HO alternator?

[prepared]

Anyone know of or have experience with a drop in HO alternator for our cars? Specifically my '92 Sundance. I know a 120 is available.

Also found this 170a for $$$$

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PWM-43311/

Are there any available above 120a for a reasonable price that are drop in?

[89FerrariShelby]

I was searching for the last 3 months.

That 170 won't be drop in....

120 is the best your going to find that will drop in. With some work you can find some others...depends how involved you want to get.

[prepared]

I don't mind some work! Better than spending $$$!

1.) It will have to look clean.

2.) I can't remove the A/C

So... what are my options?



That 170 looks VERY similar to the factory 120's. It's definitely different?

[audiomaninc]

There's a place here called Gillette Electric that we get HO alts from. I've got a 160A on my neon that I picked up for about 250 bucks. I've also used Ohio Generator with great luck, but they're a bit on the pricey side and personally I'd rather do business locally.

[turbovanman²]

Anyone know of or have experience with a drop in HO alternator for our cars? Specifically my '92 Sundance. I know a 120 is available.

Also found this 170a for $$$$

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PWM-43311/

Are there any available above 120a for a reasonable price that are drop in?

That will bolt right in, nice find, :amen:

You will have to swap the pulley from your 8 valve unit but big deal.

[prepared]

Still searching for other options.

1.) First thought is something in the 200a range which I could gut and put into one of our stock cases.

2.) Second thought is something in the 200a range for which I could build custom bracketry.

In either case I am looking for something that doesn't cost an arm and a leg - maybe there is something in this range that I could pull from a JY for testing and mounting. Also I am looking for something that will accept one of our pulleys. This I see as the biggest issue. Without the proper pulley, I'm dead in the water.


**Edit: Found another option that looks to bolt in: HERE (http://www.qualitypowerauto.com/catalog.php?item=138) Going to email them to see if I can get a pic of the back side of the J-Mount straight alternator.

[89FerrariShelby]

Wow, i searched for a while and couldn't find anything. you're right, other than a pulley swap that looks like it bolts right in. man do i need to work on my searching skills.

I guess my only question is what are you running that you're worried about needing more than 170? I've got about as much stereo as i can handle sitting in the car and my MAX is 140....(though my 120's not cutting it!!!!). I might return the 120 and get this 170...looks like the same bolting as the daytona....

[prepared]

I'm planning a stereo now and want to be sure I have PLENTY of headroom for anything I might do later on.

[Reeves]

Contact Bryan Lugert. He's on here from time to time. He builds alternators.
His handle on here is Lugert .
His website is www.hawkdecals.com , but it looks like it might be down right now.



**Edit: Found another option that looks to bolt in: HERE (http://www.qualitypowerauto.com/catalog.php?item=138) Going to email them to see if I can get a pic of the back side of the J-Mount straight alternator.

Is that internal regulated?

[prepared]

Contact Bryan Lugert. He's on here from time to time. He builds alternators.
His handle on here is Lugert .
His website is www.hawkdecals.com , but it looks like it might be down right now.



Is that internal regulated?


I haven't heard of Lugert doing anything above 120a.

I haven't received a response to my email request for more information. That's not really a bad sign, as many small shops are better with phone contact. I'll try contacting them tomorrow via phone.

[turbovanman²]

Is that internal regulated?

It says yes but if it fits the models listed, it can't be? :confused:



Advertised Amperage Output 170 amps
Voltage Compatibility 12
Alternator Case Style Chrysler round back
One-Wire Capable No
Pulley Included Yes
Pulley Style Serpentine
Regulator Included No
Regulator Style Internal
Belt Included No
Alternator Brackets Included No
Alternator Finish Natural
Quantity Sold individually.
Notes Also includes 6 groove serpentine pulley. Pulley change may be required on stock v belt applications.

