Custom Lbody dual pivot Kframe Group Buy?

[rbryant]

All,

I have had a few emails asking about making another one of my dual pivot lbody kframes.

Shown in a KC article here: http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/vbarticles.php?do=article&articleid=98

I talked to the person that made it and he said he could make a batch of them if people are seriously interested. He owns a large fabrication company and has several very skilled welders to do the work.

I don't have the pricing on them yet but I assume it will be inline with the amount of time it takes to make them plus the cost of pulling and buying the core kframes from the junkyard (ensures 100% rust free and avoids shipping).

We will also require a liability waiver due to the nature of cutting a kframe in half and rewelding it. The waiver may include a clause that it is intended for off road use so that no 3rd party can come after us. These will be as strong as stock but there are way too many trial lawyers out there. It is important to protect against some lawyer putting up a stink about a modified parts contribution to an accident if there were a bad accident with one of the cars using one.


I would also like to get a pre-payment before works starts because they aren't something I can inventory if people bail out. The turnaround time should be only a few weeks.





Edit 10/29/10:

The first 11 frames have been completed and delivered.

Pricing for additional frames is:

Kframe and Control Arms:
$520 for the frame plus $60 shipping = $580.

Swaybar Modifications:
$130 for an rod end link swaybar modificatoin plus $20 shipping = $150.

All components come powdercoated semigloss black.


Turnaround time will be 2-3 weeks for new orders.

They can be ordered here: http://rbryant.freeshell.org/kframe_buy.htm

-Rich



-

[zin]

All,

I have had a few emails asking about making another one of my dual pivot lbody kframes.

Shown in a KC article here: http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/vbarticles.php?do=article&articleid=98

I talked to the person that made it and he said he could make a batch of them if people are seriously interested. He owns a large fabrication company and has several very skilled welders to do the work.

I don't have the pricing on them yet but I assume it will be inline with the amount of time it takes to make them plus the cost of pulling and buying the core kframes from the junkyard (ensures 100% rust free and avoids shipping).

We will also require a liability waiver due to the nature of cutting a kframe in half and rewelding it. The waiver may include a clause that it is intended for off road use so that no 3rd party can come after us. These will be as strong as stock but there are way too many trial lawyers out there. It is important to protect against some lawyer putting up a stink about a modified parts contribution to an accident if there were a bad accident with one of the cars using one.



Are there 5 people that are seriously interested so that we can do a group buy?


I would also like to get a pre-payment before works starts because they aren't something I can inventory if people bail out. The turnaround time should be only a few weeks.

Lets start the tentative list:

1) Badger
2)
3)
4)
5)



-Rich

Not to derail or side track this part, but what about making one from tube? It seems like he'll need to make a jig anyway... I suppose cost is the real deal breaker though... Just thought I'd throw that out there while there was still time to change, if it would make sense.

Mike

[rbryant]

Not to derail or side track this part, but what about making one from tube? It seems like he'll need to make a jig anyway... I suppose cost is the real deal breaker though... Just thought I'd throw that out there while there was still time to change, if it would make sense.

Mike

Show me 5 people willing to pay for it and it can be done. Fabrication guys have more time on their hands than usual in this economy so it is an opportunity to get things done.

Call me a skeptic but I don't see enough demand for full tube kframes. If there is then they could probably be done for the GJKHPA cars too.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

Price on a van tube K-member? :p

I'll tell 4cefedomni about this, he would probably be interested.

[zin]

Show me 5 people willing to pay for it and it can be done. Fabrication guys have more time on their hands than usual in this economy so it is an opportunity to get things done.

Call me a skeptic but I don't see enough demand for full tube kframes. If there is then they could probably be done for the GJKHPA cars too.

-Rich

I bring it up because, while I'm interested in one as well, I was figuring on building my own from tube, once I had a jig made to fit a stocker... If there are 5 (or more) people interested in buying a modded unit, I have to wonder how many would be willing to "step-up" to a tube version... Though, like I said, I imagine the cost is up there due to the lack of a "core", and the need to buy tube...

Sorry, I had to ask, otherwise I'd be wondering for the rest of my days..

Mike

[rbryant]

Price on a van tube K-member? :p

I'll tell 4cefedomni about this, he would probably be interested.

Hmm I almost think you are serious...

It would probably be about the same they are only a couple inches wider.

Are the mounting tabs the same distance from front to back on the van? If so then it isn't a big difference.

Anyway it isn't any more far fetched than the idea of doing them in general. :)

-Rich

[rbryant]

I bring it up because, while I'm interested in one as well, I was figuring on building my own from tube, once I had a jig made to fit a stocker... If there are 5 (or more) people interested in buying a modded unit, I have to wonder how many would be willing to "step-up" to a tube version... Though, like I said, I imagine the cost is up there due to the lack of a "core", and the need to buy tube...

Sorry, I had to ask, otherwise I'd be wondering for the rest of my days..

Mike

No problem asking is always good.

I never would have thought that I would actually get enough people together to make camber plates and that happened...

The jig would be a lot more complex for the full tube frame though. The modified frame jig is more or less just for the frame mounts. The full tube one would also have to deal with the control arm connections, steering rack connections, etc. It might or might not be worth the weight savings.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

Hmm I almost think you are serious...

It would probably be about the same they are only a couple inches wider.

Are the mounting tabs the same distance from front to back on the van? If so then it isn't a big difference.

Anyway it isn't any more far fetched than the idea of doing them in general. :)

-Rich

Hahahhaaa, I am almost serious, :p

I can measure the ears, pretty sure they are identical to a car one but wider of course.

[iTurbo]

Hell yeah count me in.

[GLHNSLHT2]

depends on the price, I need 2 of them.

[T-Bohn]

hey guys

could you please explain what the advantage of this k frame would be?

What other parts would need to be changed to put this to use?

this is all new to me...

[rbryant]

hey guys

could you please explain what the advantage of this k frame would be?

What other parts would need to be changed to put this to use?

this is all new to me...

The newer dual pivot control arms (stamped or cast) gives less suspension bind than the older style control arms which really have one pivot point and one oddly angled twist point.

The binding of the early control arms stops the spring and strut from doing their job properly. The dual pivot arms have much less of a problem with that.

High quality replacement polyurethane bushings available for both types now so many people with non lbody cars are switching to the dual pivot frames.

The problem with the lbody is that they never made such a kframe for the lbody so the newer control arms can't be used. The idea here is to create the kframe that all of the other cars got for an lbody so that the better control arms and suspension parts can be used.



Either stamped (89/90) or Cast (91+) GJKHPA body control arms can be used with these.

I did have the dual pivot cast arms on my charger and I didn't have any problems but the fender clearance was really tight because the cast arms move the ball joint forward about 10-12mm

The stamped dual pivot arms are 2.25lbs lighter than the cast ones and give more fender clearance so I recently changed to the stamped ones. When using camber/caster plates the extra caster from the cast control arms isn't a real advantage so I decided that the stamped arms are a better choice for me.


I believe that it makes the cars handle better and get more traction. It is probably best that other people also give their 2 cents so I don't just sound like I am marketing a product.


-Rich

[T-Bohn]

ok i searched and have lots of reading to do...


at the moment I am feeling like this is a bigger project than I can manage.

I have done the poly bushings all around the car. I have a 1 1/4 front bar that I will do a heim conversion on with polybushings and then mate that to the caravan arms i have. Then the plan is to add your camber plates and see how that runs.

The neon shock conversion also looked to be too big a job.

i will keep reading and watching this!!

thankyou!

[cordes]

Depending on price I may be interested. I'm cheap though.

[zin]

Depending on price I may be interested. I'm cheap though.

That goes for me too!:D

Mike

[rbryant]

That goes for me too!:D

Mike

Hehe we are all cheap here. And people want me to make tubular versions... ;)

It might take until the middle of next week to get the price all worked out.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

Hehe we are all cheap here. And people want me to make tubular versions... ;)

It might take until the middle of next week to get the price all worked out.

-Rich

But if the price is reasonable and you get a big enough order for the tubular, then yeah, :amen:

Basically they are all the same, just wider for vans, and not so much for L body's, :p

[rbryant]

But if the price is reasonable and you get a big enough order for the tubular, then yeah, :amen:

Basically they are all the same, just wider for vans, and not so much for L body's, :p

Yea well if we do a tubular one it will be easy enough to do one for all of the widths.

He has built a full tube chasis before so it is just a matter of him having time and/or interest. There are some other modifications that can be done to improve the suspension geometry with a tube frame like raising the pivot points upward to improve roll center but it takes lots of development work.

-Rich

[zin]

Hehe we are all cheap here. And people want me to make tubular versions... ;)

-Rich

I'm starting to think we are more suckers for a good deal, I know I am!

Mike

[87DaytonaPac]

I'd also be interested in two of these if the price is right. Got two Rampages to restore...

[bakes]

It is the price that would hold me back right now .

[GLHNSLHT2]

depends on the price, I need 2 of them. 1 has to have a 5spd mount too.

[rbryant]

1 has to have a 5spd mount too.

They will probably all come with 5spd mounts in the newer 520/555/523/568 locatoin.

Hopefully nobody serious enough to do this mod would be running a 525.

-Rich

[Badger]

is there a price yet Rich?? Seems thats what everyones waiting for before committing.

[iTurbo]

Will be running A525 here. If it's a big problem to add the mount I can do it myself too, no biggie.

[rbryant]

is there a price yet Rich?? Seems thats what everyones waiting for before committing.

I am working on it. We need to source some cores locally, etc.

I want to wait until the price is actually known rather than guessing when it might change.

-Rich

[Badger]

where might the cores come from? Someone you know have a good stash?

Badger......

[rbryant]

where might the cores come from? Someone you know have a good stash?

Badger......

