Tranny swap nightmare

[3Bar_Mopar]

George (moparman76_69) and I have been trying to get my auto 2.5 car swapped over to an A520 manual since Saturday.

First, we had a heck of a time getting the trans onto the engine...once the input shaft finally went into the clutch, everything seemed like it was seated properly with no gaps between the engine and trans on the top and the front. Lo and behold after all the top and front bell housing bolts were tightened, there was a small gap between the block and trans where the rear bell housing bolt hole is under that pain-in-the---- starter bolt....there's a dowel/guide there that seems to be keeping the block and trans from coming all the way together. I couldn't even get the bolt started. Also, the engine spun fine with a breaker bar until I tightened the starter down...then it was bound up tight, so the starter was keeping the flywheel from turning.

Tonight (Sunday), we pulled the trans back down and double checked that the clutch was centered and pressure plate was torqued properly, trying to figure out why the trans wouldn't seat fully. We had another horrible time getting the trans mounted up again but managed to get the trans seated and a couple bell housing bolts in but loose. That's where we are at this point.

Any advise, help or suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated. This has been a royal pain in the --- so far and the next step may be dropping the engine whole to get the trans seated properly or knocking out the dowel pins since that's what seems to be causing the problems. We haven't even done the pedals, ran a clutch cable or installed the K frame yet. Progress has stopped with this mess.

[BLUEBALL]

You dont happen to have a dowel stuck in the trans from the previous car and a dowel in the current block do you? Double dowling i guess you could say

[3Bar_Mopar]

You dont happen to have a dowel stuck in the trans from the previous car and a dowel in the current block do you? Double dowling i guess you could say

Good question! I'm going to check that out....I didn't know they could get stuck in the trans.

[1FastCSX289]

Definitely check to see that there isnt a stuck dowel pin. Are you using a clutch alignment tool or just eyeballing the alignment? Using an alignment tool will help get the clutch plate centered, but get your eye right in there and make sure the splines are centered up in relation to the pressure plate. Also, rotating the crank around as you try to line up input shaft to the clutch plate will help if the splines arent quite lining up.

[t3rse]

Definitely check to see that there isnt a stuck dowel pin. Are you using a clutch alignment tool or just eyeballing the alignment? Using an alignment tool will help get the clutch plate centered, but get your eye right in there and make sure the splines are centered up in relation to the pressure plate. Also, rotating the crank around as you try to line up input shaft to the clutch plate will help if the splines arent quite lining up.

I stick in axle stubs and rotate the diff as I slide it on (trans in gear of course).

[3Bar_Mopar]

You dont happen to have a dowel stuck in the trans from the previous car and a dowel in the current block do you? Double dowling i guess you could say

Thank you very much!! That was it. The one dowel on the back of the block from the old motor was stuck in the trans. I tapped out the dowel in my engine and everything went back together easy as hell! That little dowel kicked our butts for two days! Now all that's left is the K frame, rack, pedals and attaching the shifter cables and clutch cables...:thumb:

EDIT: I have a question...

Will I be OK if I use a stock A520 with a brand new stock clutch on this car with the mods I have? I don't want to burn through the clutch really fast and I'm worried.
My mods are: 2.5 with E1 Garrett turbo on 20 pounds, '88 TBI cam, 52mm TB, Daytona IC, 3 Bar cal, open DP with 2.75555" swing valve, Flex Fuel injectors, accufab, ported head and manifolds, gutted interior and solid engine mounts.

I've been running this setup for a while with a bone stock A413. The trans slipped pretty good, but manually shifting seemed to help and I think the fact that my car is gutted and so light helped it live. This is in a Pbody.

[moparman76_69]

The one dowel on the back of the block from the old motor was stuck in the trans.

Yeah I feel pretty dumb on that now.

[86Shelby]

As long as you don't abuse it and break in the clutch properly it should treat you well. If you run slicks regularly you may want to rethink your clutch choice.

[BLUEBALL]

Whew,glad ya got it taken care of. The hard part is only suppose to be gettin the pedals swapped under dash:nod:. Slicks will not be good on the stock clutch after a couple passes. Make sure you let it cool down between runs w/DRs or street tires. TU seems to have plenty of good clutches to choose from. Seems like that question shoulda been asked while trans was out though:confused:lol

[3Bar_Mopar]

Whew,glad ya got it taken care of. The hard part is only suppose to be gettin the pedals swapped under dash:nod:. Slicks will not be good on the stock clutch after a couple passes. Make sure you let it cool down between runs w/DRs or street tires. TU seems to have plenty of good clutches to choose from. Seems like that question shoulda been asked while trans was out though:confused:lol

Well, true enough, but seeing as how I'm broke as a joke right now and George had a brand new stocker that was going to go into the other Sundance...I figured I could use it. I'll probably get something a lot beefier at some point, especially since I'll be getting a front mount, meth injection and running 25 pounds in the somewhat short-term future.

[1FastCSX289]

I stick in axle stubs and rotate the diff as I slide it on (trans in gear of course).

Thats a good idea! More than one way to skin the proverbial cat, eh?

OP....glad you got it squared away!

[moparman76_69]

Whew,glad ya got it taken care of. The hard part is only suppose to be gettin the pedals swapped under dash:nod:. Slicks will not be good on the stock clutch after a couple passes. Make sure you let it cool down between runs w/DRs or street tires. TU seems to have plenty of good clutches to choose from. Seems like that question shoulda been asked while trans was out though:confused:lol

No joke, it'd help if somebody didn't snap the nut off the pedal shaft. He better make that clutch last cause I really don't want to do this again.

[shackwrrr]

I just got done with my swap. I think the hardest part was getting rid of all the auto crap. I just did the pin swap for the pedal.