[JDAWG]

I never got a chance to see if the Durango fire truck alt would work on the 2.2/2.5 electronics but it DOES work on my 96 Intrepid, I had to cut off the stock plug and wire in a different one but no biggie. 160amp for $50. The physical mounting on the alternator is the same, the older chrysler was a 2 field wire hook up with studs/nuts, the newer chryslers have a 2 wire plug. http://www.mechman.com/ was gonna do me one for something like $300-350 and 200-250amp 150 at idle.
Another cheaper option would be to use a GM large case 1 wire alt, the bolt holes are right across from each other like the nippo alt, the just run your wire to the batt, no field wires needed

[prepared]

More information on the Durango fire truck alt, please?

HERE (http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/ULT0/050442.oap?year=1998&make=Dodge&model=Durango&vi=1314473&keyword=alternator&pt=01468&ppt=C0330)is a '98 Durango 136 amp alternator, externally regulated. Looks like a bolt in, maybe need minor wiring modifications.

[prepared]

http://www.vicic.com.tw/alternators/vdn11361203.jpg

[prepared]

THIS (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-CARAVAN-160-AMP-1988-89-90-91-92-93-98-ALTERNATOR-/260536557696?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3ca9306080)looks like a 90 amp unit advertised as 160 amp.

And finally this morning, we have autozone part number 12328 which is a denso 160 amp circa 2003. The mounting ears are different, but I wonder if it could be gutted and put into one of our 120a cases?

[JDAWG]

Dodge Durango 01 (and a couple other years I think around there) and HAS to be a 5.9 engine. It was their fire truck/police car package. 4.7 engine wont fit. I had it bolted up on the daytona but didnt get it wired. Not sure if the field wire sense voltage (if thats what you call it) is the same. I got min off www.car-part.com for $50 shipped. If you do this make sure to redo the crappy stock charge wires, all of them, in somethink like 0awg. I use 1/0. I get it on ebay for a guy called coppercableman, its dual jacket and is actually 1/0 unlike cheap brands that have the thick jacket and small wire. Its $100 for 50ft shipped.
If you really need that much juice you might want to look into this too.
http://www.cpgenerator.com/voltageregulators.html
about half way down is an adjustable external that you can max at 15.1v
How much power are you running? I was running a TRUE 1600w rms in my tona and never had voltage drop below 12v with a 120a alt, a Deka Imtimidator AGM, and everything rewired in 1/0

[prepared]

Dodge Durango 01 (and a couple other years I think around there) and HAS to be a 5.9 engine. It was their fire truck/police car package. 4.7 engine wont fit. I had it bolted up on the daytona but didnt get it wired. Not sure if the field wire sense voltage (if thats what you call it) is the same. I got min off www.car-part.com for $50 shipped. If you do this make sure to redo the crappy stock charge wires, all of them, in somethink like 0awg. I use 1/0. I get it on ebay for a guy called coppercableman, its dual jacket and is actually 1/0 unlike cheap brands that have the thick jacket and small wire. Its $100 for 50ft shipped.
If you really need that much juice you might want to look into this too.
http://www.cpgenerator.com/voltageregulators.html
about half way down is an adjustable external that you can max at 15.1v
How much power are you running? I was running a TRUE 1600w rms in my tona and never had voltage drop below 12v with a 120a alt, a Deka Imtimidator AGM, and everything rewired in 1/0

I'm going to hit the local yards this weekend for that 160a alt.

Thanks on the wire link! Once the alt is settled, the wiring will go in. Thinking of running conduit under the car to protect it. Probably dual 1/0 front to rear with the big 3 in 1/0 also.

I'm looking at either two Audiopipe 1500D or Soundstream RUB1.1600D plus a four channel for the components.

[Lugert]

THIS (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-CARAVAN-160-AMP-1988-89-90-91-92-93-98-ALTERNATOR-/260536557696?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3ca9306080)looks like a 90 amp unit advertised as 160 amp.

And finally this morning, we have autozone part number 12328 which is a denso 160 amp circa 2003. The mounting ears are different, but I wonder if it could be gutted and put into one of our 120a cases?

No, will not work.

Also, the alternator pictured about is NOT internally regulated.

[Lugert]

I have NEW 165 Amp units IN STOCK, ready to ship.

$175.00 shipped.