There is a large pick and pull near his shop that will have lots of them. It is ust a matter of pricing and pulling them and how much time that takes and how much he has to pay someone to do it.

-Rich

[Mario]

Have you asked about the tubular ones yet?

[rbryant]

Have you asked about the tubular ones yet?

We talked about it a little but we would need to do the work on the modified frames first to get a reasonable starting point.

The timeframe for doing a tubular frame would be much later for both pricing and fabrication.

My plans for this are to just hand the work to him rather than try to take a share of the profits middle man style so it has to happen on his time.

-Rich

[GLHS121]

I'm also interested and still run a 525 and all stock suspension pieces. Will all this still work?

Jimmy

[rbryant]

I'm also interested and still run a 525 and all stock suspension pieces. Will all this still work?

Jimmy

At a minimum you would need the dual pivot control arms.

IMO it would be better to upgrade the transmission before doing this modification but it isn't really necessary.

We can put the dogbone mount in the 525 location or even have both dogbone mount brackets.

-Rich

[Badger]

glad Im not the only one that is interested in these!!

[Badger]

any updates Rich?

[rbryant]

any updates Rich?

No. :)

I will try to touch base with him tomorrow. We were supposed to meet up last week to talk about this project and some others but it never happened.

-Rich

[GLHS121]

I need a k-frame in a bad way here. What would it take for you to get a hold of one of these stock k-frames and ship it to me? I'm tired of driving the no-power Mitsubishi!

Jimmy

[4cefedomni]

I'm in for one if the price is right.
Would these use the dual pivot style knuckles?

[rbryant]

I need a k-frame in a bad way here. What would it take for you to get a hold of one of these stock k-frames and ship it to me? I'm tired of driving the no-power Mitsubishi!

Jimmy

I am sure that you can find one locally that would be a better option for anything except the lbody.

Just look for any 89+ GJKHP car and you will find the dual pivot frame.

-Rich

[rbryant]

I'm in for one if the price is right.
Would these use the dual pivot style knuckles?

Any frame/control arm setup can use any year knuckle.

That being said, yes I recommend the later style ones.

The strut/knuckles will have to be the right widths though. So if you are using lbody struts you would have to mill the knuckles down to the narrower width.

-Rich

[W.P._Turbocars]

If I purchased one I would also prefer tube but I need it to be able to clear a transfer case and driveshaft. ;)

[rich tideswell]

If I purchased one I would also prefer tube but I need it to be able to clear a transfer case and driveshaft. ;)

i think the guy that built the gold AWD glh-t using minivan parts was usung the stock l-body k-member, just notched out to clear the t-case.

[minigts]

I'll sign up for a tube version. I practically begged and tried to bribe Slowe to make a K member like he did for his car. I'd spend the extra money to get a tube version.

[turbovanman²]

The benefit of a tube one is it can be made to accomodate any car/van quite easily, thus killing alot of birds with one stone, :p

[rampage_stu]

whats the word on these k frames? Mine on my rampage is busted and bent, must replace. Maybe even a rough estimate of a price, are we looking 100-200 or 300+ any idea would help

[rbryant]

whats the word on these k frames? Mine on my rampage is busted and bent, must replace. Maybe even a rough estimate of a price, are we looking 100-200 or 300+ any idea would help

The boss is getting some time estimates from welders. We also need to include the charge of a core in the price. Shipping will also be rather high on these considering the weight and bulk. Hopefully we can get a cost in the next few days.

We have decided that this cost of cores at local junkyards will be similar to the cost of shipping a core. We will not accept non local cores but will instead simply purchase them from a local junkyard to avoid the hassle of shipping.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

The boss is getting some time estimates from welders. We also need to include the charge of a core in the price. Shipping will also be rather high on these considering the weight and bulk. Hopefully we can get a cost in the next few days.

We have decided that this cost of cores at local junkyards will be similar to the cost of shipping a core. We will not accept non local cores but will instead simply purchase them from a local junkyard to avoid the hassle of shipping.

-Rich


I guess with all the 91+ cars, there should be a good supply.

Any estimate on the tube ones, I think those would be a better option, no cores and shipping would be considerably less, :eyebrows:

[rbryant]

I guess with all the 91+ cars, there should be a good supply.

Any estimate on the tube ones, I think those would be a better option, no cores and shipping would be considerably less, :eyebrows:

No updates on possible tube frames. It will be quite a while before they would be done. I can ask about them after we get a price on the modified ones.

But fabrication costs would be much much higher.

I think they would still be pretty expensive to ship. At some point it becaomes a problem of bulk rather than weight. I bet the tube one would still be fairly heavy too.

If the tube ones are ever done they will take a lot more design work. It wouldn't be worth doing them unless the geometries were improved.

-Rich

[Badger]

looking foward to hearing more Rich!

[rbryant]

We have to see what we can do on the cores. I am hoping that we can get them for $50 but the first quote I saw was for $80 so we need to shop around a little or work out a bulk deal.

I think the labor would be around $225 for them so it will probably be $275-300 plus shipping for the narrowed frames depending on core costs.

Unfortunately shipping will probably be $75-80 (which is why we don't think it is worth mailing a core).

-Rich

[rbryant]

I guess the costs are too much for most people to stomach.


I can probably get them down $25 or so but to get the price down $50 I would need to have 10 made.

So they can probably be done for $200 plus frame costs plus shipping but unless we get 10 orders that is probably the cheapest.

Tube frame prices would be well over a thousand so I don't see that happening so if people are holding out for those it just isn't realistic.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

For modding the stockers, the price is very reasonable. $1000 for a tube one, yeah, a bit much, lol.

[iTurbo]

Well I'm still interested!

[rbryant]

For modding the stockers, the price is very reasonable. $1000 for a tube one, yeah, a bit much, lol.

Yea even in high volume I see them ranging all the way from $500 to $1400 for muscle cars.

The development cost is the killer. If someone did it for themselves as a hobby and then wanted to sell them that would be the only way we would ever get such a product.

Just look at how much work DJ has into just the control arms...

-Rich

[Badger]

still very interested Rich.......please keep the updates coming!

[GLHNSLHT2]

still interested though debating if I want to put the time into my Lbody project at all.

[Badger]

so Rich, whats the price gonna be on a non-tube one......any idea yet?

[rbryant]

so Rich, whats the price gonna be on a non-tube one......any idea yet?

$200 in labor plus a frame core charge (~$60) plus shipping (~$75) if we can get 5 people.

That makes it around $335 total. I am not the one welding it so it is a little out of my control.

-Rich

[amoparacer]

Hey rich I would like one and I think a friend of yours and mine could pick it up for delivery would that be possible.

[DOHCRT]

Hey Rich, I will take one of these. I can supply a core also. I am out of town right now and won't be back until the 14th of June. Let me know when you need the cash and core.

__________________
Vic in Phoenix

dohcrt@cox.net

92 Spirit R/T
89 CSX
89 CSX
88 CSX-T TIII
87 CSX
84 Rampage TII
97 Ram Diesel
69 Dart GT 'Vert

[Aries_Turbo]

that aint a bad price at all. if i had a l-body, id be tempted.

Brian

[rbryant]

Hey Rich, I will take one of these. I can supply a core also. I am out of town right now and won't be back until the 14th of June. Let me know when you need the cash and core.


Vic,

Sounds good.

I am out of town this weekend anyway and wouldn't do much with this project before the next weekend.

If you have more cores I can take them as an additional discount off the price aswell so I don't have to go to the yard and get them (which I don't want to do). :)

The big problem with cores is shipping but if people can deliver them to me locally then that is great!

-Rich

[Badger]

Rich,
still interested in this but.......I dont have a core.

[rbryant]

Rich,
still interested in this but.......I dont have a core.

It looks like there is someone that can get some cores for me. I just have to figure out how much the cores will cost.

I think there is a half off day at a large local junkyard this weekend too.

-Rich

[Badger]

Rich,
any updates??

[rbryant]

Rich,
any updates??

They aren't done yet. ;)

I had considered going to the junkyard to get some cores but it was 110 degrees out on Saturday so I just wasn't up for it.


Vic said he has some cores locally so I want to work with him to keep the costs down. He was out of town last week but should be back shortly.

Hopefully we can get started on things this week.

-Rich

[cordes]

They aren't done yet. ;)

I had considered going to the junkyard to get some cores but it was 110 degrees out on Saturday so I just wasn't up for it.


Vic said he has some cores locally so I want to work with him to keep the costs down. He was out of town last week but should be back shortly.

Hopefully we can get started on things this week.

-Rich

Only 110*? Child's play.

[rbryant]

The Kframe cores are being collected today. Vic is going to do the work for us and the core for a kframe with swaybar and control arms is running around $70. I would also like to give Vic some credit toward his frame for getting the cores for everyone so that needs to be included in the costs.


We plan on delivering them to the fabricator today or tomorrow.

I would like to start collecting deposits for them now.

If you are in for one of these please send me $150 to "rich_bryant_is @ yahoo.com"

The deposit will be used to cover the core charges plus setup fees. Once we have them done the balance will be due before delivery/shipping.

I expect the final cost to remain around $300 plus shipping which would include control arms.

Thanks,

Rich

[4cefedomni]

Payment sent!
I can't wait to see these:evil:

[2.216VTurbo]

Deposit sent:thumb:

[rbryant]

Thanks for the deposits so far. Please keep them coming I will get these finished as quickly as I can.

The cores have been delivered but it looks like our JIG from a few years back was lost or recycled. I will just pull my kframe and take it over to the shop to duplicate it so they are guaranteed to fit (my car is slightly disassembled anyway).

We also gathered some control arms and swaybars. They added a little to the core costs and probably shipping so we will have them available as addon options. I think most people will need them anyway though.

