TS header worth it on a non TS turbo?

[turbovanman²]

Wondering if getting a TS header built is worth it if using a non TS turbo. I know that getting one built obviously makes adding a TS turbo easier later on but are there any benefits to it? Thanks, discuss, :p

[CSX153]

i dont think it matters. only a ts turbo and a non ts header i was told would make it spool slower

[turbovanman²]

Well using a TS turbo with a regular manifold will spool like a regular turbo, negating the TS effects.

[turbovanman²]

Anyone? guess I'll have to go ask on another forum, :(

[1BADVAN]

forgive my ignorance but what is TS??

[BadAssPerformance]

TS = Twin Scroll

Pretty sure you gotta have the header and turbine housing both set up for TS to get the true benefits of seperating the exhaust pulses.

[Speedeuphoria]

TS by definition points to the turbine so without that you just have a header/turbo

agreeing w/ JT

[turbovanman²]

TS is where the header cylinders are paired so that the pulses aren't battling each other. In our case, you want cylinders 1+4, 2+3, like this-

http://www.frsport.com/Tomei-193086-Nissan-SR20DET-EXPREME-Turbo-Exhaust-Manifold-Kit_p_1538.html

[OmniLuvr]

i would say, if your going to BUILD a header, and plan on going TS later, then make a TS header. if you are undecided, i would stick with what you have for now...

[turbovanman²]

i would say, if your going to BUILD a header, and plan on going TS later, then make a TS header. if you are undecided, i would stick with what you have for now...

That's my stumbling block, I don't know if I will need to go TS unless my GT35R doesn't do the job, then a TS HX35 goes on, sigh!

[OmniLuvr]

i guess if your going to make a header, just make it TS, then mock up the gt35 and the holset so they will both work in the same location on the header. i cant see a TS header being that bad of a thing, because they will merge into one in the turbine housing, you will have a better flowing header, and you will have the added pulse benifit when going to TS turbine housing.

im in the same boat now, dont know if i want to buy an hy and have a 4 to 1 header built (my friend is gonna hook me up, but hes only gonna weld one for me, i get to cut and fit) or use my wh1c and make a TS header. im only shootin for 400 hp, so thats my problem, do you think your gt35 isnt gonna be enough to make the power you want, or do you want the quicker spool of a TS header and turbine with the top end of the hx?

[turbovanman²]

Yeah, not sure if the GT35R will work, it should but I want a header this year, its not going back together without one, so its either a regular header or a TS one, price difference of $650, lol. So that's the other thing, is the price worth it for a non TS turbo?

[OmniLuvr]

so your going for quicker spool and top end or just quicker spool?

[turbovanman²]

so your going for quicker spool and top end or just quicker spool?

Both, :nod:

I know even just a basic header on my engine will be worth some faster spool and better top end, but I am also putting some nice cams in so that will help too. I shouldn't spend the money on the header but can if it came down to it. What to do, lol.

[zin]

I imagine that it wouldn't hurt, and would help if you did use a TS turbo. Ideally, on a non-TS turbo you would run your tubes in sequence of firing, either clockwise or counter, resulting in a smooth flow of pulses to the turbine. However, IIRC, the TS works best when the pulses are as far apart as possible... It seems that if you optimize a header for one style, you loose on the other... Just another case where you can't have your cake and eat it too! Unless my understanding of optimizing a header for a TS is wrong... (could happen!:D)

Mike

PS Even if you "mismatch", you still have the more efficient flow a header provides, just not the "extra" the matched design would allow...

[turbovanman²]

It will help if I use a TS turbo, that's the whole reason for pairing the cylinders like I posted. The question of the day is, will it make a difference on a non TS turbo, that's the $650 question, :eyebrows:

[zin]

It will help if I use a TS turbo, that's the whole reason for pairing the cylinders like I posted. The question of the day is, will it make a difference on a non TS turbo, that's the $650 question, :eyebrows:

My point was that a non-TS turbo should like a sequential header, where as a TS would want cylinders to be paired, and in a way that they could not be made to be sequential. In either case, you get much better performance compared to the stock manifold, however, the "extra" performance an optimized header (sequential for non-TS, paired for TS) would be lost if an "un-matched" turbo were to be used.

Now for the $650.00 answer (IMHO), for $650.00 I think you could have a header built and/or get more "bang for your buck" investing it elsewhere.

Just my .02

Mike

[puppet]

Look at it this way ... the whole idea of a paired header is to keep exhaust pulses separated right up to the turbine. This promotes a pulse driven turbo. Any time you have a divided header dumping into a larger area the pulses get negated. They combine to form a pressure wave. This promotes a pressure driven turbo ... like our stock set-ups.

Both work ... one may have additional advantages over the other .. depends on the overall set-up (fueling, head flow, cams/timing etc). Point is, mixing and matching the two tech's to drive the turbine doesn't make sense when you think about it. I would not invest the effort into a paired header only to connect it to a non-divided housing. Reason is that the pulse effect will disappear as soon as the flow hit the housing area. So, why bother.

It may in fact make it worse because the exhaust flow doesn't have a chance to even out before it comes in contact with the turbine. Boost rise might become erratic and choppy. I'd think you'd want a portion of the header length to collect and convert pulses to an even pressure flow going into a conventional housing. A place where the gases can expand a bit and funnel down into the housing picking up velocity again.

... just my take on it.

[turbovanman²]

Interesting point. Ok, so I'll just build a cheap non TS header for now, then if I need to go TS, I'll build the right header.

[OmniLuvr]

but dont you already have an hx35? and its gonna cost you 650 to rebuild the gt? i would put the 650 into a TS header and run the holset...

[turbovanman²]

but dont you already have an hx35? and its gonna cost you 650 to rebuild the gt? i would put the 650 into a TS header and run the holset...

Already running the GT35R but need a new cartridge, $400. Its easier and faster to run the GT again but the HX35 seems to be the new turbo of choice. So I was going to run the HX as I didn't want to buy another GT turbo but Garrett has an exchange program, pretty cool.