[Lugert]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43Pl9zdc2dU

[turbovanman²]

THIS (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-CARAVAN-160-AMP-1988-89-90-91-92-93-98-ALTERNATOR-/260536557696?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3ca9306080)looks like a 90 amp unit advertised as 160 amp.



That should fit, its for our cars with external regs per say.


I have NEW 165 Amp units IN STOCK, ready to ship.

$175.00 shipped.

Nice, great vid too. :thumb:

[89FerrariShelby]

I never got a chance to see if the Durango fire truck alt would work on the 2.2/2.5 electronics but it DOES work on my 96 Intrepid, I had to cut off the stock plug and wire in a different one but no biggie. 160amp for $50. The physical mounting on the alternator is the same, the older chrysler was a 2 field wire hook up with studs/nuts, the newer chryslers have a 2 wire plug. http://www.mechman.com/ was gonna do me one for something like $300-350 and 200-250amp 150 at idle.
Another cheaper option would be to use a GM large case 1 wire alt, the bolt holes are right across from each other like the nippo alt, the just run your wire to the batt, no field wires needed

If it's not too much trouble could you expound upon the gm alternator option? When i was looking i found a number of more powerful alternators that would most likely fit, but were 1 wire alternators. Since i followed the field terminal wires and they went to what i uneducatedly refer to as "socketed plugs", i was nervous about not attaching them. Are they really not necessary? I wasn't sure what their function was/is, so i didn't want to leave them out.....

[Reeves]

If it's not too much trouble could you expound upon the gm alternator option? When i was looking i found a number of more powerful alternators that would most likely fit, but were 1 wire alternators. Since i followed the field terminal wires and they went to what i uneducatedly refer to as "socketed plugs", i was nervous about not attaching them. Are they really not necessary? I wasn't sure what their function was/is, so i didn't want to leave them out.....

The field wires should go up to your Smec, Sbec, or Power Module depending on what year the car is.

Lugert made me a internal regulated Nippodenso style alternator (120 amp) for my OMNI.

[89FerrariShelby]

The field wires should go up to your Smec, Sbec, or Power Module depending on what year the car is.

Lugert made me a internal regulated Nippodenso style alternator (120 amp) for my OMNI.

So they would be necessary? They supply power to those things i'm guessing (it's an 89).

I have a 120, its not cutting it.

I pm'ed him about the 160 he posted about, hope to hear back soon. Guess i'm just curious and trying to learn, as i've posted, electrical matters are way beyond me, but i'm trying.....

[Lugert]

So they would be necessary? They supply power to those things i'm guessing (it's an 89).

I have a 120, its not cutting it.

I pm'ed him about the 160 he posted about, hope to hear back soon. Guess i'm just curious and trying to learn, as i've posted, electrical matters are way beyond me, but i'm trying.....

You already have a response. :nod:

To make the 160 work you will need two things.
- Ground
- Field (Comes from Computer)

You can put in an external regulator out of a 1970's Chrysler
Or I can make the alternator internally regulated like I did for James.
You would only need a switched 12v power source to give power to the regulator. (Great for race cars, because you can actually "turn off" the alternator)

[prepared]

Hey Lugert,

In that video, the aligator clip you're holding... that's exciting the field, right? You're not flowing 160 amps through that little thing are ya?

[turbovanman²]

Hey Lugert,

In that video, the aligator clip you're holding... that's exciting the field, right? You're not flowing 160 amps through that little thing are ya?

No, he's powering up the field wires or internal reg, no way that tiny wire would take 160 amps, :o

[Lugert]

Exactly.
I was on the road, and for some reason my phone will not post to the forum.

[JDAWG]

I'm looking at either two Audiopipe 1500D or Soundstream RUB1.1600D plus a four channel for the components.

thats cool, what subs you gonna run on 3000w? What batteries are you going to run? Cause you are gonna need probably 3 or so big AGM batteries with that kind of power. You are going to need alot of reserve capacity only running a 160a alt, you might want to go ahead and bump up to a 200-250a alt. Im running a 160a alt on 2000w in my intrepid and I got some bad dimming, nothing below 12v but it was pretty noticable. But I need to finish the Big 3 and drop in my other Deka G31 in the trunk. Im kind of at a stand still anyways though cause I blew up my sub and Im waiting on some funds to buy some parts so I can build it into an 18.