-Rich

[4cefedomni]

What size sway bar? I was thinking of just getting a polybushings 1 1/4" endlink style one for mine. And I might have a set of dual pivot control arms already from a previous car.

[rbryant]

What size sway bar? I was thinking of just getting a polybushings 1 1/4" endlink style one for mine. And I might have a set of dual pivot control arms already from a previous car.

They would just be the stock 90+ sized swaybars. I think they are 1 1/8" and can be cut down to work with the narrowed frame.

I have a custom poly bushings swaybar on mine which is 1.5" shorter than his normal dual pivot bar. The 1.5" shorter probably wasn't needed but I wanted to do it so that it matched as closely as possible with the normal bar.

Johnny was easy to work with on it and the price was pretty much the same as the normal bar.

-Rich

[iTurbo]

Deposit sent.

[rbryant]

It is a nice pleasant surprise to see so many people putting down deposits it really helps make the projects possible. I can do more things like this when I don't have to front all of the cash myself. :)

It is good to see that people are putting down some real commitment on these.

We should be able to get the fabrication going this week and I might even have to go and get a couple more cores if the deposits keep coming in.

-Rich

[Badger]

Rich,
deposit sent! =)

[rbryant]

Quick update...

The jig from making my kframe was recycled so they don't have it anymore....

We therefore thought it best to pull my kframe off from the car so we can make a direct copy of it. It took me a few days to get a chance to remove it but I got it out this weekend and dropped it off today at lunch.

They plan on getting the jig setup today and starting to build copies tomorrow. This way there will be no question as to whether they fit or not.

Sorry for the delay...


-Rich

[rbryant]

So how many of you guys that sent deposits want to spend the extra cash to get the frames and control arms powdercoated?

If you are interested I can get a quote.

-Rich

[Badger]

maybe me but as of now I don't have the control arms I need. Not to mention the other stuff.

[zin]

So how many of you guys that sent deposits want to spend the extra cash to get the frames and control arms powdercoated?

If you are interested I can get a quote.

-Rich

I'm interested, but have yet to send a deposit... Must have missed the call out for that... Would these be the stamped of forged arms?

Mike

PS Is there a link for the deposit?

[omni_840]

Is this a one time GB? or will you do another run in the future?

[rbryant]

Is this a one time GB? or will you do another run in the future?

I don't plan on doing a future run. These are actually a lot of work to do in collecting cores and the shipping is going to be an even bigger pain so I want to do a bunch of them at a time.

I would want to get 5+ more if we were to do an additional group buy in the future so I would suggest getting one now.

-Rich

[rbryant]

I'm interested, but have yet to send a deposit... Must have missed the call out for that... Would these be the stamped of forged arms?

Mike


The plan is to do mostly stamped arms. 4 of the 5 cores we already have are stamped arms and one is cast. Both can work but the cast arms are really close to the fender extensions on a shelby charger so I wanted to avoid that issue. The stamped arms are also about 2.25lbs lighter each!



PS Is there a link for the deposit?

I will make a link for a deposit today. Before then you can just paypal me to my email (rich_bryant_is (at) yahoo.com). If you do it as a gift that would be best since then I wouldn't get charged the paypal fee for a deposit.

If you guys still want in please let me know now. All of the cores we gathered are currently spoken for so I would have to collect more.


-Rich

[rbryant]

maybe me but as of now I don't have the control arms I need. Not to mention the other stuff.

We have some control arms and swaybars that we got with the cores so don't worry about it I can add either or both for a small fee and slightly more shipping.

Shipping wont matter to you if we can find a way to hand deliver them to all of you SoCal guys.

-Rich

[iTurbo]

I would like the powder coating if at all possible! Preferably a semi-gloss black.

[87DaytonaPac]

Rich,

I still want one of these but I won't have the deposit money for a few more days. Can you still reserve me one and I'll get you paid by Friday?

--Paul

[zin]

OK, looks like I'll be in for one, maybe two... My Brother is in Japan right now, but I think he'd like one for his 86 GLHS...

If we are going to do it, powder coating just seems to make sense and should be quite a bit cheaper than doing it on a one-off basis... And for something like this, the semi-gloss black is a no-brainer IMHO.:D

Mike

PS If possible, I think I'd like to get one cast and one stamped, if they fit properly on an Omni that is...

[rbryant]

OK, looks like I'll be in for one, maybe two... My Brother is in Japan right now, but I think he'd like one for his 86 GLHS...

If we are going to do it, powder coating just seems to make sense and should be quite a bit cheaper than doing it on a one-off basis... And for something like this, the semi-gloss black is a no-brainer IMHO.:D

Mike

PS If possible, I think I'd like to get one cast and one stamped, if they fit properly on an Omni that is...

Yea semi-gloss black seems like the best (and probably only) option.

Considering that I had to pull mine all out I figured it makes sense to drop it by the powdercoat shop before it goes back in. Paint just doesn't stick to the factory coating very well...

-Rich

[rbryant]

It looks like people will want 2-3 more. I am going to be out of town next week starting Saturday morning so I won't be able to go and get them myself. I will check and see if the guys at the shop want to get a few more. Or if Vic does.

How many of you want control arms?

How about swaybars? We will have to cut them down slightly but the stock ones should work. Johnny can also make custom ones as he did for me.

If you have your own control arms then that makes shipping and cores cheaper. I will probably powdercoat the ones I get though so that is one plus of us getting them all at once. I just don't want to have a ton of control arms and swaybars laying around if people only want the frames.

If you have your deposit in or are going to shortly please PM me with if you want control arms (and which type) and if you want a swaybar or if you will be getting one elsewhere.

-Rich

[Force Fed Mopar]

Can you not use L-body swaybars?

[rbryant]

Rich,

I still want one of these but I won't have the deposit money for a few more days. Can you still reserve me one and I'll get you paid by Friday?

--Paul

Please get it to me as fast as you can. I don't want to take deposits from some people and then let others get away without putting one down as it just isn't fair. :)

Right now I only have enough core frames to cover the deposits so there will probably be some delay in getting the late comers frames done. The guys at the shop might be able to run and get some cores but the price might be higher than the first few that Vic went and got.

Either way Vic or the guys at the fab shop need to be paid to go and get cores. The first batch took about 1.5 hours each to pull because they were on cars (with tires) and not just sitting on the ground and that sucks when it is 105 degrees out here. It really sucks when the car is jacked up and still has tires on it at a pick and pull yard where there are no air tools....

-Rich

[rbryant]

Can you not use L-body swaybars?

Dual pivot swaybars are different than the old style swaybars.

Edit:

I talked to Johnny about this and it turns out that all 3 control arm variants have different swaybars.

The 88 and older, 89/90, and 91+ swaybars are all different...

So... We can shorten the stock style swaybars and make them work or...

Johnny can make a custom bar to fit the application (basically daytona bars that are 1.5" narrower in the center).

When he did mine there wasn't significant charge to modify the bars to match this application... I will probably also be selling my cast arm bar because I switched to the stamped arms so at least one is already done and can be had for a discount. :)

-Rich

[Force Fed Mopar]

The 89-90 stamped arms should accept it just fine, they use the old-style square swaybar end bushings. I remember that from when I had the k-frame out of my Lebaron.

The cast arms use a round bushing instead of the square ones, but I don't know that the sway bar itself is shaped any different. Now that I think about it, I have a GLHS swaybar, a '87 Daytona swaybar and a '93 P-body swaybar all hanging in the rafters of my shop, I'll lay them all out tonight and report back :)

[4cefedomni]

Put me down for the k frame and stamped control arms, powdercoated please:thumb:

I'm gonna talk to Johnny about getting a 1 1/4 bar made up for it.

[rbryant]

The 89-90 stamped arms should accept it just fine, they use the old-style square swaybar end bushings. I remember that from when I had the k-frame out of my Lebaron.

The cast arms use a round bushing instead of the square ones, but I don't know that the sway bar itself is shaped any different. Now that I think about it, I have a GLHS swaybar, a '87 Daytona swaybar and a '93 P-body swaybar all hanging in the rafters of my shop, I'll lay them all out tonight and report back :)

The GLHS and 87 Daytona bars should be pretty similar but the 93 bar will be shaped differently.

I know that it is possible to run a 87 and older daytona bar on an lbody if you cut about .5" off from each end of the bar. I am pretty sure I tried to run an 89 1.25" daytona bar on my cast armed kframe and it didn't fit. Perhaps I should have kept it so that I could try it with the stamped arms... that was 3-4 years ago when I didn't know as much about these things....


If you think about it the 93 bar has to be different because the ball joint is moved forward.

The 88/89 bar is the one that I don't know much about.

With end links there is some margin for error but with the stock bushings they have to be pretty much perfect.

I would strongly recommend running end links with these. The stock outer bushings really aren't a good setup and after spending the time and effort to fix the geometries using stock outer bushings that bind up seems like a waste. at a minimum the stock style swaybars should be converted to an end link bar.


-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Please get it to me as fast as you can. I don't want to take deposits from some people and then let others get away without putting one down as it just isn't fair. :)

-Rich

Ok thanks Rich. I'll get the deposit by Friday. I'll also be interested in the stamped arms and a swaybar. Don't need powdercoating though as it seems like it would just get chipped up in shipping.

--Paul

[Force Fed Mopar]

Here's pics of the 3 bars I have. GLHS bar is the smallest one, the middle bar is the '93 Duster bar, rear is the '87 Daytona Shelby Z bar.

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=23235&d=1277784330

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=23236&stc=1&d=1277784361



I have a feeling if you use the stamped arms, you can use a L-body bar. I have a Daytona CS bar on my stock GLHS k-frame and control arms right now, that AFAIK hasn't been trimmed at all. So I don't see why it won't work vice versa also.

[rbryant]

Here's pics of the 3 bars I have. GLHS bar is the smallest one, the middle bar is the '93 Duster bar, rear is the '87 Daytona Shelby Z bar.