I have a question for you though. How close are your shifter cables to the exhaust? Mine are kinda close and I drilled right in the 2 dimples that I thought were the right ones since there were about 7 in one little spot.

[3Bar_Mopar]

I just got done with my swap. I think the hardest part was getting rid of all the auto crap. I just did the pin swap for the pedal.

I have a question for you though. How close are your shifter cables to the exhaust? Mine are kinda close and I drilled right in the 2 dimples that I thought were the right ones since there were about 7 in one little spot.

Mine are close too. I drilled about a 2 inch hole and ran both cables through. The "front-to-back" cable is close to my down pipe. The dimples on mine were 3 in a diagonal row. I set the pilot bit on the middle one and drilled a hole with the hole saw. I have a big hole there now. I need to fill it in somehow, lol.

[shackwrrr]

thanks for the reply. Anyone else with an original manual car want to take pics or explain how close your cables are to your exhaust. I think I am going to get some heat resistant sleeve for over the cables.

[turbo84voyager]

Just curious, since you only changed the rod / pedal how are you going to adjust the cable? I recently did a swap in my shadow and I had to change the entire assembly because of the bracket.

[shackwrrr]

I installed a stop in the front of the pedal. To adjust all you have to do is reach up under the dash and grab the belcrank and pull it back then either lower or raise the pedal to where you want it

[135sohc]

thanks for the reply. Anyone else with an original manual car want to take pics or explain how close your cables are to your exhaust. I think I am going to get some heat resistant sleeve for over the cables.

They are very close to the exhaust. I have mine held further away with zipties going to the steering rack.

[moparman76_69]

thanks for the reply. Anyone else with an original manual car want to take pics or explain how close your cables are to your exhaust. I think I am going to get some heat resistant sleeve for over the cables.

I pulled a 523 out of a shadow that was a TBI car and one of the cables was melted by the exhaust, I have a feeling that's why the car was there even though I hope not cause it was in really good shape otherwise.


Just curious, since you only changed the rod / pedal how are you going to adjust the cable? I recently did a swap in my shadow and I had to change the entire assembly because of the bracket.

There wasn't a difference between the pedal boxes, we double checked thinking there would be a stop.

[3Bar_Mopar]

My speedometer's not working...I pulled off the cluster today to see why and the cable was snapped off in the socket on the back of the cluster. I think I broke it when I was trying to get enough slack in the cable to attach it to the trans. I probably pulled it too hard, lol. I'll need a new speedometer cable and possibly a new cluster since there's a tiny piece broken off in the socket and I don't know if I can get it out.
Also...the idle stays around 2K until I come to a complete stop....I think that's because it's still got an automatic computer.

[moparman76_69]

My speedometer's not working...I pulled off the cluster today to see why and the cable was snapped off in the socket on the back of the cluster. I think I broke it when I was trying to get enough slack in the cable to attach it to the trans. I probably pulled it too hard, lol. I'll need a new speedometer cable and possibly a new cluster since there's a tiny piece broken off in the socket and I don't know if I can get it out.
Also...the idle stays around 2K until I come to a complete stop....I think that's because it's still got an automatic computer.

The tach doesn't run off the computer, you can come get the cluster and cable though.

[86seeS]

does it rev up high when you push in the cluch? if so check IAS sensor

[3Bar_Mopar]

does it rev up high when you push in the cluch? if so check IAS sensor

It just stays high...it doesn't go any higher when I push on the clutch.

[86seeS]

id still check ias dosent matter auto or manual same ecu"s

[3Bar_Mopar]

I had to go to the north side of Indy today and the car ran great on the highway. I have no idea how fast I was going but I was keeping up with traffic..the tach was between 2 and 3K RPM in 5th and would pull pretty good with less boost and a lot less effort than the automatic from that speed.

I boosted about 12 pounds once in 4th and it pulled pretty hard...enough that it's too much for traffic. 20 pounds is going to be awesome!! Otherwise, I've only got on it hard enough to blow off between a shift once....I hope I'm taking it easy enough.

The idle is strange though. When I started to leave the north side, I started the car and it almost seemed like it wanted to die right at first...then the high idle started being intermittent instead of all the time.

Is it safe to disconnect the IAS on a manual car?

[3Bar_Mopar]

id still check ias dosent matter auto or manual same ecu"s

Well, it was fine before the swap...plus those torx bolts are a pain to get off.

[RoadWarrior222]

I'll need a new speedometer cable and possibly a new cluster since there's a tiny piece broken off in the socket and I don't know if I can get it out.

You can try a magnet, or a pin stuck to a magnet. The cables are steel so should be magnetic, but I've seen some with brass ends on.

[3Bar_Mopar]

Stock clutch slips in 5th. Rolled onto the gas from about a 65 roll at around 15 psi and it flared a bit like a slipping auto car...nothing major but I'm gonna need to start looking for a better clutch! :o

[BLUEBALL]

Well that was quick,need a clutch already. Did it get to break in yet?

[3Bar_Mopar]

Well that was quick,need a clutch already. Did it get to break in yet?

I believe so. I've driven the car everywhere taking it really easy since the swap was done and only started to give it some actual boost in the last 3 or 4 days...it's been 2 weeks and 3 days since the trans was put in.

I don't really NEED need a clutch yet as long as I take it easy, but like I said, it does slip a little in 5th and I haven't gone WOT yet at all. I believe I'm making a little north of 300 w/tq on the current setup so yeah....stocker's rated at what, 200 lb/ft max?
I romped on it a couple days ago and spun through 3rd and some of 4th on the street. It pulled wayyy harder than my old auto at WOT.

[BLUEBALL]

Bummer,at least its a driveable:nod:

[3Bar_Mopar]

Bummer,at least its a driveable:nod:

Yeah, I won't be able to do any 20 PSI pulls probably, but I can still thrash it a little. ;)