[prepared]

Well the previous system was just a kicker CVR on a kicker 400.1. I had it in a 2.25 slot port tuned to 40 hz. Was absolutely great for rock / hair metal!!

Then I am reminiscing with an old friend and we ended up putting in some old school miami bass. It hit well below the port tune and without a subsonic filter... well, thats that.

So this time I want to go BIG. I'd love to run two of those amps to some BIG DC Audio subs, but if 160a is the biggest I can reliably go with my alternator, then I could run ONE of those amps to power two DC LVL4 12's dual-4 wired @ 1 ohm total load.

[JDAWG]

Well the previous system was just a kicker CVR on a kicker 400.1. I had it in a 2.25 slot port tuned to 40 hz. Was absolutely great for rock / hair metal!!

Then I am reminiscing with an old friend and we ended up putting in some old school miami bass. It hit well below the port tune and without a subsonic filter... well, thats that.

So this time I want to go BIG. I'd love to run two of those amps to some BIG DC Audio subs, but if 160a is the biggest I can reliably go with my alternator, then I could run ONE of those amps to power two DC LVL4 12's dual-4 wired @ 1 ohm total load.

yea a 160a wont support 3000w reasonably without a few batteries, like a agm under the hood and 2 in the back, you may squeeze it out if you have a G31 but I doubt it. You may have voltage there at first but wangin on it for a while you will notice you voltage drop a little then a little, then you are below 12 and you are blowin up subs/amps. I would feel more comftorable with a 160a alt and 2000w with 2 batteries. With the big 3 done in 1/0 and 1/0 front to back you should be ok.
You can deff get a bigger alt then 160a but how much do you want to spend? $350 on an alt? If so then you could be in the 250a range and you should be ok. If not then I wouldnt run 3000w, no reason to buy all that stuff then low volt it and fry FETs.
As far as a GM alt, it should bolt, of course you may need a pulley swap, big deal, you just wont use your factory field wires, it may throw a code or you CEL may stay on though. But all you need is the wire from the alt to the batt. Maybe go to the bone yard and measure across the bolt holes and make sure its close enough.

[Reeves]

For you two guys running BIG power amps.....would a new style Jacobs VoltMaster work, or is it still not enough? I guess it would still kill the battery too quick, driving down the voltage till it's dead.


Also, a question for the altenator professionals.....how big of a ground do you need on your alt? I mean, does it have to be big as well, or just enough to make the regulator work?

Edit:
Whoops....it's called Accuvolt.....
Here's a website:
http://www.jacobselectronics.com.au/

[Lugert]

Both Ground and Positive should be Big!

[Reeves]

Both Ground and Positive should be Big!

I may not have been clear when I explained it. I mean the ground to JUST the alternator. It needs to be BIG as well?

[JDAWG]

For you two guys running BIG power amps.....would a new style Jacobs VoltMaster work, or is it still not enough? I guess it would still kill the battery too quick, driving down the voltage till it's dead.


Also, a question for the altenator professionals.....how big of a ground do you need on your alt? I mean, does it have to be big as well, or just enough to make the regulator work?

Edit:
Whoops....it's called Accuvolt.....
Here's a website:
http://www.jacobselectronics.com.au/

the accuvolt seems like a transformer/capacitor combined. In your case it may work. For a large stereo it deff would die. I can tell you that NOBODY in the car audio competition circuit uses one. But maybe for a drag only car it may be ok. You use a internally regulated alt right? I would just get a adjustable external regulator and set it to whatever. But be careful, dont know how much voltage all the old wireing and electronics can take on these cars. You might see some smoke above 15v. I know guys that run 16v daily but they have all newer cars. Honestly the way they market it (I read an article about 4wd truck and extra lights) I wouldnt use it anyways. In that case I would have a HO alt, upgraded wiring, and a couple batteries and then you will NEVER run into a problem. On my tona I dropped in a AGM battery and upgraded all the wiring, it had a 120a alt stock, and with all the lights on it idled at 14.6v.