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=23235&d=1277784330

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=23236&stc=1&d=1277784361



I have a feeling if you use the stamped arms, you can use a L-body bar. I have a Daytona CS bar on my stock GLHS k-frame and control arms right now, that AFAIK hasn't been trimmed at all. So I don't see why it won't work vice versa also.

Hey thanks for taking the pictures that gives people a good idea of what we are talking about!

I have stamped and cast bars at on the core kframes but it is all the way accross town so I can't get pictures right now.

The stock lbody bar won't work with cast arms but I haven't tried it with the stamped ones.

I also don't have a stock lbody bar to try anymore...

It would basically push the arms in by .75" on both sides so if they are already at the point where it is parallel to the bushing then the wider bar will work. That is why the Daytona CS bar can be used on an lbody.

If you can balance the lbody bar directly on top of the daytona bar then we can see what I mean by how shorter is ok. Now if we just had someone with a 89 bar and an lbody bar handy...

-Rich

[Force Fed Mopar]

Hmm, daytonaboys is close to me and has a '89 CS, maybe I could talk him into pulling the swaybar out one day to compare with :eyebrows:

[rbryant]

Hmm, daytonaboys is close to me and has a '89 CS, maybe I could talk him into pulling the swaybar out one day to compare with :eyebrows:

The more documentation the better.

We still need to finish a detailed control arm KC article with pictures so we should also have swaybar pics to go with it.

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Rich,

Deposit sent.

--Paul

[rbryant]

Rich,

Deposit sent.

--Paul

Thanks man.

They started cutting the frames to take out the center yesterday and hopefully will start welding and modifying the passenger front towers today.

Unfortunately I am out of town next week so I won't be able to ship them until after the 9th.

I also need to gather a couple more cores now to cover you latecomers...

-Rich

[rbryant]

BTW I am assuming that everyone that orders one of these will be running either a newer style tranny (520/555/523/568) or an automatic.

I plan on making them with the newer tranny mount position not the 525 position. These things should never touch a 525! ;)

-Rich

[Force Fed Mopar]

Talked to daytonaboys, next week we are pulling the swaybar out of his '89 CS to compare with the others.

[omni_840]

Deposit sent!

Sorry for being a late comer:o

[rbryant]

I called the company that usually offers the cheapest powdercoating around here.

Powdercoating for the frame is around $50 and the control arms are around $15 each. This includes sandblasting them and coating so they should turn out really nice.

Based on that swaybars would probably be another $15-20 unfortunately I forgot to ask. :(

That means the coating the frame and control arms would add ~$80.

Coating the frame, control arms, and swaybar would add $90-100

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Dumb question: With these frames and the stamped arms, what knuckles should be used?

Never mind - just reread the thread and the answer in here.

[rbryant]

Dumb question: With these frames and the stamped arms, what knuckles should be used?

Never mind - just reread the thread and the answer in here.

Which ever ones you want... :)

I like the 91+ knuckles with daytona style struts but there are lots of combinations that all work.

-Rich

[Badger]

ok...so is the powdercoating optional or mandatory? Any advantage (other then looks) to the powdercoating?

[johnl]

I'm in; that is unless I'm too late.

[rbryant]

ok...so is the powdercoating optional or mandatory? Any advantage (other then looks) to the powdercoating?

Optional. The advantage is cosmetic but the welds need to be covered with something and paint doesn't stick to these very well unless they are sandblasted anyway. I carefully painted mine a while back and it is slowly peeling.

I would recommend coating the frame and leaving the arms and swaybar bare if you are looking to save money.

-Rich

[Badger]

Rich,
ok then, put me down for coating on everything please.

[rbryant]

Update on core costs:

The first batch of cores from the junkyard were $70 for frame, control arms, and swaybar. Vic is pulling these for me and I am going to give him $30 for getting each frame from the junkyards making the cost $100 even.

We now need to get 3-4 more frames so if we can get them from the same yard they will also be $100 each. If that yard doesn't have any more we may have to go somewhere else and the price might increase to $110 or $115.

Given that it is 110 degrees out I think $30 is a low price to pay. The shipping on a full setup will probably be $100 anyway and this way they are 100% Arizona rust free for welding. If you do not require a swaybar from me we can remove $10 from the core charge (and shipping will be cheaper).


That means:

$225 for the fab work + $100 core = $325

Powdercoating will be

$50 for the frame
$30 for the control arms
$20 for the swaybar.

Full setup powdercoated with stock style swaybar is $425

I recommend coating atleast the frame and almost want to make that a requirement unless someone really feels strongly about it. The control arms and swaybar can be optional which would save $50.



I am working on an Adjustable heim link end link option for the swaybars or larger fully custom swaybars can also be purchase from Johnny if you want something larger than stock. Costs on the swaybar upgrades haven't been determined yet.

Shipping will be actual costs but expect that to be $75 or more. If you are in Arizona or SoCal we can arrange delivery/pickup.

Thanks for understanding on the prices taking time to settle out!

-Rich

[Badger]

I personally think the powdercoating on the frame should be required and not an option. Based on what Rich said in an earlier post.

[2.216VTurbo]

I'd actually prefer to add some gusseting to the frame like I've done to others. It may be overkill with these DP frames but if some is good, more is better right?:thumb: It's tough to weld to a powdercoated frame/arms but I suppose I could grind the weld areas...

[rbryant]

I'd actually prefer to add some gusseting to the frame like I've done to others. It may be overkill with these DP frames but if some is good, more is better right?:thumb: It's tough to weld to a powdercoated frame/arms but I suppose I could grind the weld areas...

They are so much stronger than an lbody frame that it isn't really necessary but I am ok with that.

If you want it completely unfinished so you can do additional welding then that is actually fine. What you will get is a raw frame that will require paint or your own sandblasting and coating.

I am just don't want to hand rattle can painting them because I don't like the results and I don't want to sandblast them just to paint them.

Either they are powdercoated or you sandblast and paint/coat it yourself. :)

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Well, those prices for sandblasting & powdercoating are pretty good compared to what I'd pay locally so put me down for the full monty.

[DOHCRT]

Alan, Got pix or a better description of the gusseting you have done?

Vic in Phoenix

92 Spirit R/T
89 CSX
89 CSX (For Parts?)
88 CSX-TIII
87 CSX
87 Shelby Lancer (Parts For Sale)
84 Rampage TII
97 Ram Diesel
69 Dart GT 'Vert
73 Dart Sport (For Sale)


I'd actually prefer to add some gusseting to the frame like I've done to others. It may be overkill with these DP frames but if some is good, more is better right?:thumb: It's tough to weld to a powdercoated frame/arms but I suppose I could grind the weld areas...

[2.216VTurbo]

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27554&highlight=4+hours+welding

Actually Rich, I'll pay for the sandblasting please if you send me a raw, blasted frame ready to weld, that would be ideal:thumb:

Vic, you da man for sourcing our cores:hail:







Alan, Got pix or a better description of the gusseting you have done?

Vic in Phoenix

92 Spirit R/T
89 CSX
89 CSX (For Parts?)
88 CSX-TIII
87 CSX
87 Shelby Lancer (Parts For Sale)
84 Rampage TII
97 Ram Diesel
69 Dart GT 'Vert
73 Dart Sport (For Sale)

[rampage]

am I too late for this group buy?

[DOHCRT]

I picked up 4 more cores today. You guys got lucky the price didn't change as I was able to source them from the same place I got them last time. I'm not sure I will be able to get any more for a while, due to other things I need to get done, not to mention pulling the K-members in 105+ degrees is not the easiest thing. :faint:Tell your friends so we can get a final count and see if we need to get any more. I will be heading to the sand show in El Cahon? in Sep, so I could bring all of the finished ones for the guys in Cali...( I'm thinking a beer per...):cool:

Vic in Phoenix

92 Spirit R/T
89 CSX
89 CSX (For Parts?)
88 CSX-TIII
87 CSX
87 Shelby Lancer (Parts for Sale)
84 Rampage TII
97 Ram (Buzzin Half Dozen)
69 Dart GT 'Vert
73 Dart Sport (For Sale)

[rampage]

Where do I send deposit?

[rbryant]

http://www.turbo-mopar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27554&highlight=4+hours+welding

Actually Rich, I'll pay for the sandblasting please if you send me a raw, blasted frame ready to weld, that would be ideal:thumb:

Vic, you da man for sourcing our cores:hail:
I am still out of town so my reply are slow this week from the phone...

The prob with sandblasting is that the powdercoat company does it so I am not sure about doing it without coating.

[rbryant]

Where do I send deposit?
Paypal: rich_bryant_is@yahoo.com

Or
Rich bryant
5522 w. Cindy st.
Chandler, az 85226

[Nemesismachine]

Believe that is supposed to be Chandler, AZ

[rbryant]

Believe that is supposed to be Chandler, AZ

Correct...

I really hate the predictive text on phones sometimes... It must have changed the az to the word as. I just fixed it so it won't confuse anyone.

-Rich

[rbryant]

I just talked to Vic and he pointed out an important issue with powdercoating control arms....

The ball joints and control arm bushings will have to be pressed out in order to powdercoat them. The bushings could probably be left in assuming that people will replace them anyway. Of course the ball joints also should be replaced but they are more complex to deal with.

Leaving the ball joints in would likely damage them so the new ones would have to be pressed in afterwards. We could leave the old ones in and require that they be replaced (in order to save the cost of pressing them out) but then there is risk of chipping the powdercoat when replacing the ball joint. Even if we press them out the new joint would still have to be pressed in and there is some risk of chipping the powdercoat.

So if people are ok with the arms arriving with ball joints that have been destroyed and need to be replaced then we can just send them through. If not then there will be extra costs. The estimate on just pressing them out is around $15 for a pair.

