:

[30 PSI SHADOW]

How long is the vacuum line from the source to the g-valve to the turbo?


Thats a myth. The mitsu has a small wastegate hole. it will always spike unless you port the hole. I run my line inside the car under the steering wheel. No spike at all.

[Vigo]

Thats a myth.

Maybe in the case of the mitsu, but it definitely makes a difference. It's pretty noticeable with the 2-step boost control on my aries.

[tryingbe]

I got this.

http://www.thelostartof.net/tryingbe/dodge/omniproject/100mph.JPG

[A.J.]

How long is the vacuum line from the source to the g-valve to the turbo?

You can see my two grainger valves in this photo on the shock tower.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e301/thebest4/Dad%20catch%20can/DSCF0100.jpg

A.J.

---------- Post added at 07:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:09 PM ----------


I drove though that many times, never had a problem, I also don't speed.


I got this.

http://www.thelostartof.net/tryingbe/dodge/omniproject/100mph.JPG

Interesting.........

A.J.

[turbovanman²]

I have those on the back of my van, :eyebrows:

[Spycker]

good videos!

[A.J.]

I got the 3 BAR MAP sensor wired up and calibrated today. I'm using the '09 SRT-4 Caliber 3 BAR like I did in my van. I left the 2 BAR sensor in and made an adaptor harness incase we're out on the road and the computer craps out, we can get a regular SMEC to get home. It spikes to 17 psi and stays between 15-16 psi. I'm using the 8 valve Maserati cal. Harry (tryingbe) showed me how to compile the template files to bin files in MPTuner. I'm going to take the wide band out of my van and make it so I can put it in any car. Instead of buying an LM-2, I'm just going to buy a $20 10' w.b. O2 cable. We'll be going to the track again in two weeks. I can't wait.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e301/thebest4/DSCF0129-1.jpg

A.J.