As for your alt ground, I would run 0 gauge, it cant hurt anything, just go from the case to the frame. I was talking to a guy with a huge stereo once and he was having problems, had a 250a alt, a few batteries, etc. He ended up just grounding his alt case to the frame and found his missing volt, which audio related can translate to a few hundred watts and a DB on the meter.

edit- especially on our crap alternator mounting, the only ground it gets it through a few bolts. and brackets, for some dumb reason they though that rubber bushings make a good ground lol

[prepared]

For you two guys running BIG power amps.....would a new style Jacobs VoltMaster work, or is it still not enough? I guess it would still kill the battery too quick, driving down the voltage till it's dead.


Also, a question for the altenator professionals.....how big of a ground do you need on your alt? I mean, does it have to be big as well, or just enough to make the regulator work?

Edit:
Whoops....it's called Accuvolt.....
Here's a website:
http://www.jacobselectronics.com.au/

the "Big Three" upgrade means improving the current capacity of three cables: 1) alternator positive to battery positive, 2) battery negative to chassis, and 3) engine ground to chassis

Personally, I try to leave the factory wire and add at least 0 gauge to it. Since our alternators are rubber mounted, the negative from the batter goes to a splice and then to the alternator and the engine, so for us it's more of a Big 3.5

[Reeves]

You use a internally regulated alt right?

Not yet. I still have it on my bench waiting to be installed. I currently have one of Lugert's beautiful 90 amp alts.



As for your alt ground, I would run 0 gauge, it cant hurt anything, just go from the case to the frame. I was talking to a guy with a huge stereo once and he was having problems, had a 250a alt, a few batteries, etc. He ended up just grounding his alt case to the frame and found his missing volt, which audio related can translate to a few hundred watts and a DB on the meter.

edit- especially on our crap alternator mounting, the only ground it gets it through a few bolts. and brackets, for some dumb reason they though that rubber bushings make a good ground lol


Oh yeah...duh....I started thinking about it and it HAS to have a big ground.

Our factory wiring harness has the ground going from battery, to head, and spliced to alternator. I've replaced the ground from the battery to the head, but not to the alternator yet. I'll upgrade that when I make my new front engine wiring harness that includes a BIG ground for the alternator, a BIG power wire from alternator, and my new electric water pump wires from relay.

Come to think of it.....maybe I'll just run a BIG ground wire from the block or alternator mounting bracket to the alternator, instead of like the factory one was. It might be shorter/cleaner looking.

I have a older style accuvolt that is 16volt output and 25amp. I was thinking of using it for my ignition and fuel pump. Then, maybe I could kill the alternator when at wot for 11 seconds or less.

[JDAWG]

the "Big Three" upgrade means improving the current capacity of three cables: 1) alternator positive to battery positive, 2) battery negative to chassis, and 3) engine ground to chassis

Personally, I try to leave the factory wire and add at least 0 gauge to it. Since our alternators are rubber mounted, the negative from the batter goes to a splice and then to the alternator and the engine, so for us it's more of a Big 3.5

I buy a dual terminal bettery, just leave the stock stuff, then get universal side post terminals for $5 and add my own, batt to frame, alt to batt, block to farme, I also do the manifold to firewall, just replace the steel braid wire, adding alt to frame or to block ( I prefer frame) cant hurt anything and like I said up there probably helps cause rubber bushings are not a good ground lol, that long bolt goin thru with washers on eash end really sucks for a good ground. Check it out with the meter. A good ground should be .5 ohm or less, sometimes this is really difficult to find in an engine bay, too many variables and different types of metal bolted together. This is another eason why nobody runs an accuvolt on competition. I know guys that run 8 runs of pos and 8 runs of neg to their battery banks and have 3 or or 4 alts and NO fuses. Anything in the wire adds resistance, even splices, that could mean losing a competition. But in your case reeves for drag racing it shouldnt be a problem. But an easier solution would be a simple adjustable voltage regulator.