I am not interested in replacing all of the ball joints. People will probably want varying quality (cost) of joints, etc and it is just a big headache for us.

The other option that I am leaning toward is that we can just send them bare as cores that need to be rebuilt.

-Rich

[johnl]

Rich -

Good point - on the ball joints and bushings.

You're being too nice - giving people a choice. I don't think me, or anyone else for that matter, wants unknown condition junk yard bushings and ball joints in their new parts - even if they opt out of powder coating.

The only issue is whether I pay to press them out before they're built/coated or after. So . . . . please press mine out (assuming that's OK by you) and be sure that the powder coater folks mask the inside so I don't have to clean the powder coat out before pressing in the new ones.

[iTurbo]

Rich, I already sent my deposit but I would just like to add that I want everything; K-frame, stamped arms, and sway bar, plus the powder coating on everything.

I would hope the old ball joints and bushings would be removed before the blasting/coating process. Anybody that is going to invest in this setup should get new ball joints and poly bushings installed afterwards. I would think most of us would be perfectly OK with receiving bare parts. Plus it is very easy for just about anybody to install new bushings and ball joints.

[rbryant]

Rich, I already sent my deposit but I would just like to add that I want everything; K-frame, stamped arms, and sway bar, plus the powder coating on everything.

I would hope the old ball joints and bushings would be removed before the blasting/coating process. Anybody that is going to invest in this setup should get new ball joints and poly bushings installed afterwards. I would think most of us would be perfectly OK with receiving bare parts. Plus it is very easy for just about anybody to install new bushings and ball joints.

Yea I think there will only be 2 options:

1) Pay to press them out and mask/powdercoat
2) Don't coat.

If we left the old ones in with plans of pressing them out later it would probably chip the PC when they were pressed out so it isn't really an option.

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Okay this isn't making sense to me. Would it even be possible to powder coat the arms with bushings and greasy ball joints in them? I'd think the rubber and grease would burn wouldn't it? I know my PC guy would refuse to coat anything that wasn't bare and clean.

My vote is no PC on the arms. I'd very likely just end up chipping the sh!t out of them replacing the bushings and ball joints anyhow.

[rbryant]

Okay this isn't making sense to me. Would it even be possible to powder coat the arms with bushings and greasy ball joints in them? I'd think the rubber and grease would burn wouldn't it? I know my PC guy would refuse to coat anything that wasn't bare and clean.


They usually soak them in some sort of super industrial degreaser but it might be cheaper to just take them out and sand blast them.



My vote is no PC on the arms. I'd very likely just end up chipping the sh!t out of them replacing the bushings and ball joints anyhow.

Yea I am concerned about that too. I suppose we could also just mask the press in area so everything but that area is powdercoated but that would also cost a few bucks.

-Rich

[johnl]

They usually soak them in some sort of super industrial degreaser but it might be cheaper to just take them out and sand blast them.



Yea I am concerned about that too. I suppose we could also just mask the press in area so everything but that area is powdercoated but that would also cost a few bucks.

-Rich

Rich - Dont you think that removing powder coat from the interior of where the ball joint press jPC is too hard to do, compared to masking before powder coating?

[rbryant]

Rich - Dont you think that removing powder coat from the interior of where the ball joint press jPC is too hard to do, compared to masking before powder coating?

Yes of course that area would never have been coated.

The option I briefly considered was just leaving in the old ball joint and then pressing it out after the coating. That would effectively use the old joint as the mask. The point that the grease inside it might leak out and ruin the coat pretty much kills that idea though.


The plan is to either powdercoat them with the old joint out and the hole masked or not coat them. People will just have to be careful not to chip them up when pressing in the new joints and there will be a small fee for pressing out the old joint.

-Rich

[johnl]

Yes of course that area would never have been coated.

The option I briefly considered was just leaving in the old ball joint and then pressing it out after the coating. That would effectively use the old joint as the mask. The point that the grease inside it might leak out and ruin the coat pretty much kills that idea though.


The plan is to either powdercoat them with the old joint out and the hole masked or not coat them. People will just have to be careful not to chip them up when pressing in the new joints and there will be a small fee for pressing out the old joint.

-Rich

You might consider dumping the powder coating idea - too many complications and keeping track of who wants what combination. Maybe just build em and ship 'em; if buyers want powder coating they can get it done in their home towns.

[rbryant]

You might consider dumping the powder coating idea - too many complications and keeping track of who wants what combination. Maybe just build em and ship 'em; if buyers want powder coating they can get it done in their home towns.

I will check and see about the masking. If have to take the kframes in anyway.

The first 5 will be ready for coating on Monday. I have to get the next 4 dropped off and started next week.

-Rich

[Badger]

maybe Im missing something here....but on something other then a show type car, whats the point exactly of powdercoating anyway?

[87DaytonaPac]

PC is a little tougher than paint. Better chip resistance.

[rbryant]

PC is a little tougher than paint. Better chip resistance.

Paint really doesn't stick well to galvanized parts. PC also holds up better to solvents and if you get a nice smooth gloss type grease doesn't stick to it very well.

Plus I want them to look impressive for people. When something is nice it should look nice and polished;)

-Rich

[rbryant]

I have the first 5 frames in my possession. Of course my AC started getting weaker and weaker while I was out getting them in the Phoenix heat so I need to go and visit AJ to have him recharge it...

The PC price is best if I just get everything done so I am going to press out the old ball joints from the arms that I have. The only thing I really have to figure out now is the swaybar upgrade options and if simply trimming them will work with stock bushings.

I am also working on an adjustable rod end setup for myself so hopefully that will be an option but it will cost little extra. The advantage of the adjustable end links is that each side of the swaybar can be adjusted to help balance the car's weight.

I will contact everyone in the next day or so to confirm powdercoating options and prices. I will also post up some pictures of the raw modified frames.

-Rich

[omni_840]

Cool! looking forward to pics:nod:

[rbryant]

Cool! looking forward to pics:nod:

Sorry I was messing with things last night and didn't get around to downloading things from the camera.

The swaybars will work so that is good news. They do stick out farther into the control arm and I think we should probably still chop the ends off from them to avoid any chances of them binding though but that isn't too big of a deal on a chop saw.

I will post the picture tonight.

-Rich

[rbryant]

Here is a picture of the kframe with the unmodified control arms installed.

They are a little tight so I will probably shorten them a bit if I can easily cut them but they can be used as is.

24011
24012

The portions that are shiny were originally where the bushings were on the non modified frames. They now stick out about 3/4" past them and clear the control arm by about 1/4"

I test fit the frame it self and I want to make an adjustment to them before sending them to powdercoat.

I am going to be out of town and have limited internet access from tonight until next Wednesday morning. I expect things to continue to progress while I am gone but nothing is going to be ready to ship until after Aug 1st from the looks of things.

-Rich

[johnl]

:nod::thumb::)

[2.216VTurbo]

Nice:thumb:

[omni_840]

:nod::thumb::)


Nice:thumb:


Agreed

[rbryant]

I have finalized my swaybar plans.

The upgrades would be $125 extra and include a rod end endlink connection from the control arm to the swaybars. The swaybars are 1 1/8" OD so they are larger than the stock lbody bars.

The rod end allows the swaybar to pivot without binding and eliminates the squish of the outside bushings.


This is done by adding a threaded connection to the end of the bar for a male shank left hand threaded rod end. A right hand threaded connection is then added to the swaybar and an aluminum tube is used to connect them.

A further added bonus is that it adds the ability to adjust the loading of the swaybar from driver to passenger side up to 1" of additional loding. Forget about the days of adding shims to the bushings this allows precise adjustment! Because the threaded connections are opposite from each other turning the threaded connecting tube changes the distance between the control arm and the swaybar!

This is a far better option than using the stock end bushings.

If someone wants a bigger bar I also have a 1 1/4" bar available that I got from Johnny a few years back.

The first bar should be done with the rest of the frames by mid next week. Then it is time to talk about the dreaded final payments and shipping....

If there is interest I can also consider making the upgraded swaybars for non lbodys.

-Rich

[omni_840]

Rich, Thanks for the update!

[GLHNSLHT2]

by adding the rod end and allowing the sway bar to move freely you won't have to preload the bar from side to side. It'll produce Posi like burnouts at will.

[rbryant]

Rich, Thanks for the update!

No problem.

I got hit for a 50% increase on the original estimate and things are dragging out a bit... In reality the frames should really be $300 rather than $225 based on the increase from the welding shop.

I am trying to add extras to try and actually come out a little better on this instead of increasing the price that I quoted....

Anyway hopefully people will buy the swaybar upgrades to really complete the upgrade. :)

-Rich

[rbryant]

by adding the rod end and allowing the sway bar to move freely you won't have to preload the bar from side to side. It'll produce Posi like burnouts at will.

Probably true but it is nice to be able to adjust the corner weights of the car.

Either way I think it should be a nice upgrade.

-Rich

[Badger]

wow......that is trick! Im down!

[zin]

ALRIGHT ALREADY!! I'm in like, uh, Flynn... Just let me know how much and where to send it!

Mike

[Shadow]

No problem.

I got hit for a 50% increase on the original estimate and things are dragging out a bit... In reality the frames should really be $300 rather than $225 based on the increase from the welding shop.

I am trying to add extras to try and actually come out a little better on this instead of increasing the price that I quoted....

Anyway hopefully people will buy the swaybar upgrades to really complete the upgrade. :)

-Rich


Great work on these Rich, Hell of an effort to make these for what your charging!

I know what it takes to put stuff like this together and (other than cars that are being built in the shop) I can't find a way to justify the time. Bottom line is I just don't have the time!

Just glad to see someone willing to step up and make things like this happen. Hopefully everyone continues to work with you to make sure that your not "eating your shirt" when the dust settles! :thumb:

[rbryant]

ALRIGHT ALREADY!! I'm in like, uh, Flynn... Just let me know how much and where to send it!

Mike

As of now you are on the next run. I need to get a couple more cores in order to build a few more. I have 2 people on the outside of the first set so I will try to get them in but it might be a few weeks after the first run.

-Rich

[rbryant]

Great work on these Rich, Hell of an effort to make these for what your charging!

I know what it takes to put stuff like this together and (other than cars that are being built in the shop) I can't find a way to justify the time. Bottom line is I just don't have the time!

Just glad to see someone willing to step up and make things like this happen. Hopefully everyone continues to work with you to make sure that your not "eating your shirt" when the dust settles! :thumb:

Thanks man.

The dust should settle this week (really!).

My time is also limited so it has delayed things a bit but in the end things will be as they should be and everyone will get the best product I can make.

-Rich

[zin]

As of now you are on the next run. I need to get a couple more cores in order to build a few more. I have 2 people on the outside of the first set so I will try to get them in but it might be a few weeks after the first run.

-Rich

Beggars (and hesitators) cannot be choosers... I'll wait patiently...:(

Mike

[rbryant]

All,

I just sent some PMs to people that sent in their deposits.

I need to know who wants the rod end swaybars.

I believe that it is a very nice upgrade.

These are modified GJKHP body 1" bars. I believe that 1" is large enough for an lbody unless you have a VERY stiff rear suspension or very light front springs.

I do also have a custom 1 1/4" bar that Johnny made for me a few years back that we can modify for an additional $100 (making it $225). Or I can provide that bar with traditional poly bushing end links for $150. The reason I am not using the poly bushings bar it is because I now have much stiffer front springs and I don't feel it is needed. If you are interested in the larger bar PM me and we can discuss it.

-Rich

[rbryant]

Quick Update...

The stamped arm factory swaybars are only 1' rather than 1 1/8" :(



The cast arm bars are 1 1/8" but they don't fit quite right into the stamped arms.

So... The rod end bars will only be 1" bars like the factory turbo lbody bars.

This might be debatable but with stiffer than factory springs the 1" bar is probably best. With the decreased bind from the rod end they will probably be more effective than stock anyway. That combined with stiffer springs should work very well. Going stiffer will just increase the understeer of the car unless something drastic is done in the rear.


At any rate... If you had your heart set on a larger bar and don't want the 1" bar let me know. Or if you have a shelby daytona 1 1/4" bar that you want to send to me to modify I can do that instead but I just don't have any of those...

Otherwise I am sure that Johnny can make some custom bars up. I can even work with him to get them with the endlink kit but that will be a lot more expensive than using the stock bars..

-Rich

[rbryant]

The Good News:

The frames and swaybars are all done (well sort of).

The Bad News:

There was a failure in relaying information on a change to the rod ends so the swaybars will be too long and more will have to be done.


The Possible Good News:

I probably now have some rod end swaybars that will work on non lbodies... The bars are going to be too long for the modified frames but I think it might just work out for using them on the GJKHP cars so that they aren't a waste.

-Rich

[rampage]

how are these things coming along? i can't wait to get mine :bounce2:!

[rbryant]

Sorry guys I haven't updated in a while.

I need to work out the final costs. Unfortunately I have to add $40 to the welding costs. That was my actual cost increase. I was going to eat the cost but several people convinced me that it was a group buy and that is just want it costs.

That means the Frame welding is actually $265. Hopefully people won't have any major objections. This took more work than we expected.

I will break everything down shortly.

I also need people to sign a "Don't sue me" waiver. These were the result of a lot of people talking about them years ago and I have used one successfully on my car. The disclaimer is not related to the product its self but is just to cover my butt incase someone installs one improperly, gets into an accident with one, etc. The frames are a race part and have been modified so there is no claim that they will have the same crumple zones, etc as the stock frame. I haven't crash tested one, etc so you are putting a modified product on the car and have to understand that.

My wife would simply kill me if I end up losing our house over these so I need a disclaimer. I have talked to several of you about this already and I think there is an understanding that using these means you accept full responsibility of the install and operation of a vehicle that has a custom frame on it.

I need to start contacting people about paying the remaining balances because they should be ready to deliver/ship by next week.


I actually dropped 9 frames off at the powdercoat shop today.

Here is a stack of frames going for powdercoating:

9 of them (I have 2 more being welded and the original that isn't in this pile)!

25459

Here is a picture of the end link setup:

25457

Sorry they are just phone pictures.

-Rich

[cordes]

Forget the disclaimer and go LLC if you haven't already. If Bob installs one and hits Billy and kills him, Billy's mom could sue you just the same as Bob or Bob's wife could. I'm sure you are aware of this, but I thought I would throw it out there.

[rbryant]

Forget the disclaimer and go LLC if you haven't already. If Bob installs one and hits Billy and kills him, Billy's mom could sue you just the same as Bob or Bob's wife could. I'm sure you are aware of this, but I thought I would throw it out there.

Even with an LLC there is still some liability.

The scenario I am looking for is one where the design belongs to the group and anyone is allowed to make it. Bob agrees that the design is common knowledge and requests that it be made. He understands what is done to the frame and that he is responsible for putting it on his car and signs off that he takes full legal responsibility for installing it. I am simply building what he requested.

Afterall the design was made public years ago and I don't own the rights on it or anything. I really don't care who makes these but because I have done it before several people asked me to do it rather than do it themselves.


The thing about this is that it is still a hobby for me and not something that I want to have a ton of expenses, insurance, etc on but I see your point.

-Rich

[cordes]

Even with an LLC there is still some liability.

The scenario I am looking for is one where the design belongs to the group and anyone is allowed to make it. Bob agrees that the design is common knowledge and requests that it be made. He understands what is done to the frame and that he is responsible for putting it on his car and signs off that he takes full legal responsibility for installing it. I am simply building what he requested.

Afterall the design was made public years ago and I don't own the rights on it or anything. I really don't care who makes these but because I have done it before several people asked me to do it rather than do it themselves.


The thing about this is that it is still a hobby for me and not something that I want to have a ton of expenses, insurance, etc on but I see your point.

-Rich

You are correct. There is still a significant liability issue with an LLC. You won't ever be able to avoid all liability so long as lawyers roam the earth. My LLC suggestion was in response to your losing the home comment. At least the LLC would protect your personal stuff.

If you have a small operation the LLC would be hardly worth it for someone to go after. So long as you aren't being criminally negligent etc. you should be fine.

[rbryant]

I just got a call from the powdercoat shop.

They said that things are ready for pickup.

Apparently they were able to all 9 frames with less than 24hr turn around time! I will arrange to pick them up tomorrow.

-Rich

[rampage]

sweet! send final pricing including shipping ASAP :clap2:.

[rbryant]

Ok I need to pick them up and today isn't looking good (day job and all).

It will be Monday before I can get to them because they aren't open on the weekends.

I also want to make sure we can have time to pick them up carefully and not ding up the powdercoat (that will be the purchaser's job). Throwing 9 frames in the back of my Cherokee might be too tight of a fit to avoid dings so I don't want to do it that way..

I will probably send everyone invoices or make it such that 2-3 things have to be added to the cart given the different shipping options, etc.

-Rich

[rbryant]

All,

Here are some final payment buttons: http://rbryant.freeshell.org/kframe_buy.htm

I don't have the frames back from powdercoating to take pictures or calculate real shipping amounts yet so the shipping button is disabled. I will take care of that early next week.

I have a deposit payment button but if you have already paid the deposit just skip that step.

The remaining button is for the rest of the cost (Welding, Core, Labor (getting and disassembling the cores), Powdercoating, etc)

If you paid more than the $150 I will refund you the extra money you paid (it is easier to do that than it is to have 20 different payment buttons).



Please pay ASAP if you are expecting delivery to SoCal. There is no need to wait for a shipping amount so I am ready for your payment and I have to pay the powder coating bill on Monday!

I added an additional button to select to make sure you are included in the delivery next week. Vic is headed that way and has agreed to deliver your kframes.

Please work with him to arrange terms (Beer, Gas Money, Tips, etc) He is saving you a lot of money on shipping so please take care of him for me. :)

-Rich

[2.216VTurbo]

Vic is the Man!:amen: First he rescues lost Masi 16V motors from accross the country then he delivers K frames for beer money:clap:

[rbryant]

Vic is the Man!:amen: First he rescues lost Masi 16V motors from accross the country then he delivers K frames for beer money:clap:

Agreed. :clap:

Also give Vic some props on pulling the frames. He got 4 frames two different junkyard trips in 110 degree heat for only $30 a frame... He then pressed out all of the bushings and ball joints for $20 a set...

In comparison to him getting 8 frames: I went out to a yard and got 2 frames one day in 110 degree heat and thought I was going to die.


I know the costs have added up but these really have been a lot of work behind the scenes to get a nice finished product.

-Rich

[2.216VTurbo]

Paid. See ya next week Vic. Thanks Rich...

[rampage]

do i want stamped or cast arms? this is going on my rampage, later i will add camber plates and a coilover setup if that makes a difference. thanks

[rbryant]

do i want stamped or cast arms? this is going on my rampage, later i will add camber plates and a coilover setup if that makes a difference. thanks

If you are running shelby charger style ground effects then you probably want the stamped arms so you have more clearance on the tires.

The cast arms move the wheel forward about 1/2" and add 1 degree or so of positive caster (which is normally good). The problem is that it puts a 205/50/15 tire within about 1/8" of the ground effects on turns.

The Cast also provides a slightly smoother ride because they don't deflect at all and transfer the energy directly into the bushings on the frame which absorbs the bumps more cleanly. That is why the heavy cars got the cast arms (second hand info from a friend of the designer of the cast arms).

If you go with the camber plates and coilovers the caster isn't a big deal because you can get most of it in the plates which makes the lighter stamped arms a good option (and what I am running on my 87 GLHS).


I think that some people that are putting these on Omnis or on Charger/Rampages that don't use the ground effects might actually want the cast arms for the extra caster. I would run them if they didn't hit my ground effects.

After you go coilover the strut/spring assembly is so much lighter than stock that 2lbs isn't a big deal and the extra stiffness of the arm is a good thing. The cast arms are actually cast steel and they are incredibly strong.

If you are running the charger ground effects or want to make things as light as possible then the stamped arms are what you want.

Of course some people really want to max out caster so the extra 1 degree from the cast arms helps.


Bottom Line suggestions on control arm type:

Cast Advantages:

Better Ride
Stronger
More Caster
Very easy to find (more than 5 times more cars used these)

Cast Disadvantages:

Wheel clearance is VERY tight on shelby charger ground effects
Heavier


Stamped Advantages:

Lighter
No wheel clearance issues.


Stamped Disadvantages:

Much harder to find... (Vic found a bunch but they aren't unlimited)
Theoretically a Worse ride over bumps (probably not big deal on the lighter lbody)
Less Caster.


If you can handle the tires moving forward about 1/2" without clearance issues then I would go with the cast arms otherwise use stamped ones.

If you NEED stamped arms please pay quickly I have 7 pairs of stamped arms and 3 pairs of cast arms. Hopefully this will match demand.

The fairest way on these is to reserve stamped arms is for the people that paid early deposits get first shot. The next priority will be people that pay in full first (but it shouldn't come to that).

The 7:3 ratio should allow everyone to get what they want.

-Rich

[rampage]

sent payment yesterday.....now lets see if i can afford the shipping :D

[rbryant]

sent payment yesterday.....now lets see if i can afford the shipping :D

I will do what I can to keep the price down.

If anyone is going from Phoenix to Houston in the near future that would be better than shipping them.

It is pretty hard to find people to deliver things that far who have that much spare room. The SoCal people are really lucking out that Vic will be going that way with a truck that can carry a bunch of them.

-Rich

[DOHCRT]

FYI...I'm also heading to SLC and Vegas during this run...

Vic in Phoenix

[rbryant]

FYI...I'm also heading to SLC and Vegas during this run...

Vic in Phoenix

Orders are in the following locations (unless someone's address needs to be updated in paypal or in their profile):

Phoenix
SoCal
West Virginia
Washington State
BC Canada
Wyoming
Houston
Indiana?


iTurbo in Wyoming is probably the closest but he is still 500 miles away from the looks of things Unless we can relay it via someone that happens to be going from SLC to NE Wyoming...

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Payment sent. Stamped arms & 1 inch swaybar.

--Paul

[rbryant]

Payment sent. Stamped arms & 1 inch swaybar.

--Paul

Awesome. We are picking them up tomorrow and I will get the shipping amount in a day or two (as long as I can find boxes to fit things).

I should be able to ship by the end of the week.

-Rich

[rbryant]

Here is a teaser pic from Vic of the frames arriving at his place from powdercoat.

25576

Perhaps later he will unwrap them a little further...

-Rich

[rampage]

can't wait to get this on the car! along with the other suspension upgrades :eyebrows:

[rbryant]

Quick update on shipping... I got tied up this weekend and I haven't been able to get them packaged up but that isn't the real problem...

Four of the frames that came back from powdercoating will need to be changed slightly so I can't ship them until next week. It is an unfortunate setback but they need to be right before I can ship them.

Apparently the welder forgot to do something on 4 of them so I need to get them fixed before I can ship them. I was assured that they were all the same but Vic and I discovered that these have an issue. So we will need to do some more welding and will have to re-coat the area that is changed (in reality that probably means the whole frame).

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Rich, if you're gonna recoat the entire frame because of some welds, why not optionally knock the cost of the recoat (or some portion thereof) off of shipping? Personally, I build my cars to be DDs so show car quality isn't a big priority. I'd rather save a few dollars on shipping.

[rbryant]

Rich, if you're gonna recoat the entire frame because of some welds, why not optionally knock the cost of the recoat (or some portion thereof) off of shipping? Personally, I build my cars to be DDs so show car quality isn't a big priority. I'd rather save a few dollars on shipping.

That is something that I am considering. I could just rattle can the small portion that needs to change. It is on the passenger front tower where it would be very hard to see anyway.

They didn't push back the inside enough such that the bolt can be flat. I think I can probably match it well enough with paint so that nobody can tell.

Let me see what it would actually cost to fix the powdercoat first.

-Rich

[turbovanman²]

Damn Rich, great job, :hail::thumb:

[iTurbo]

Hi Rich, I'm buying a Shelby Lancer rear axle from Vic, as well as the dual pivot L-body stuff from you. Is there any chance that could get in on the powder coating?

I could possibly go to SLC to pick everything up, but getting time off from work may be impossible.

[rbryant]

Hi Rich, I'm buying a Shelby Lancer rear axle from Vic, as well as the dual pivot L-body stuff from you. Is there any chance that could get in on the powder coating?

I could possibly go to SLC to pick everything up, but getting time off from work may be impossible.

If the timing works out then I can put the rear axle through. It will probably be around the same $100 to do it. I am not sure how you planned on getting the rear axle delivered or when so we will just have to work out details.

I think the SLC trip was a one time thing so we would probably have to ship them.

-Rich

[iTurbo]

That's cool, I'd really just rather pay the shipping or freight than make another trip. $100 for the rear axle powder coat sounds fine; if you could get it in that would be great, thanks.

[iTurbo]

Just paid the remaining balance on my L-body stuff btw. Cast arms and 1 1/8 bar here.

[rbryant]

That's cool, I'd really just rather pay the shipping or freight than make another trip. $100 for the rear axle powder coat sounds fine; if you could get it in that would be great, thanks.

I am guessing a little on the $100 but it should be within 25% of that guess. :)

-Rich

[rampage]

The tm gods must not want me to get one of these things in my hands. The more I want one longer it takes to get it done, lol.

[rbryant]

The tm gods must not want me to get one of these things in my hands. The more I want one longer it takes to get it done, lol.

Sorry dude.

The passenger front mount bottom that has to be modified wasn't flat on a bunch of them. They just wouldn't fit correctly that way. The welder knew it was wrong when he saw it.

They are back at the welders and should be ready in a few days.

I will figure out the shipping this weekend aswell so they should be on their way soon.

-Rich

[rampage]

its cool, i'm not upset or anything. i understand stuff like this happens when dealing with things of this nature. i'm just eager to get this thing on the car :D.

[rbryant]

Ok guys here is a shipping estimates using USPS parcel post which seems cheaper than Fedex and UPS.....


Putting everything in one box would make the package over the weight limits of both USPS and Fedex.

I believe that putting in the control arms with the frame might save $10 but I am not sure I can find boxes that can hold them without splitting the box and making it an odd shape... The boxes would also have weird stress points compared to wrapping the frames tightly so I don't want to do it that way (it just won't be secure).


The frame by its self is $40 insured.

The swaybars are $20.

A pair of control arms is $20


So that would make it $78 shipped with insurance.


-Rich

[rbryant]

All,

Sorry for the last round of delays in getting these shipped...

The mistake frames are done being re-welded.

The only thing left is to do the swaybar mods for the cast arm people.

--Question--

How many of you would like a frame that is coated but had to be re-welded on the passenger front tower? I can offer those for $30 off shipping and if you rattle can that area with some satin black it should look just fine and it is unlikely that anyone can tell given the location of the fix. I don't like things that aren't as pretty as they could be but I also like to give breaks when I can...


87DaytonaPac appears to have requested/claimed one of them....

I have 2 left that way so first come first serve.

I can ship those on Monday.

The rest will take an extra few days to get back from coating.

-Rich

[rbryant]

I keep forgetting to offer this up....

I have a 1.25" swaybar that I had made for use with an lbody with Cast dual pivot arms. I don't need it now because I am running stiffer coilover springs and the smaller bar is a better balance for me and I switched to stamped arms so it doesn't fit anyway...


It is setup for regular end links instead of rod ends. They normally run $199 from Johnny but I would let it go for $150 which is only $25 more expensive than the rod end mods.

It is for cast arms and will only work on an lbody because the center section is shorter than the other cars.

If someone wants that bar modified with rod ends I can also do it but it would be $250.

Just send me a PM to claim it if you want it!

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Rich, you are correct, I'll take a re-welded frame and take the break on shipping. Has shipping cost been finalized? Are you ready to take payment?

[rbryant]

Rich, you are correct, I'll take a re-welded frame and take the break on shipping. Has shipping cost been finalized? Are you ready to take payment?

Yes I just put a button on the page.

The total cost is 80. I had 78 previously but I added $2 to help cover paypal and make it a round number.


Right now there is a drop down for the $30 discount option for blemished powdercoating. It will be on a first come first serve basis until the blems are gone or people don't want them and I get them re-coated. With this discount shipping is only $50.

If you take a Blemished one and people notice the imperfection please explain that you choose to take the frame that way for a discount and that I was going to fix it otherwise. :)

I should be able to ship the Blems on Monday and the others by the next weekend.


http://rbryant.freeshell.org/kframe_buy.htm

-Rich

[iTurbo]

Awesome Rich can't wait to see the finished product! I can't help but think that the 1.25" bar you mentioned might be for me since I got the cast arm option and my car already has the PB rear bar as well as front/rear strut tower bars. I do still have stock springs with KYB GR2 struts and KYB GAJ in the back. Your thoughts? I want to stay away from going with a coil-over setup on the car unless absolutely necessary.

I will also send Vic a PM about the rear axle shortly.

[rbryant]

Awesome Rich can't wait to see the finished product! I can't help but think that the 1.25" bar you mentioned might be for me since I got the cast arm option and my car already has the PB rear bar as well as front/rear strut tower bars. I do still have stock springs with KYB GR2 struts and KYB GAJ in the back. Your thoughts? I want to stay away from going with a coil-over setup on the car unless absolutely necessary.

I will also send Vic a PM about the rear axle shortly.

Just let me know quickly about the bar. Vic is drilling the cast arms for bushings tonight and the 1.25" bar would put things in a different place.

KYBs GR2s are not a performance shock/strut. With that said they are an ok stock replacement. If you have stock springs then the bigger bar will probably help. I have a set of Stock GLHS Konis with springs that we can talk about if you want to got that way.... I think I even have the receipt to get the fronts rebuilt but don't have a receipt for the rears....

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Shipping payment sent!

[iTurbo]

I'll go ahead and take the 1.25" bar Rich. Not sure whe I can afford the GLHS springs and Konis but I'll send you a PM.

[rbryant]

I'll go ahead and take the 1.25" bar Rich. Not sure whe I can afford the GLHS springs and Konis but I'll send you a PM.

Ok the Big bar is yours. :)

-Rich

[iTurbo]

Ok the Big bar is yours. :)

-Rich

Right on, I paid shipping and also added a couple sets of the Hawk HPS pads. Looks like I still owe you $25 for the big bar, is that right? Should I just send it to the same Paypal address?

[rbryant]

Right on, I paid shipping and also added a couple sets of the Hawk HPS pads. Looks like I still owe you $25 for the big bar, is that right? Should I just send it to the same Paypal address?

Yes that is fine, just send it to the same address.

-Rich

[87DaytonaPac]

Rich, do you know when you'll be shipping the frames out?

[rbryant]

Rich, do you know when you'll be shipping the frames out?

Tomorrow for the people like you that took the blemished discount.

The rest go to powdercoat tomorrow.

-Rich

[rbryant]

All,

Please note that these are setup for a 520/555/523/568 transmission bracket.

I just got a bad feeling that someone might have missed post #102 of the thread and is expecting it to be in the 525 position...

I really feel that everyone who is doing this modification should have an upgraded transmission long before going to this level so they were all made with the newer transmission mount....

I wouldn't want to ship a frame out and have someone try to connect it to their 525 only to get upset when the mount is in the wrong place...

Please let me know if you ordered one and are expecting to use it with a 525 for some reason... Hopefully I can talk you into upgrading to a real transmission. ;)

-Rich

[rbryant]

The remaining frames and swaybars go out with the mail tomorrow. I averaged just over a roll of tape for each frame (my wife says I use way too much tape when I pack things).... It just goes to show that anything can be shipped if you are willing to use enough tape! It also helps that the USPS doesn't have "regular package shape" requirements.

Of all things to run out of It looks like I don't have enough end link bolts so I have to order more of those before I can send out the control arms and endlinks.

So unfortunately the control arms and end links will be delayed a few days but the actual frames are on their way!

-Rich

[rbryant]

Just a note that I went to install my swaybar bushings last night for stamped arms and the bar was actually 1 1/16....

I guess when we measured them as 1" it wasn't with a good enough caliper...

Make sure to measure your bar just to be sure before installing the inner bushings!

-Rich

[iTurbo]

I got my k-frame today, looks awesome!! Thanks for making these Rich:thumb:

[rbryant]

I got my k-frame today, looks awesome!! Thanks for making these Rich:thumb:

No problem. That is actually quick shipping considering that I sent them parcel post on Monday and you aren't exactly in a hub city.


The swaybar should have arrived with it but the control arms were delayed a little... The control arms and end links will probably get there early next week.

It would be great if people posted some pictures. Customer pictures are worth more than vendor pictures because they show the real product as delivered.


-Rich

[rx2mazda]

Sweet. how much do these run and whats the availability? Maybe update the first post with pics and pricing.

[iTurbo]

I would love to post pics but I haven't had a real computer since my monitor broke last June. Lately the only way I can access the internet is by borrowing my brothers iPod Touch and tapping in on an unsecured wifi router somewhere in my apartment building so I haven't been able to post much at all lately.

[omni_840]

Got mine the other day as well, and of looks awesome! I'll post some pics this evening.

Again thanks Rich for raising the bar with your product offerings:)

[rbryant]

Got mine the other day as well, and of looks awesome! I'll post some pics this evening.

Again thanks Rich for raising the bar with your product offerings:)

Glad to hear that you are happy aswell.

Just note in your pictures that yours was discounted due to blemish in the powdercoat. It was unfortunate that it had to be modified after powdercoat but I was happy to give you a discount and let you paint that spot rather than running it through again.

I probably should have rattle can painted it for you but I didn't have paint at the time and I wanted to get it to you as quickly as I could.

-Rich

[rbryant]

Sweet. how much do these run and whats the availability? Maybe update the first post with pics and pricing.

Ok. The price is $40 higher for doing 1-2 at a time and because I now know exactly what it takes to build and ship these things and it takes a lot of running around.

Pricing for additional frames is:

Kframe and Control Arms:
$520 (300 for welding, 70 core, 50 disassembly, 100 powdercoating) for the frame plus $60 shipping = $580.

Swaybar Modifications:
$130 for an rod end link swaybar modificatoin plus $20 shipping = $150.

All components come powdercoated semigloss black.


Turnaround time will be 2-3 weeks for new orders.

They can be ordered here: http://rbryant.freeshell.org/kframe_buy.htm


-Rich

[omni_840]

Here are some pics of the Kframe, Sorry for the poor quality these were taken on my EVO.

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/omni_840/IMAG0168.jpg
http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/omni_840/IMAG0169.jpg
http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/omni_840/IMAG0165.jpg
http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/omni_840/IMAG0167.jpg

[rbryant]

Here are some pics of the Kframe, Sorry for the poor quality these were taken on my EVO.

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/omni_840/IMAG0168.jpg
http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/omni_840/IMAG0169.jpg


Note that the uncoated portion was discounted instead of sending it back through to recoat it after it had to be modified with the understanding that the portion would be painted. It was a screw up by the fabricator that fortunately was caught before it was sent, but unfortunately required messing up the powdercoat.

This shows why they are coated. Weld almost instantly rusts if it isn't painted or powdercoated!

-Rich

[iTurbo]

Got the control arms today and they look great! I think I have everything but the sway bar. Should it have arrived on the same day as the K-frame?

The powder coated finish looks great and good coverage on the recessed areas on the K-frame.

[rbryant]

Got the control arms today and they look great! I think I have everything but the sway bar. Should it have arrived on the same day as the K-frame?

The powder coated finish looks great and good coverage on the recessed areas on the K-frame.

I am pretty sure that the bar was sent at the same time as the kframe. It probably just got hung up somewhere given its odd shape.

Hopefully the swaybar didn't get lost because I think I forgot to insure it... That was dumb of me... :(

I do have a delivery confirmation on it with some tracking numbers so they should find it.

-Rich

[rbryant]

Here are the pictures I took before shipping them.

Full View:
26501

Bottom Side Showing reinforcement strip:
26504

Transmission Mount and top center welding:
26502

Modified Passenger Tower:
26503


Notice that it is factory seam welded. The dual pivot frames were so much stronger than the early frames. There is a good top and bottom shot of the center weld and reinforcing strip. The center point where it was cut was reinforced specifically so that there are no strength concerns.

-Rich


-

[Shadow]

Here are the pictures I took before shipping them.

Full View:
26501

Bottom Side Showing reinforcement strip:
26504

Transmission Mount and top center welding:
26502

Modified Passenger Tower:
26503


Notice that it is factory seam welded. The dual pivot frames were so much stronger than the early frames. There is a good top and bottom shot of the center weld and reinforcing strip. The center point where it was cut was reinforced specifically so that there are no strength concerns.

-Rich


-

Rich, on the last pic, what is the purpose of the "overhang" of metal on the modded pass front mount?

[rbryant]

Rich, on the last pic, what is the purpose of the "overhang" of metal on the modded pass front mount?

It adds a little more strength from where material was removed and adds back a flat mounting point that isn't there otherwise after the hole is moved inward. It probably could be a little shorter.

The hole starts out too far outward on the non lbody frame and is pushed in on the bottom side and a new hole is made. After that is done there is not a flat surface (or enough strength) so an extension is added.

On any future ones I think we are going to cut that tower off completely slide it in and re-weld it on. The fabricator kept having issues with that point because different frames are different.

Some frames actually start with a flat portion of the tower than extends farther inward than others. The redos that I had were because of that difference.

-Rich

[Shadow]

It adds a little more strength from where material was removed and adds back a flat mounting point that isn't there otherwise after the hole is moved inward. It probably could be a little shorter.

The hole starts out too far outward on the non lbody frame and is pushed in on the bottom side and a new hole is made. After that is done there is not a flat surface (or enough strength) so an extension is added.

On any future ones I think we are going to cut that tower off completely slide it in and re-weld it on. The fabricator kept having issues with that point because different frames are different.

Some frames actually start with a flat portion of the tower than extends farther inward than others. The redos that I had were because of that difference.

-Rich

Interesting, the ones I've modded must be the latter with the extra material inward. I always ended up with a nice flat surface that was a perfect match to the frame mount.

Although, I've only built a few of these so guess I just got lucky or it's a Canadian thing! :D

[iTurbo]

I am pretty sure that the bar was sent at the same time as the kframe. It probably just got hung up somewhere given its odd shape.

Hopefully the swaybar didn't get lost because I think I forgot to insure it... That was dumb of me... :(

I do have a delivery confirmation on it with some tracking numbers so they should find it.

-Rich

Hi Rich, I got the bar last week; just haven't been on the 'net much lately. Looks great though, thanks!!!